My point has nothing to do with CNN though. I don't have much time to watch CNN talk about it, and I don't care what they say. I quoted Trump pretty much directly. His opinion is what matters here as well as that of the judge he appoints.

If Roe v Wade is overturned, the rights to abortion will return to states rights and that is one step closer to what the people want. — ArguingWAristotleTiff

? You want it overturned then? What people? About 70% of Americans according to polls want it to stay.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/01/03/about-seven-in-ten-americans-oppose-overturning-roe-v-wade/

I intentionally bolded "legitimization" when I quoted you and I responded withlegalization.
A LOT of ideas are lent legitimization simply by being held by a leader such as the President but that doesn't make it legitimate. President Bush believes in creationism but do you think that because of that perspective, that the USA citizen who believed in evolution up until he took office now believes in creationism as well?
Come on Baden, give the "WE" who make up the USA a little more credit than that. — ArguingWAristotleTiff

It affects the public discourse negatively, Tiff, that's the stain I'm talking about. I don't think it's going to make everyone racist etc. Obviously it's not. But many people who have a racist streak in them feel emboldened more to express it now. They say that themselves in alt-right publications.

And come on Tiff, you just shared a Breitbart article ffs.... — Maw

This Breibart:

"Breitbart News Network... is a far-right syndicated American news, opinion and commentary.. Its journalists are widely considered to be ideologically driven, and some of its content has been called misogynistic, xenophobic, and racist by liberals and many traditional conservatives alike. The site has published a number of falsehoods, conspiracy theories, and intentionally misleading stories."

Far-right racist publications should be out of bounds for quoting in any debate here, Tiff.

(Although Breitbart is admittedly more of a grey area than Der Stürmer etc.).

"Ending Roe v Wade" which is what you stated is the same talking points of CNN and NBC, — ArguingWAristotleTiff

If you don't even know what Trump supports or what he said, you are in no position to argue. What I said is straight from Trump not the CNN/NBC bogeyman.


Wallace: What I am asking you is do you want to see the court overturn Roe v Wade?

Trump: If we put two or three justices on...that will happen, and that will happen automatically because I am putting pro-life justices on the court.

I quoted Trump so if you want to argue, argue with him.

Unless you can provide citation of who said that WE as a nation are going to legalize sexism, racism and anti-Semitism, it is all speculation. — ArguingWAristotleTiff

You need to look up the word "legitimization" in a dictionary, Tiff.

(And though he'll be happy to deny you your reproductive rights, you can bet your ass if his organ had managed to get the porn star pregnant, he would have been serenading her all the way to an abortion clinic.)

CNN are not the ones aiming to take away your abortion rights by repealing Roe v Wade, Tiff, that's Trump's stated aim. It's on the record. Look it up. He may fail, but if he does it will be despite your help and support and misguided loyalty.

but living in a border state that is burdened with absorbing the costs of illegal immigrants? — ArguingWAristotleTiff

Absolute peanuts compared to the trillions Trump just piled on the national debt to give tax breaks, the vast majority of which will go to the rich and big corporations, and which will have to be paid for by this generation's children. Your priorities are twisted. You give the impression that you'd rather see immigrants treated inhumanely than sacrifice a modest amount of cost while at the same time being happy to support Trump and his cronies stealing your money day in day out. Where's your outrage over the $139,000 that Zinke flushed down the drain to fix a couple of doors in his office, about all the other kickbacks and corruption Trump is engaged in? I don't see it. But when it comes to poor immigrants, suddenly it's close up the purse and save the cents. Why?

Baden, if you feel I am not worth responding to, then don't respond. — ArguingWAristotleTiff

I won't respond to stuff that's obviously fallacious and off-topic (this discussion is not about Australia and I bet not one person here would support their awful treatment of immigrants which is indeed worse than the US on the whole, but is obviously also zero excuse for Trump's concentration camps) but that doesn't mean I don't think you're not worth responding to in general.

You just keep repeating the same old Fox news talking points, Tiff. In and among the obvious fallacies of reasoning, it gets boring. For example, how can the US be treating immigrants badly when Australia is worse? Can you see why that's not even worth responding to?

My political predictions haven't been much better than my footballing ones. :sad:

The prize for your loyalty will be an end to Roe v Wade, an extra two trillion in debt you pass on to the next generation, and a debasement of political discourse including the legitimization of sexism, racism and anti-semitism that will stain your country for years to come. Not to mention Trump's trolling laughter when he walks away from the mess he has created into a huge TV deal.

