↪Tom Storm Would a clone refer to its original as "father"? Possibly. Would we consider some kind of continuation of personhood as well between a clone and its original? Probably. So obviously we were created by all powerful aliens in their image where only Jesus was a clone. Problem solved. — Benkei

Ancient Aliens: Was Noah an Alien? (Season 9) | History

;)

By Law of Identity, if “two” things have the same set of properties, then they are one-and-the-same, and if not, then they are distinct. — A Christian Philosophy

The law of identity (1st law of logic), and identity of indiscernibles (Leibnizian metaphysics), aren't the same, at least they aren't in philosophy.

I considered a similar poll regarding homosexuality.
(In principle at least, people would/should be similarly equipped to do an assessment; this one has received more spotlight though.)
Defining "homosexual" would be easier, their laws more "well defined", yet equally unjust, inhuman, indecent, wrong.


:D

Philosophical musings:

Nothingness (Roy Sorensen; Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy; updated Feb 28, 2022)

Physicist musings:

The Four Different Meanings Of 'Nothing' To A Scientist (Ethan Siegel; Forbes; May 1, 2020)

• a condition where the raw ingredients to create your "something" didn't exist
• nothingness is the void of empty space
• nothingness as the ideal lowest-energy state possible for spacetime
• nothingness only occurs when you remove the entire universe and the laws that govern it

From some we might expect "nothingness" to express (exhaustive) absence of everything/anything, i.e. by negation, like the missing complement to existence. Oddly enough, this also implies absence of constraints, conservation (physics), prevention, etc. Not much to speak of it seems. A referent-free word? If there was another reason for it all, for existence, then that reason wouldn't exist, since existence/all is inclusive (by definition). There's something suspect about this inquiry.

Colloquially we might say something like "there's nothing in the fridge", meaning the fridge is empty, ready to be filled (with beer). Rather different from the other uses.

But, amazingly, it's all somehow around. :)

10.1177_1059712319862774-fig1.gif — Isaac

Thanks for posting those papers, however crazy technical they are. :up: :)

Hierarchical Models in the Brain (Nov 2008), Active Inference: A Process Theory (Aug 2016), Variational ecology and the physics of sentient systems (Dec 2019)

Didn't see the image you posted; is that from a different paper?

I guess they don't address the Levine / Chalmers thing directly, yet the models give their own insights.

Maybe we could categorize a bit...?

• The perception = the perceived (the same)
· hallucinations, phantom pain, dreams, fantasies

• The perception ≠ the perceived (not the same)
· other people, supper, the ground you walk on, tornadoes

So, in a way, by this categorization, a hallucination is a mistake: thinking it belongs in the ≠ category, but it doesn't. "You're just seeing pink elephants that ain't there."

And, solipsism is a mistake thinking others belong in the = category, but they don't. (I'm ditching solipsism here by assumption if you will, yet, by that assumption it categorizes that way, and that'll do; no proofs here.)

Then there's synesthesia, which is a bit of this, a bit of that, or can be.

Anyway, the idea is just that we already have various ways of talking about these (repeated) topics, and trying to somehow make some more concise could lead down less tread avenues. Don't know if this one can work, tho'. Doesn't get into neurology for example.

Putin says a lot of things, like in 2014:

Don't worry, Putin says he doesn't want Ukraine (PRX; Mar 29, 2014)

Others have other things to say, like in 2015:

'Nobody here is asking to leave Ukraine': Minorities see Russian meddling (Al Jazeera; May 4, 2015)

The Ukrainians aren't going to just give up.

It is ridiculous to think that if Zelensky gives such an order, the people will lay down their arms. People are fighting not for Zelensky, not for the president. Like some. — Evgeny Vladimirovich (Jun 28, 2022)

Been mentioned a few times in the thread on whatever angles. Comparatively, it's a fairly large population, and they're in a defense position.

The invasion or bombings/ruinage (or something at least), could end by the words of Putin or one of his compadres.

Mykhailo Podolyak has stated some conditions ...

