Oh, quick question NOS: You're a Dumpertrumper and want to get your take on this. He's scheduled to make an announcement today on the controversial acquittal. Why can't he publicly articulate more important/normal things like other controversial political policies and legislation... ? Is he that narcissistic where he consistently shows his need to make himself feel or look good? I mean, he does this all the time...at the veterans hospital where instead of consoling veteran's he talks about crowd size, etc...

Bonus question: was Mitt Romney wrong?

Did you listen to his State of the Union? Or do you just let the anti-Trump media pick and choose what parts they think you should hear? If you don’t need a curator his speeches are public record and available to anyone.

Mitt Romney was wrong, yes.

Yes I did. Are you not able to answer the question? LOL

And thanks...why was he wrong?

Boner question: why did 75% of the general public want witnesses?

Romney was wrong because he falsely believed Trump did something wrong and, in a fit of pious sanctimony, betrayed his president.

Would you want another President to do what your Dumpertrumper did?

Oh, and why did 75% of the general public want witnesses? Are they wrong too?

Would you want another President to do what your Dumpertrumper did?

Oh, and why did 75% of the general public want witnesses? Are they wrong too?

I would want any president to look into corruption, especially when the tax-payer is giving millions in weaponry and aid.

No, the public was not wrong to want witnesses in my opinion. I too wanted witnesses.

pious sanctimony — NOS4A2

Thanks, that made me laugh. The one conservative senator who appears to have upheld conservative values is a fake and a traitor.

No, the public was not wrong to want witnesses in my opinion. I too wanted witnesses. — NOS4A2

So did Romney. ( You're not too consistent there LOL.)

I would want any president to look into corruption, especially when the tax-payer is giving millions in weaponry and aid. — NOS4A2

Yep so would I. Why didn't he go through the Government agencies to investigate and/or hired a personal attorney along with the nefarious bedfellows who where found guilty of campaign violations?

Thanks, that made me laugh. The one conservative senator who appears to have upheld conservative values is a fake and a traitor.

Yes, the Mormon neoconservative. What’s funny is, when hawks like Bolton and Romney virtue-signal their anti-Trumpism you guys lay out the red carpet for them. Odd bedfellows indeed.

Yep so would I. Why didn't he go through the Government agencies to investigate and/or hired a personal attorney along with the nefarious bedfellows who where found guilty of campaign violations?

Guiliani was investigating on his own accord in his capacity as a defense attorney, not at the direction of the president.

I can respect anyone who honors their sworn oaths. I could even respect you for honoring whatever contractual agreement you may have made to troll Americans online.

Guiliani was investigating on his own accord in his capacity as a defense attorney, not at the direction of the president. — NOS4A2

That's not what Sondland and Taylor said. And speaking of lying, was Dumpertrumper lying again when he said he didn't know Parnus, or was the audio tape fake? LOL

Did Mitt use his conscience in voting for impeachment? Please elaborate if you can...or maybe start a new thread and discuss the merits of consciousnessness/conscience and what that means to people LOL.

Boner question: how do you sleep at night LOL

Yeah you guys welcomed all the nevertrump neoconservatives and neoliberals with open arms. Odd bedfellows.

That's not what Sondland and Taylor said. And speaking of lying, was Dumpertrumper lying again when he said he didn't know Parnus, or was the audio tape fake? LOL

Did Mitt use his conscience in voting for impeachment? Please elaborate if you can...or maybe start a new thread and discuss the merits of consciousnessness/conscience and what that means to people LOL.

Boner question: how do you sleep at night LOL

They were wrong. Giuliani started his investigation in Nov. 2018, months before Biden announced his candidacy. The whole impeachment was a hoax and you fell for it. How do you live that down?

If I was to speculate I would argue Mitt was bitter Trump didn’t let him be Secretary of State.

No boner questions, please.

Romney was wrong because he falsely believed Trump did something wrong and, in a fit of pious sanctimony, betrayed his president. — NOS4A2

Falsely believed?

You should at least pretend to exercise objectivity. I gave you good reasons to support the judgment that Trump did wrong, reasons which you could not refute. Regardless of your personal judgment that Trump did "good" (setting aside your poor defense of that judgment), you should at least try to understand that reasonable people could indeed judge that Trump did wrong, and give Romney the benefit of the doubt that his judgment was sincere. For that matter, there were other Republicans who agreed with Romney that Trump did something wrong, they just didn't consider it a "high crime" sufficient for removal.

It's pretty revealing that you refer to "betraying" the President: loyalty to country OUGHT to come before loyalty to party, and loyalty to a person should come dead last. I Romney's case, I take him at his word that HIS first loyalty is to his God, and therefore felt bound by the oath he took. Contrast that "piousness" to Trump's comments at today's prayer breakfast.

Falsely believed?

You should at least pretend to exercise objectivity. I gave you good reasons to support the judgment that Trump did wrong, reasons which you could not refute. Regardless of your personal judgment that Trump did "good" (setting aside your poor defense of that judgment), you should at least try to understand that reasonable people could indeed judge that Trump did wrong, and give Romney the benefit of the doubt that his judgment was sincere. For that matter, there were other Republicans who agreed with Romney that Trump did something wrong, they just didn't consider it a "high crime" sufficient for removal.

It's pretty revealing that you refer to "betraying" the President: loyalty to country OUGHT to come before loyalty to party, and loyalty to a person should come dead last.