All I can say is that if I had it to do all over again and could rethink my vote, I'd vote for Trump again. — Hanover

Trump would literally have to defecate in your MAGA cap for you to change your vote, so unless I can get him to do that, I'm not expecting a different answer from you, or any Trump voter. Maybe I can get him to do that. I'll work on it.

Apologies @Banno, I'm using the nauseous gases emitted by Trump and his merry band of reverse Robin Hoods to fuel an OP that may have more on its original flight path that I've missed. Where to next?

Another typical example of Trump admin corruption: Ryan Zinke charged taxpayers $139,000 dollars to fix three doors in his office. This is the type of change you're lauding as a political earthquake @Agustino. I suppose it is in terms of the massive damage caused and associated costs to the taxpayer, but otherwise not so much. Simple message: Stop being so gullible and open your eyes. Trump and his cronies are lining their pockets and laughing at the fools who thought they'd "drain the swamp".

http://www.newsweek.com/ryan-zinke-spent-139k-doors-here-are-all-trump-officials-caught-misspending-838047

Kim Kardashian can read lies off a teleprompter too. This is one that he didn't write. That's obvious because it's coherent if ironic. It's a run of the mill populist speech written probably by Bannon or Miller. More a loud fart than an earthquake.

Anyway, looking at the main points :

Reducing the power of special interests? I agree of course. Unfortunately and predictably, there are more than ever. It was gullible of you to believe him on that point.

"The numbers compiled by the Center for Responsive Politics, a nonpartisan organization that tracks money in American politics, might not seem surprising. The amount spent on lobbying during the first nine months of Donald Trump’s presidency, it found, was higher than in any corresponding period since 2012."

"President Donald Trump and his appointees have stocked federal agencies with ex-lobbyists and corporate lawyers who now help regulate the very industries from which they previously collected paychecks, despite promising as a candidate to drain the swamp in Washington."

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/01/21/opinion/lobbyists-washington-trump.html

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/lobbyists-get-ethics-waivers-to-work-for-trump-despite-executive-order/

(If you don't like these sources there are hundreds more demonstrating that this is one of the most corrupt administrations in modern history.)

Protectionism. The jobs he talks about protecting are gone and not coming back. His trade war is an infantile exercise in futility. Ask any economist.

Political correctness: So, POTUS gets to call his rivals "Pocahontas" and laugh at abused women and you call that progress? Sorry, but how is the President licensing this kind of childish vulgarity desirable? Would you want your kids talking like him?

Coke does nothing but bring people together. — Hanover

True, your mother and I owe more than you know to Coke.

[Edit: Apologies to all for mistaking this for the Lounge and not yet mastering the art of talking about Trump before descending into absurd, sexual and/or scatological references.]

Yes, and just to make it clear, I'm not objecting to anything political in this. It's a purely aesthetic aversion, a rhetorical allergy, if you will, to these linguistic torments.

But trying to find something, anything, redeeming here.

Maybe a twisted resonance of Beckett?

This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully, the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important. — Trump

reflex they call it ... no feeling of any kind ... but the lids ... even best of times ... who feels them? ... opening ... shutting ... all that moisture ... but the brain still ... still sufficiently ... oh very much so! ... at this stage ... in control ... under control ... to question even this ... — Beckett - (Not I)

http://www.ricorso.net/rx/library/authors/classic/Beckett_S/Not_I.htm

May the gods of literature have mercy on my soul.

Falling for marketing/PR doesn't make you an "idiot" and Trump voters, Trump supporters and Coca Cola drinkers are not idiots just because of those preferences. Some of them do need to aim for higher standards with regard to their gustatory and auditory intake though.

Why is a poisonously unhealthy beverage like Coca Cola the most popular soft drink in the world?



That's likely to continue until he's either impeached or undergoes the services of a professional taxidermist and is put on display in the Smithsonian.

I don't like Trump or his organ much. Did I mention that? :grin:

Trump's vocal chords should be extracted and medically inserted up his anus, so verbal and literal diarhhoea can at last be at one.

What's not to like? — gurugeorge

The fact that without visual clues it needs to be translated into English to be properly understood, that any random imbecile can babble on like that and similarly doesn't deserve a huge audience in front of which to do so, that it's narcissistic, empty, and lacking all rhetorical flourish and skill, that it encourages similar stupidities of speech, that it motivates an utterly vacuous and partisan defence along the delusional lines that such a lack of style and content indicates an anti-elite everyman mindset (though Trump clearly considers himself the elite of the elite), that nobody gives a flying fuck about Elton John any more (it's not the eighties, Don), that it's simply an utterly shit example of public speech. And so on. (I could go on).