• ceasefire
• withdrawal of Russian troops from Ukraine
• return of citizens
• reparations mechanism

... but, with continuing bombings/ruinage, Peskov's comments, concessions (mentioned already), etc, the Ukrainians are (increasingly) distrusting whatever comes out of the Kremlin. (Actually, I'm guessing most are and have been for some time.)

There are journalists, foreign news teams, whatever, scattered over Ukraine; they've been largely contained or disabled (or banned) in Russia and areas under Russian control.

Has a measure of "realism" ↑ @Tzeentch.

Don't know why you're giving oxygen to Russian propaganda. — Wayfarer

Sorry, my aim was more to expose Pesky Peskov, maybe for analysis.
His comments seem kind of transparently slanted - while the bombs are going, and people on the ground are taking the hits.

Yeah, there are all kinds of reports.

Dim Pesky has been chatty, sort of. (Apologies for the Jun 28 repeat.)

Peskov: Zelensky, if desired, can stop the special operation until the end of the day

Peskov: Zelensky can stop hostilities in a day by giving the order to lay down arms

MOSCOW, June 28 - RIA Novosti. The Ukrainian authorities, if they wish, can stop hostilities within a few hours, Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said, commenting on publications about Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky's plans to end hostilities before winter.

“The Ukrainian side can stop everything before the end of the current day, we need an order for nationalist units to lay down their arms, an order for the Ukrainian military to lay down their arms, and we need to fulfill the conditions of the Russian Federation. Everything can end before the end of the day. The rest is the thoughts of the head of the Ukrainian state,” the press said -Secretary of the President.

He added that the Russian side is guided by the statements of Vladimir Putin - “a special military operation is going according to plan and achieving its goals.” Peskov clarified that there are no approximate dates for its completion.

The day before, US national security adviser Jake Sullivan said that Zelensky, who addressed the leaders of the G7, called on Ukraine's sponsors to make the most of the next few months. According to him, “a protracted conflict is not in the interests of the Ukrainian people for objective reasons.”

In addition, Reuters, citing EU diplomats, reported that Zelensky told the G7 leaders about the need to end the conflict before the onset of winter.

Since February 24, Russia has been conducting a special military operation to demilitarize and denazify Ukraine. President Vladimir Putin called its goal “the protection of people who have been subjected to genocide by the Kiev regime for eight years.” — RIA (Jun 28, 2022)

Ukraine will have to understand the conditions of Russia, said Peskov

Putin's press secretary Peskov said that Ukraine will have to accept the conditions of Russia

PETROPAVLOVSK-KAMCHATSKY, July 3 - RIA Novosti. The demand for initiatives to pacify the situation in Ukraine in the West has decreased, but sooner or later common sense will prevail and the turn of negotiations will come, before which Kyiv will have to understand the conditions of Russia, said the press secretary of the President of the Russian Federation Dmitry Peskov.

“Now the demand for initiatives to pacify the situation has decreased. But we have no doubt that sooner or later common sense will prevail. them. Sit down at the table (of negotiations). And just fix the document that has already been agreed in many respects,” Peskov said in Pavel Zarubin's "Moscow. Kremlin. Putin" program on the Russia 1 TV channel, commenting on the militant statements from Western leaders. — RIA (Jul 3, 2022)

The West is still betting on the continuation of the war, not allowing Kyiv to talk about peace, said Dmitry Peskov.

“Now is the moment when Western countries are betting with might and main on the continuation of the war. This means that the moment continues when Western countries, under the leadership of Washington, speaking Russian, do not allow Ukrainians to think, talk about peace, or discuss peace,” — Peskov said. — ТАСС (Jul 3, 2022)

Immediate ceasefire. Withdrawal of z-troops from Ukraine. Return of kidnapped citizens. Extradition of war criminals. Mechanism of reparations. Recognition of sovereign rights [of] Ukraine... The Russian side knows our conditions very well. Chief Peskov (a) may not worry: the time will come, and we will record them on paper. — Mykhailo Podolyak (Jul 3, 2022)

Not really any end in sight. :/ I wonder what to make of it. Has there been unknown pressure in Moscow? ...? Will Belarus get drawn in? One can just speculate, even a couple of weeks later. Peskov says the Ukrainians have no will of their own (despite evidence to the contrary, including in this thread). Part of the show I guess, while the bombs are going, and people on the ground are taking the hits. Would be awful if Ukraine is turned into a country of haters.

