@Agree-to-Disagree, would you like renewable/sustainable/green energy efforts to succeed?

(Big Climate Change, like there is Big [...] — Agree-to-Disagree

Is that the powerful windmill-industrial complex?

Do you believe that all climate scientists are "knights in shining armour"? — Agree-to-Disagree

No. Neither are all astronauts, yet the Earth still ain't flat.

Hmm , answering the question with a question instead? If you weren't called denier, what you call them?

In absence of anything better, I'll go by the (large) consensus among subject matter experts.

Scientific consensus on climate change | Wikipedia | science index
Evidence | NASA | science
Nature Climate Change | Springer Nature | science and discussion index
10 myths about climate change | WWF | errors
Consequences of climate change | European Commission | effects
Climate change | OECD | policy
+ a simple rational analysis → Aug 1, 2024.

Doesn't seem plausible that they're all in on some conspiracy or whatever, but people have ridiculously believed worse. Any ulterior motives would largely be financial in fossil fuel sectors. (Or just contrarians/conservatives/economists perhaps?) :shrug:

, why do you consistently call others alarmists and scaremongers? Did "concerned" (heck, or "caring") go out of fashion? And unenlightened...? → Aug 1, 2024

Anyone who believes in indefinite growth on a finite planet is either mad or an economist :D — whoever

, you know there's such a thing as redheads, yes?
They have reddish hair.
I don't know of any particular discrimination against them on that account, and neither should there be.
If there were, then DEI could apply to discriminators.
Something similar goes for people that require very large shoes, and whatever.
Yet there is discrimination that ought not be, to which these efforts are a reaction.
You may complain about whatever implementation details of course.

It's hardly new...

The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men. — paraphrasing Plato

And you can also commit injustice by doing nothing. — Aurelius

Often injustice lies in what you aren't doing, not only in what you are doing. — Aurelius

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. — paraphrasing Burke

Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing. — Mill

Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented. Sometimes we must interfere. — Wiesel

:D "You know what I'm saying, right? You know what I'm saying." Don't know who the interviewer is, but they probably actually know. And Spain isn't "low" (let alone "very low"), it's a reasonably civilized democracy, "higher" than a lot of countries.

, that's too bad. :/

By the way, we don't see this happening in otherwise comparable countries:

Did Alex Smith Die at Age 26 Because He Couldn't Afford Insulin? (— David Emery · Snopes · Sep 24, 2018)

Apropos the recent murder.

Someone elsewhere claimed that the recent pardons of insurrectionists are a way of building loyalty from militias and such. They might carry out unofficial acts. Not exactly a charitable comment, still consistent though.

, the US having turned into pre-industrial anarchy would be "objectively an unmitigated trainwreck" (yours is tweet-style exaggeration). But, sure, things aren't exactly optimal. (By the way, the Ukraine situation isn't just the US, as have been argued again and again, though they should have handled it my way.) ;) Threatening Canada Greenland Panama Mexico is estranging.

:up:

objectively an unmitigated trainwreck — Tzeentch

↑ tweet; such magnificent exaggeration that "objectively" seems like a joke :)

Good riddance! — NOS4A2

... because screw the environment!

I admittedly can't be bothered to read those 174 pages myself:

READ: Jack Smith's final report on Trump's Jan. 6 case
^{— Avery Lotz · Axios · Jan 14, 2025}
Jack Smith’s Final Report on Trump Investigations (2025)
^{— John R Vile · The Free Speech Center, Middle Tennessee State University · Jan 17, 2025}

Guilty (or not) probably wouldn't have made much difference to his die-hard followers and their apparatuses. About as futile as deconverting a Pentecostal and for similar reasons. Might have made a difference to the election though. A different kind of rigging?

Biden won the rigged election. He was inaugurated, after all. — NOS4A2

Why do you think it was rigged?

13 billionaires ...

Billionaires and loyalists will provide Trump with muscle during his second term
^{— Daniel Drache, Marc D Froese · York University · Jan 13, 2025}

The distance between rich and poorer has increased, though I'll note that people like Gates, Buffett, Swift have donated/contributed considerably to various causes. The Clown administration seems to favor the rich.

I'm still at a loss as to why RFK Jr was picked as head of Health.

More saltwater...

Climate-Induced Saltwater Intrusion in 2100: Recharge-Driven Severity, Sea Level-Driven Prevalence (study)
^{— Adams, Reager, Buzzanga, David, Sawyer, Hamlington · Geophysical Research Letters · Nov 22, 2024}
Saltwater Could Contaminate 75% of Coastal Freshwater by 2100
^{— Margherita Bassi · GIZMODO · Dec 15, 2024}

More longer larger droughts...