I actually don't care much if I get ban. If I did then I won't act the way I do. — Jeremiah

And I don't care much then to waste my or the other mods' time on answering your questions.

From what I can see in the change log, you are the only one who edited that phrase. I edited out some of your ruder comments such as calling an analysis "total crap", and @andrewk edited some other comments which he can talk to you about, but as far as I can see, no-one edited that one (if any mod did they can correct me if I'm wrong, but I can only find two edits by you on that comment).

Anyway, we'll continue to try to keep this mathematical discussion clear of unnecessary, unwarranted and distracting vitriol. Either calm down or just leave it. You're not going to be able to bully any one else into seeing things from your point of view here.

Last thing, if a mod does edit your post, don't redo the original, query it. If you continuously re-add stuff that was modded out you'll obviously end up getting banned. Accepting the guidelines is a condition for being here.

It's a horribly incoherent infantile mess. It's only that when you see it spoken in context, and you understand he is referencing the crowd, it doesn't look like he is actually insane. That's a pathetically low bar. Anyone who has ever experienced an accomplished speech would recognize that this is the ramblings of a man-child. We should be standing up for quality not lauding this kind of rubbish. There was a time when oratory was appreciated. This is utterly retrograde, a descent into verbal faeces, and should be called out for that lest we lose sight of the actual potential of the spoken word to evince the higher emotions, intuitions and rational faculties. But yes, journalists are very bad, #MeToo sucks and Elizabeth Warren is Pocahontas. :vomit: :vomit: :vomit:

Common, dude! One should assess not blindly support. Like everyone (including the Republicans) is against that Neo-Nazi who recently won the Republican nomination for a house seat in Illinois. So...we should support him to shake things up? Insanity, please wash your brain out with insecticide and report back to me when you have sufficiently cognitively deloused!

Now we're talkin' :cheer:

Probably a good idea. ;)

Trump voters are nazi fascists — raza

Hm, I thought the game was to accuse critics of Trump of claiming that Trump voters are Nazi fascists when they didn't and then follow that up with blah blah blah. Is that not the game?

My question is how can we help Trump to defeat these children and their left-wing agitator supporters?

Guns may not be enough.

I'm pretty sure Jesus wouldn't stand for this, right, @Agustino? If we could get him revved up, Trump would have these urchins on the backfoot in a hot minute.

No doubt some of these had children who may have had to witness such atrocities. — raza

Well, that's a good enough reason to inflict further psychological harm on these children by separating them from their parents. But the question remains, how do we get these psychological damaged brown kids to stop this continued oppression of our billionaire hero underdog President? How can we support him in defeating them once and for all?

(And bringing up Nazis won't help because I'm not claiming he put them in a Nazi-style concentration camp, starved them or gassed them etc. Besides, the British were the inventors of the concentration camp, not the Germans.)

This is the definition of a concentration camp:

"Concentration camp: internment centre for political prisoners and members of national or minority groups who are confined for reasons of state security, exploitation, or punishment usually by executive decree or military order. Persons are placed in such camps often on the basis of identification with a particular ethnic or political group rather than as individuals and without benefit either of indictment or fair trial. Concentration camps are to be distinguished from prisons interning persons lawfully convicted of civil crimes and from prisoner-of-war camps in which captured military personnel are held under the laws of war. "

https://www.britannica.com/topic/concentration-camp

Now, tell me in what way that doesn't fit.

OK, well all this beats posting videos painting Trump as an underdog. Clearly he is, but eventually those brown kids he put in concentration camps will stop oppressing him and with a little love he'll recover.

I thought the Whitehouse press briefings were a revenge routine. :smile:

Well, if that one doesn't get you an invite next year, I don't know what will. Bravo :cheer: .

So, you two think we don't know he's President and are just pretending to think he is... I like it. :up:

I believe that Obama not only went down as United States president but went down on whoever he needed to to become president. — raza

Do you think these people requested President Obama perform oral sex on him, or do you think he's a rather loose closet homosexual (presuming you're referring to men) and just offered on the off-chance it would help? Interested... :chin:

(And don't be boring and tell me you were being metaphorical.)

Thought about that, but no evidence apart from the name.

Yes, edited to make that clear.

By the way, we're going to close discussion on this banning within 24h to avoid going off-topic, so if anyone else has anything to add, please do so within that time. We'll reopen for the next one whenever that happens to be. Hopefully not soon. Thanks.

If there's an obvious mistake or error of judgement, we can unban. Jamalrob has the last say on that. Hasn't happened so far. Punishment for banning wrongly will be dinner with Hanover, unless it's Hanover, in which case, dinner with Hanover's wife.

Thanking you.