Have to wonder how much fossil fuel has been transformed since the industrialization (and before), say, by decade, and how much is left to transform.
Don't think I've seen the two numbers plotted on one graph going centuries back; would be interesting though. Anyone know/have?
Then there's deforestation, pollution, roads, cities, farms, nature/wildlife displacement, all that. Humans + "footprints" + remains are all over (bombing too for that matter).
A global scale thing. Anthropogenic effects are noticeable. Global scale responses seem called for.

I think you are trying get leverage from aspects of your worldview. All that allows you to do is comment on your worldview. — Tate

You want to talk about me instead...? :roll: Suggest posting about the comment.

Maybe there are actually two cups, one for you and one for me, and we communicate telepathically about our individual scenes. — Tate

:D (you're just dreaming that you're reading posts on a forum)

Point is: watch out for question begging. — Tate

There are no proofs here. Just switching to other (descriptive) verbiage.

Wouldn't it be clearer to change the verbiage somewhat?

^{(pardon my poor art)}

The two occurrences aren't the same, they can't be, though there's just the one Cup (the perceived).
Whatever takes place in You and Me (the perceptions) are parts of the respective occurrences.
If I were color blind, then I might report a different color than You (the perceptions).

On a different though related note, this is just what "the-swimmer-in-the-water" looks like (refraction → the perception):



Doesn't mean that swimmer's head is separated from the rest of their body (the perceived).

, a god? Where does a god appear in someone claiming experiences = reality? :brow:

I can't experience someone else's self-awareness, since then I'd be them instead. I can experience someone else's hands when they use sign language (before their keen mind that I've become so familiar with). I can experience walking on the ground outside. Right?

But hey, if you want to scoff at metaphysics, then I'm all :up:.

Wait ...

the "it's all Frog" philosophers — Tate

Did you mean it's all goat? :D

What's the consequence? — Tate

Say, omniscience, contra ...

Exactly? Who knows. We have some decent models. No omniscience, though.

Say, were I to claim my experiences = reality, I'd be reducing my neighbor a bit heavy-handedly. Solipsism. Maybe there are noumena after all — other minds? Per the comment above, "physicalities" comes before those other minds I've become so familiar with anyway. (It's not like I'm walking on other minds (just the ground), though I might like to walk all over the solipsists. :smile:) Besides, if anything significant differentiates dreams, hallucinations, etc, and perception, then it's the perceived. And the unperceived could kill you regardless.

, well, when they say experiences = reality, they are saying something consequential.

I notice that there is a controversy (hardly noticed outside academia) about the status of numbers, whether and in what sense they're considered real. — Wayfarer

What could be derived?

, I suppose, idealists to who their experiences = reality, that question is settled?

And what is that exactly? — Tate

Exactly? Who knows. We have some decent models. No omniscience, though. Other than that, dirt, asphalt, grass, rubble, sidewalks, rocks, granite, ...

You'll find it rather more difficult to justify other minds than the ground you walk on — we walk on.
I don't walk on experiences-of-the-ground, I walk on the ground, and experience doing so.
What is the ground if not "physical"?
Believing those other minds you've become familiar with means believing "physicalities".
Isn't it kind of extravagantly self-elevating to reduce all to mental monism?

We usually go by established scientific models — it's not that the models = the modeled, but good enough for many situations — among the most successful epistemic endeavors in history (the Internet, GPS, cholera eradication, Mars rovers, type 1 diabetes, long list).
Science doesn't derive morals, art, the Kama Sutra, ... But has a few things to say about the ground. And walking.