Global increase in the occurrence and impact of multiyear droughts (study)
^{— Karger, Chen, Brun, Buri, Fatichi, Gessler, McCarthy, Pelliciotti, Stocker · Science/AAAS · Jan 16, 2025}
Mega-droughts are becoming more frequent and intense worldwide
^{— Beate Kittl · Swiss Federal Institute for Forest, Snow and Landscape Research · Jan 16, 2025}

The usual findings. Might be worthwhile preparing some.

Brief note in a New Zealand newspaper from some 113 years ago:

Journalist Samuel Rachlin (at newspaper Berlingske) writes of "The Buffet of the Cannibals".

The topic, or one topic at least, is whether or not the Clown will follow Putin's example, and snack on things that aren't theirs.

Things might be looking up in the Middle East at the moment, yet, the current climate leaves a lot to be desired — warring, dis/mal/misinformation, post-truth, political rhetoric (and tirades), tariffs, cancellation of international rules or disregard thereof, anti-democratic forces, instability, moves to divide (and polarize), extremism, ...

More cannibalism would be a signal to the autocrats of the world (or would-be autocrats): help yourselves to the buffet. Something NATO can help deter, by the way.

By Rachlin, backsliding has been much too frequent in our time, of which Putin's Russia is an example.

Europe might want to get together, build sufficient deterrence, stand up for civilized democracy, build strong relationships with, say, Australia, Japan, South Korea, others.


Ukrainian tragedies

(I'm using "tragedy" somewhat broadly; also, there are no utopias here.)

The war kicked off by the Kremlin is a tragedy — destruction, bombing, killing.

Then there are possible future tragic turns:

Ukraine falls back under the Kremlin's thumb, dragged thither by Putin's regressive Russia.
Ukraine becomes a tense border in another cold war.
Ukraine's supporters throw them under the bus, (cowardly) abandoning promises, appeasing Putin.
Ukraine becomes a nation of bitterness, hate, mass production of weaponry.

I suppose there are more possible tragedies, but there are also less tragic possible future turns:

Ukraine continuing to develop democracy, political reforms compatible with the EU, wouldn't be tragic (if Belarus were to follow a similar path, then that would be a bonus).
Ukraine leaves Kursk, Russia leaves Ukraine, handshakes and signatures, Russia shall not be attacked from Ukraine, ease up on sanctions, no more sabotage, GPS jamming, downing passenger planes — peace.

A bit more fatigue after infection it seems:

Incidence and Prevalence of Post-COVID-19 Myalgic Encephalomyelitis: A Report from the Observational RECOVER-Adult Study
^{— Suzanne D Vernon, Tianyu Zheng, Hyungrok Do, et al · NIH · Jan 13, 2025}

I guess this stuff wasn't mentioned explicitly in the thread, so I'll toss something in.

Political philosophers envisioned the masses transcending countries (or any such partitioning I suppose). The masses could find common ground and solidarity, like refuse being sent to wars against each other. With the advent of mass communication, discussions + organizing should be technically possible more or less worldwide; well, except that having sessions where all of the masses attended isn't feasible, so representatives would be needed. The likes of ideologies, religions, cultures, traditions, distrust, certain ambitions, greed, extremism, whatever, might get in the way of such efforts, yet, surely the masses + commoners + whatnot, if in voluntary agreement, could force an agenda across large regions, across multiple countries. After all, if they all (or most of them) plainly said "No" to go to war killing each other, or perhaps sanctioning each other, then it would be less likely to happen. Conversely, the more people, the more diversity can be expected. (And what of personal relationships?)

The top honchos of the old USSR didn't follow the philosophers, but instead forced themselves on others, right off the Russian revolution. They didn't seek out voluntary solidarity, but instead replaced old with new honchos that became ruthless dictators, and rolled over other countries regardless of what any masses might have to say there. (Is it easier to force involuntary compliance than for voluntary cooperation to come about?) Would-be communism that wasn't.

The UN doesn't have that much power, and there's plenty of globalization-phobia to come by, though one could sometimes wish otherwise. Well, centralization and concentration of broad and wide powers are known to carry inherent dangers, balances and limits are warranted. Conversely, cooperation can and does achieve markedly more than any individual.

Why have these ideas not caught on?

On a smaller scale, unions are around though, in part going by similar objectives, with top honchos of their own by the way.

The world has an unholy mix of dictatorships, theocracies, authoritarianism, corruption, semi-democracies, civilized democracies, ... It only takes one, for others to be threatened.

Anyway, I remain skeptical that communism is feasible/realistic; don't see anything particularly better than democracy, and that takes work to maintain.