I disagree, I do not think you gave good reasons, and in fact gave specious reasons as to why he engaged in wrong-doing. Worse, like the House managers, it was all premised on fantasy and presumption.

I am giving Romney the benefit of the doubt. That does not excuse him or others for justifying and engaging in a sham, unjust political process against a duly elected president.

It was only until Dumpertrumper found out that Biden was leading in the polls when he decided to withhold funds from Ukraine.

Do you have a conscience?

Yeah you guys welcomed all the nevertrump neoconservatives and neoliberals with open arms. Odd bedfellows. — NOS4A2

I didn’t believe you were Russian troll before but given how long you’ve been doing this and your unwavering consistency I can only conclude that you’re either being paid or are batshit cray cray. You don’t seem crazy though. Your responses feel purposeful and strategic.

I disagree, I do not think you gave good reasons, and in fact gave specious reasons as to why he engaged in wrong-doing. Worse, like the House managers, it was all premised on fantasy and presumption. — NOS4A2

You identified no errors in reasoning nor false assumptions that I'd made. On the other hand, you didn't understand federal government ethics standards and how Trump's behavior violated them. Your judgment seemed rooted in bias against Biden and in favor of Trump, whatever he might do.

I am giving Romney the benefit of the doubt. — NOS4A2

Claiming Romney displayed "pious sanctimony" does not sound like giving him the benefit of the doubt. Romney knew his vote would hurt him politically, and yet he cast it - that's an act of courage that you should applaud, even if you disagree with his judgment.

I didn’t believe you were Russian troll before but given how long you’ve been doing this and your unwavering consistency I can only conclude that you’re either being paid or are batshit cray cray. You don’t seem crazy though. Your responses feel purposeful and strategic.

You wouldn’t be the first.

You identified no errors in reasoning nor false assumptions that I'd made. On the other hand, you didn't understand federal government ethics standards and how Trump's behavior violated them. Your judgment seemed rooted in bias against Biden and in favor of Trump, whatever he might do.

Like I said, your entire argument was premised on the fantasies of the House and the admitted presumptions of one testimony. You didn’t show Trump’s behavior violated “government ethics standards”. You showed how Biden violated them.

Claiming Romney displayed "pious sanctimony" does not sound like giving him the benefit of the doubt. Romney knew his vote would hurt him politically, and yet he cast it - that's an act of courage that you should applaud, even if you disagree with his judgment.

Where was your benefit of the doubt regarding the presumption of innocence? Nowhere to be seen. Double standards are to be expected with someone named “relativist”, but this is hilarious.

What’s funny is, when hawks like Bolton and Romney virtue-signal their anti-Trumpism you guys lay out the red carpet for them. Odd bedfellows indeed. — NOS4A2

You can praise people for doing the right thing even if they've also done wrong things. Just because they're "the opposition" in most cases doesn't mean we have to spin everything they ever do as bad.

That's what Fox News is for.

I’m glad there’s an opposing view from the majority but it would be better if it felt like it was coming from someone who was actually invested and not just going through the tedious motions.

You can praise people for doing the right thing even if they've also done wrong things. Just because they're "the opposition" in most cases doesn't mean we have to spin everything they ever do as bad.

That's what Fox News is for.

My point is they are not being praised for doing the right thing, but for promoting a certain political worldview. At this point it wouldn't matter who voted against Trump, they would be welcomed with open arms.

I’m glad there’s an opposing view from the majority but it would be better if it felt like it was coming from someone who was actually invested and not just going through the tedious motions.

If you need my life story, job details and marital status you can inquire in private.

My point is they are not being praised for doing the right thing — NOS4A2

They are. Having witnesses would have been the right thing. Removing Trump from office would have been the right thing. Informing the public of Trump's wrongdoing would have been the right thing.

At this point it wouldn't matter who voted against Trump, they would be welcomed with open arms.

Yes, because removing Trump would have been the right thing.

They are. Having witnesses would have been the right thing. Removing Trump from office would have been the right thing. Informing the public of Trump's wrongdoing would have been the right thing.

There was 17 witnesses. Removing Trump would have been the wrong thing. Making up stories about wrong-doing is the wrong thing.

Yes, because removing Trump would have been the right thing.

Like I said, promoting a certain worldview, one that has already been roundly rejected.

Like I said, promoting a certain worldview, one that has already been roundly rejected. — NOS4A2

You're the only one uncritically promoting a turd. You forget most of us aren't US citizens and therefore aren't beholden to the "fake news media" Trump decries. It's quite clear what just happened in the US and it's quite clear Trump is a corrupt piece of shit. Your refusal to submit to reason or facts would be funny if it didn't reflect the deep partisanship afflicting the US.

America: The Great Divide

New PBS Frontline documentary on political tribalism in the United States.


https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/americas-great-divide-from-obama-to-trump/

Mitt Romney was wrong, yes. — NOS4A2

Awww. How dare he went against Trump. How dare he!!!

The one conservative senator who appears to have upheld conservative values is a fake and a traitor. — praxis

If upholding past Republican values means going against Trump, that is simply sacrilege!

I would want any president to look into corruption — NOS4A2

..of the other party you don't support, I know. Many Americans are like that.

In this series there are very good interviews. Some also show how empty the people are while others appear very intelligent.

The thing is that the divide will get even more deep.