Solipsists, speak up. :smile:

There are any number of reasons that others distrust Russia. I'm sure many others have reached the same impression through years of observations.

A new strategy for Moscow During this year’s State Duma race, Russia’s ruling party hopes to split the opposition, deceive inattentive voters, and (as always) mobilize state employees (Mar 26, 2021)

Nine Million Russians 'Deprived Of Right To Be Elected' (Jun 23, 2021)

No OSCE observers for Russian parliamentary elections following major limitations (Aug 4, 2021)

This Is a Uniquely Perilous Moment (Mar 12, 2022)

Humorous...sort of... :)

Doppelganger Dirty Trick In Russian Election Spawns Online Mockery (Sep 8, 2021)

(would have raised some eyebrows/investigations in the countries I call home)

Russia is a prominent (nuke-wielding) power on the world stage, apparently seeking respect. Yet, not so interested in building trust, which would go a long way to improving things, unlike fear. Not about others imposing their cultures onto Russian people, but about Russian relations, friendships, trying. What's the deal...? Would Russians see willingness to negotiate, compromise, seeking friendships, as a weakness, and that's enough...? Don't know, but some have suggested such like.

Wouldn't it be great if both parties ran out of bombs? Not likely to happen.

Military briefing: is the west running out of ammunition to supply Ukraine? (Jul 11, 2022)
Ukraine claims arms depot attack in occupied Kherson with Himars rockets (Jul 12, 2022)

A private company had 64 howitzers lying around; probably made a fortune off them.



Yeah, no end in sight. :/ The Ukrainians aren't likely to give up (earlier posts); Putin's Russia has become committed, seemingly to take over as much of Ukraine as they can (earlier posts).
Ukraine, even if well-armed, is a bit like sitting ducks, the defenders, nowhere else to go; Russia, the attackers, aren't being invaded, have a certain freedom of movement, and they're learning to use it, or will.

Diplomatic avenues have been fruitless.
For Ukraine, it would be like going half way to giving up, heavy concessions, and with what guarantees/consequences? It seems they're not down with repeating history nor with Putin; previous concessions didn't stop the bombing anyway.
For Russia, why talk when you can take? Putin, Peskov, and team might as well hire some good actors as diplomats; whatever they say will be dictated by military feasibilities in any case, Kremlin war strategists.
For diplomacy to have a chance, something would have to change.

As it looks, Putin's Russia has the moral low ground. At least someone is standing up to the bombing bully.

Next week, I will be the first president to visit the Middle East since 9/11 without U.S. troops engaged in a combat mission there. It’s my aim to keep it that way. — Opinion | Joe Biden: Why I’m going to Saudi Arabia (Jul 9, 2022)

Hmm... Misleading? By own statement, there are at least US troops engaging al-Qaeda and ISIS in the region.

The law of identity just states that whatever exists is self-identical, like an ontological assertion.
(I guess, in terms of propositions, whatever proposition implies itself.)

When we start talking about Hamlet or the Moon, then we've already presupposed identity.
Otherwise, what would we be talking about? Meaning would be lost; meaning presupposes identity.

Not that the world has to oblige, though.

Going the other way around, we could say that tautologies are true by definition.
Well, actually, we do.
Within some (logical) system, a proof of a proposition could be showing that the proposition is related to a tautology via bi-implications.

Kazakhstan is apparently taking an opportunity to sneak off?

Kazakhstan withdraws from CIS agreement on currency committee – UNIAN (Jul 10, 2022)

I guess Georgia left a good decade ago.

Marc Bennetts opines:

End of the bromance: why Xi is wary of going to Moscow (Jul 7, 2022)

Not sure I'd be so quick to assess. Besides, maybe Xi just doesn't like anyone. :)

Messy.

