Look I've got no problem with the act of eating meat nor do I have an issue with anybody who DOESN'T know what actually goes on behind closed doors, whether that be the factory farm it came from or the slaughter house it was killed at...

Look there are and will be more alternatives to traditional meats - whether that be plant based pork, chicken, beef or tuna/fish.. give it 10 years and the general public will be eating them, more and more..

Who here would be more than willing to have a meat and dairy tax and have that "tax" money re-invested into subsizing fruits, vegetables and products like plant-based milks etc etc?

IMHO it would mean less meat being purchased, plant based milks over cow's milk and people more willing to try tofu over say pork lol...... not to mention more fruit and veg bought...

I'm just curious if the meat eaters on here, would complain or veiw it as a positive move?

EDIT: don't forget the US government subsidizes meat and dairy atm.... they spend $38 billion each year to subsidize meat and dairy... farmer growing fruit and vegetables get nothing in comparison.

I think you misinterpreted the question. It's actually designed to be in favour of animal rights arguments. The idea behind it is to burden a meat eater with a task to find something true of animals that's not true for humans that makes the distinction between killable/non-killable make sense.

It rules out things like pain, suffering, rudimentary self awareness, tool use etc. when applied to all animals. So the meat eater has to go on a case by case basis, which already plays into the animal rights activist's hands. — fdrake

Yep I think I might of misunderstood what you said :)

Environmental effects of eating meat:

https://www.sciencemagazinedigital.org/sciencemagazine/20_july_2018/MobilePagedArticle.action?articleId=1411113&app=false#articleId1411113

I believe most people's gripe is with the meat industry, rather than the act of eating meat. — Tzeentch

I agree with you.. but it's like any business- it's supply vs demand.. I mean obviously the meat industry is here to make money, if there was no demand for meat - there would be no meat industry.

Eating meat is no worse than eating vegetables. One is eating living, growing things and, sadly, that is a requirement for survival. Only by prejudice do we value animal life over plant life. There's absolutely no merit to the idea that vegetarianism or veganism is in any way "better". — Tzeentch

The animals that are eaten, are fed plants and lots of them.. half the world's plant crops are eaten by the animals that are fattened up to eat.. anyways we gotta eat something... whether that is meat or vegetables.

In terms of change, what I think we needs to be done (regardless of whether agricultural processes get more efficient over time etc etc..) is have a meat tax and subsidise fruit 'n' vegetable.. now I understand that some people won't like that but if it reduces the amount of meat people eat and increases the amount of fruit and veg people consume on a day-to-day basis..

Not to mention that hungry Jack's and McDonald's will have to charge more money ... people will eat less meat, buy less fast food and consume more fruit 'n' veg... people will cook at home more and for any ethical vegans out there.. less animals will be killed, a lot less .... Imho that needs to be done!

EDIT: anyways the US government subsidizes meat and dairy, yearly they spend $38 billion each year to subsidize meat and dairy... farmer growing fruit and vegetables get nothing in comparison

All of this logic applies to all life, including plants and single celled organisms. I am not saying the whole idea is wrong, but this single point does not say much. — ZhouBoTong

I suppose I draw the line at an animal being alive and conscious, you cannot reasonably believed that a plant is conscious even if it felt pain, the plant it's not fundamentally conscious... dairy cows and egg laying chickens, about lives shortened dramatically...

Ohhhh half of the beef mince you get at McDonald's, is from dairy cows.. so it using animals, whether that be from milk or eggs - can do more harm than you think.

It seems that killing a plant can be viewed as equally bad to killing an animal (logically anyway), but we need to know more about how pain is experienced to make comparisons of suffering across species. — ZhouBoTong

You do have a point but animals eat plants themselves, why not just directly eat the plants.. I mean we know that animals feel pain... a line needs to be drawn, killing a pig so you have something to eat, it's not the same as killing an insect... fundamentally it's the same, a life is a life is the life..

It's not practical to not kill any animals, as I said a line has to be drawn.. some vegans eat oysters, their justification is that they don't feel pain.. I don't myself but I can see the thinking behind it..

The cognitive dissonance lies in expressing love which I take to be a caring attitude towards life, at the same time killing and consuming animals which is obviously the contradiction of love. — TheMadFool

Correct.

I’d prefer to kill the animals I eat personally. I do find it perverse that many want to distance themselves from the thought of eating animals that have been killed. If your moral disposition toward killing animals to eat repulses you, yet you’re perfectly willing to eat meat sold in the market I’d say you’re a bit of a hypocrite — I like sushi

This I agree with, 100% but unfortunately most people do not want to admit this.. I don't really agree with hunting - securing your own meat but it is the lesser of two evils imho... the eating of meat it's not the problem, just the way we go about making sure it's on the shelf in the supermarket.

Synthetic meats aka lab meat, is the future but I would not be surprised if plant based meat products got more and more popular.. things like beyond meat... but yeh imho there needs to be a meat tax, similar to the heavy tax we put on cigarettes and then subsidize fruit and vegetables... beans etc etc... get buying soy milk and almond milk, instead of cow's milk etc.. that needs to happen.

Causing pain, therefore killing, is immoral. In a very simplistic sense how would you feel if your throat was cut, dying slowly from blood loss, feeling pain up until the end, then cut up into tiny morsels, cooked, served over dinner on a table where the people who're eating you don't even give a second thought about what you were, all the while conversing, cracking jokes, yes jokes, discussing how great you tasted or even that you weren't prepared to someone's liking? — TheMadFool

Not for me that.

We don't know what a good/balanced diet is, nor do we know which foods can provide it and so we suggest a shotgun strategy instead of specific recommendations. However, if my biology is correct, we're designed to eat meat in addition to plants. — TheMadFool

You're right we don't know what a balance diet is but we know what is not healthy and what is.. eating meat is not going to kill you but neither is smoking 2 cigarettes a day.... it's a tricky one, you have to be in a position to reject eating certain foods tho but it's cheaper than eating meat, regardless of what you hear on the news.

What is true of animals but not true of humans that allows us to kill and eat one but not the other? — fdrake

I get what you mean but I suppose it's just a case of trying to justify ones behaviour by the behaviour of animals.. why don't we sniff each other's bums like dogs do when we meet each other or eat our own babies like hippopotamuses do.. there are lots of examples of this, it's called the nature fallacy and is used regularly to justify things, well in this case eating meat.