COVID: China's Shanghai says new Omicron subvariant found (Jul 10, 2022)

With more data and studies coming through, more preprints are becoming available:

Effectiveness of vaccines in preventing hospitalization due to COVID-19: A multicenter hospital-based case-control study, Germany, June 2021 to January 2022 (Jun 29, 2022)

The decline of COVID-19 severity and lethality over two years of pandemic (Jul 2, 2022)

Understanding the impact of disease and vaccine mechanisms on the importance of optimal vaccine allocation* (Jul 3, 2022)

Inferring the differences in incubation-period and generation-interval distributions of the Delta and Omicron variants of SARS-CoV-2 (Jul 5, 2022)

Quantifying the impact of vaccines and booster doses on COVID-19 in the U.S. (Jul 6, 2022)

Overall, there are a few lessons learned; I'm sure there will be more.

The end of the "inglorious stupid clown" who is responsible for tens of thousands of lives in this senseless conflict in Ukraine. — Oleg Deripaska (Jul 7, 2022)

The clown is going. He is one of the main ideologues of the war against Russia until the last Ukrainian. — Vyacheslav Volodin (Jul 7, 2022)

Do not seek to destroy Russia. Russia cannot be destroyed. You can break your teeth on it - and then choke on them. — Maria Zakharova (Jul 7, 2022)

the logical result of British arrogance — Dmitry Medvedev (Jul 8, 2022)

:brow:

Well, obviously it's Russia being attacked, not Ukraine, Russia is the victim here, and Johnson is a murderer of Ukrainians, it's others that are arrogant, not Putin, but all will fail. (Nevermind who's doing the bombing on the ground, and what happens to other voices.)
People don't have to like Johnson, many agree he's a clown already, to see through the propaganda. Broad targets, mothers of Russian soldiers, Ukrainians, ... I predict it'll be taken in, lapped up, and propagated.


Maybe it's a thing of his?

Putin Challenges the West (Again) (Jan 27, 2022)

Putin challenges West to fight Russia on the battlefield: ‘Let them try’ (Jul 8, 2022)

Wouldn't it be more fruitful/forward-looking to try building relationships?

Let's call it a court of philosophy (and ethics, humanity) first, not like those rooms frequented by the chief SCOTUS, if you will, then legalities secondary. :)

^{Stuff like this would be a study on its own...
• Laws | The Embassy of The Kingdom of Saudi Arabia (Washington DC)
• Committee for the Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice (Saudi Arabia)}

relatives of the convicts told Important Stories that they began to recruit prisoners from the St Petersburg colonies to travel to the Donbass as part of the Wagner PMC
After that, about 50 convicts were taken from colonies No 6 and No 7 to the Rostov region, the publication wrote, citing sources — gulagu.net: prisoners with “combat experience” were taken out of colonies in the Nizhny Novgorod region and Mordovia (Jul 8, 2022)

A Moscow court sentenced deputy Alexei Gorinov to 7 years in jail for criticizing Russia’s military actions in Ukraine (Jul 8, 2022)

"Special operation", not "war", dammit. (Yeah, children have been among the casualties.)


According to the Donetsk People's Republic, 2356 have been killed in action and 9713 wounded in action, in 2022:

Review of the social and humanitarian situation that has developed on the territory of the Donetsk People's Republic as a result of hostilities in the period from 02 to 08 July 2022 (Jul 9, 2022)

(The wording here isn't exactly unbiased, take with a grain of salt as usual.)

, just relaying that they have no legal definition of "witch" (reported by whatever sources).
Unless they have laws against killing, I guess anyone is fair game, or if they do, I guess they're set aside (discretionary), something to that effect.
I wasn't planning on dragging them to a courtroom in The Hague (or Medina, "The Enlightened City"), but will get a good legal team if I do. :)

Immoral - check
Legal - undefined
Appalling - check
Slippery - check
Unjust - check
Decency - negative
Ridiculous - check

So, your sister got some tarot cards with nifty illustrations on them, next thing you know she's in jail. Someone said she cast evil spells on them. No more electronics studies at King Saud's. The cards were later sold on eBay by a clerk at the police station.

Miscellanea ...

KGB archives document Red Army’s atrocities against Ukrainian village in USSR after 1945 (Paul A Goble; EP; Jan 5, 2021)

It took Red Army ‘a decade’ to subdue Western Ukraine after 1945, Russian specialist on Ukraine warns Kremlin (Paul A Goble; EP; Jan 21, 2022)

Russia’s Brutal War in the Donbas Proves Ukraine Can’t Win (Daniel Davis; 19FortyFive; Jul 5, 2022)

High death tolls in the past. A bulging Russia doesn't seem to sit well with Ukraine. A Russian takeover isn't peaceful, and what follows could be...not so good. Don't think they're likely to just give up. As some Russian commentator mentioned, they're not fighting for a person, Zelenskyy, or to attack other nations, they're fighting to repel the invaders.

, , there's been a few of those probes ...

2011 Americans' Beliefs in Paranormal Phenomena (Infographic)
2014 Superstition: Do you believe the following, or not?
2015 18% of Americans say they’ve seen a ghost
2018 ‘New Age’ beliefs common among both religious and nonreligious Americans
2019 United States: Do you believe any of these superstitions?

Not sure how informative they are.
I'll take seat 13 on the plane if at half price. Actually, I'll take row 13 off your hands for the price of a seat, just say the word. ;)

, according to some sources, Saudi Arabia does not have a legal definition of "witch", and no particular legal safeguards. Cases do not follow international law (rather the opposite here), are discretionary, justice system actors have no particular accountability. But they do have a state-sponsored corps of witch-hunters. Don't know of any sources contrary to that. Examples include someone saying that the accused magically caused a jinn to make them sick, someone in possession of a book deemed witchcraft, ..., foreigners have been executed as well.

Suppose we took the examples and made them into a law; for that matter, we could just declare it retroactive to cover past decades. That'd be making a mockery of law (international included), of doing the right thing, of conscience, decency.

Don't know if the the endlösung was legal back there-then, but it was immoral; if it was legal, then that'd be a mockery of law. — jorndoe

Technicalities/legalities aside, it's an assessment anyone can make; various information and factors mentioned earlier. "Ridiculous" might be an appropriate word. The kind of thing that history books might record as examples of what not to do, as repugnant.

The Saudi regime is is a brutal dictatorship with a cloak of piety, propped up by the West. — unenlightened

Right. (I'm just sticking to the opening post.)

, and other examples could be:

(∀) "photons don't decay", "all life is DNA based", scientific models
(∃) "there are extraterrestrial aliens", "the Vedic Shiva is real", observations

↪RussellA, call it a reasoned inductive conclusion (if you must). — jorndoe

Why should it be women only who shoulder the responsibility? Men need to step up to the plate. — Agent Smith

I think the vasectomy option came up earlier in the thread.
Legislate female bodies, legislate male bodies, seems fair.
Watch pro-life males complain (whine) loudly. ;)

Along the lines of ...

Caren White opines:

DeSantis Is Changing Florida Schools’ Curricula Again (Jul 2, 2022)

Seems like Goldwater's prophecy is materializing?

Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them. — Barry Goldwater (Nov 1994)

Witchcraft exists at least to the same extent as prayer exists. — unenlightened

Right. The word can mean different things. And some are self-professed witches, others kill who they deem witches. Killing is up there among the most severe sentences; the Saudis must deem it a rather severe offense (unless they have no respect for humans, over the top indecency, but that's uncharitable).

Legal penalties are whatever the law says are the penalties. In that view, the executions were perfectly fine because in accordance with the law (presumably). — Benkei

I'd replace "perfectly fine" with "perfectly legal". And I'm thinking the law would depend on morals; the other way around doesn't make much sense. Don't know if the endlösung was legal back there-then, but it was immoral; if it was legal, then that'd be a mockery of law. Anyway, side-track.

Maybe the most straightforward response is to requir...ask the Saudis to make their case, sufficiently, proportionally, with relevance. They already invested in a state-sponsored corps of witch-hunters. Other factors could be mentioned slippery slope, asking what (demonstrable) harm is done justifying execution.

ask the Saudi Arabian accusers/authorities to prove their case — jorndoe

There's a mountain of history, precedence, international works and documents, plain decency, whatever to go by already. I don't see how anyone can't find it disgusting — look over cases yourself. Not hard to come up with analogous scenarios that would seem absurd. But, the executions are happening (and someone voted "Not guilty"), so maybe there's a strong case to be made?

So are you saying that all religious grounds are 'false'? — unenlightened

Nayh. (Actually, I'd prefer the thread sticking to the topic; various religions have enough troubles as it is. :wink:)

You are right that to say that the proposition "there is such a thing as supernatural witchcraft" requires verification, but it follows that the proposition "there's no such thing as supernatural witchcraft" also requires verification. — RussellA

Not quite, which was the point of linking that other thread; that stuff goes back to John Watkins, Karl Popper, those people. We might ask: what exactly would evidence of x being fictional/imaginary look like...? (something's not quite right)

In the general case we're talking an indefinite/infinite domain/scope.
You can verify an existential claim ("look, there it is"), but you can keep trying to falsify indefinitely without having falsified the existential claim.
You can falsify a universal claim ("here's a counter-example"), but you can keep verifying indefinitely without having verified the universal claim.
That is, existential claims are verifiable and not falsifiable, universal claims are falsifiable and not verifiable.

So, that's why the onus probandi is anchored with the claimant of the (original) existential claim, and not much else is applicable, in this sense at least.

Here in the real world we often enough go by more fallible methods.
In this case, we tend to ask the (original) claimant, which strands on (unverifiable) anecdotes, or we can sometimes narrow the domain/scope to something more manageable, which, granted, would change how my statement is worded.
If nothing comes through, then both the (original) existential claim, and the contrary (my statement), have the same status, stating one is as hypothetical as stating the other.

↪RussellA, call it a reasoned inductive conclusion (if you must). — jorndoe

By the way, metaphysics tend to be both unverifiable and unfalsifiable; earnesty seems to mean provisional/tentative, or maybe a difference that makes no difference.

Just to clarify, I'm not suggesting that "Guilty" should mean war. Isn't sentencing a separate thing anyway? Come to think on it, maybe some sort of inclusive approach, having them take related responsibilities for all to see would help some, get them to do some soul-searching:

Again: Saudi Arabia Elected Chair of UN Human Rights Council Panel (Sep 20, 2015)

Don't know. It was a controversial move:

Why Is Saudi Arabia Heading a UN Human Rights Council Panel? (updated Apr 14, 2017)

, maybe "unjust executions" works?

Sample cases and efforts listed (check) some history with outcomes (check) precedence (check) international responses available (check)

I'm kind of reminded of argumentum ad baculum. :)

Rather different context, same result for the accused/victim, both "unjust executions":

Christian zealot beheads teen for practicing witchcraft (Nov 2, 2014)

Some don't subscribe, some have their own version, some parts could use an update here and there, yet the spirit thereof is clear enough, great document:

Universal Declaration of Human Rights (Dec 10, 1948)

, hmm I thought it was reasonably clear. Here's some background, context, precedence:

• Witch trials in the early modern period
• Modern witch-hunts
• Nuremberg trials

International organizations have Saudi Arabian cases on record. I'd think most humans would find it disgusting, unjust, wrong, gratuitous, with mentioned slippery slope.

Admittedly, I don't have the technical/trained legal background to take the authorities to court, to run a case. It's not my case in particular anyway.

This stuff shouldn't block voting, right?

I don't think my opinions on what changes to Russia would turn it into a more preferable state are in any way relevant to the question of Ukraine, and how it could have been avoided. — Tzeentch

Want me to repeat what you were asked? (Nah.)

You are referring to yourself that called me a Kremlin propagandist, I assume? — Tzeentch

I did? Nah.

(Maybe I should forget about expecting you to honestly respond.)