(I'd quote a variety of people, fiction and non-fiction, but have already babbled long enough here.)

Hmm... Is there an answer that does not admit questions (even in principle)? Other than "Unknown" perhaps? :chin: :zip:

iep
wikipedia
fact-index

Moore using sign language before a deaf audience could emphasize the point.

I'm not sure it's needed though. Denial of an extra-self world seems like a philosophical (maybe psychological) problem alone, a Cartesian curse. Should we expect a purely deductive dis/proof?

For a brief moment, this is what a photographer saw:



But the recording is not the recorded.

, would "abstraction realist" work? Hm Also comes through odd (to me anyway).

It's like objective idealism, in some sense. — Arcane Sandwich

In typical philosophical parlance, I find "objective idealism" pretty close to a contradiction in terms.

• Subjective   ≈   existentially mind-dependent
· Objective is not

• Idealism   ≈   mental monism
· Realism is not
· An analysis of the rationale leads toward solipsism

But, hey, in the rabbit hole of metaphysics, one can come up with whatever. :)
Never mind me, carry on.

:D

Being very busy at work is not a valid reason, but a lame excuse. You can engage in procreation during breaks, because life flies by too quickly. — Yevgeny Shestopalov (Health Minister)

Typically, offices have rules concerning sexual harassment, not so much about having sex there, let alone promoting it. (Can always grab some children from Ukraine I suppose.)

Not a Merry Christmas for some :/

Azerbaijani airliner crashes in Kazakhstan, killing 38 with 29 survivors, officials say
^{— Katie Marie Davies, Dasha Litvinova et al · AP · Dec 25, 2024}
Exclusive: Preliminary investigation confirms Russian missile caused Azerbaijan Airlines crash
^{— Euronews · Dec 26, 2024}
Russian air-defense system downed Azerbaijan plane, sources say
^{— Nailia Bagirova, Gleb Stolyarov et al · Reuters · Dec 26, 2024}

, another demonstration of their unity with Ukraine, their brothers and sisters.

, I'm reminded of a sitcom with a studio audience. :D

... seems to belong in this thread.

The Clown talks about grabbing the Panama Canal and Greenland to cheers in the background.

The non god alternative is that these manifestations of intelligence occurred through dumb luck, which is not possible. It’s like 10,000 monkeys randomly typing on a keyboard and creating the complete works of Shakespeare. Just not possible. — kindred

In terms of probability, it's as unlikely as any other character sequence of that length.
Equally unlikely, equally possible.
By the way, something similar applies to other (long) event sequences.
Favoritism looks like bias.

Health Insurance CEO Reveals Key To Company’s Success Is Not Paying For Customers’ Medical Care
^{— The Onion · Mar 5, 2018}

Well that sucks

Long COVID: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Accumulation Linked to Long-Lasting Brain Effects
^{— Helmholtz Munich · Nov 29, 2024}
Persistence of spike protein at the skull-meninges-brain axis may contribute to the neurological sequelae of COVID-19
^{— Rong, Mai, Ebert, Kapoor et al · Helmholtz Munich & Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität · Dec 11, 2024}

Animation (— Ali Max Erturk · Nov 29, 2024 · 1m:33s)

, talking $s doesn't mean that all else is BS (also known as a non sequitur).
I suppose you might check the tragedy of the commons.
Say, up-and-coming countries aren't all that likely to go all green from the get-go when they can industrialize using fossil fuels. "Why should we be denied development when everyone else did this?"
And so it goes. Or whatever. "Shit where the grandkids eat."

For Russia to keep Ukraine out of NATO it wasn't necessary to invade Ukraine. A show of force on the border would have done that.

Yet for Russia to gain the territories of Novorossiya, to annex Crimea and the Donbas, it was necessary to attack Ukraine.

That's it. That's the line that you should understand. But for you it's The US/NATO made Russia to do it, as "offence is the best defence", and thus legitimizing imperialism. — ssu

:up:

If their rationale was just NATOphobia, then what would the land grabbing accomplish anyway?

Bring alerts to the world (including NATO) with aggression/warring? Cause Russophobic reactions in Europe like another application of Putin's own NATOphobic argument/logic? Extend right up to NATO members instead of keeping (the dangerous) NATO at a distance? ...?

Something's not quite right, or something's missing.

Either way, annexations, invasion, destruction, killing, Russification, remain facts in action.

The Ukrainians asserting their sovereignty, independence, self-governance, going their own way (accompanying Kremlin loss of control) was the background-factor in the first place, perhaps going back to 1991 in certain heads. Hence annexations, expansion, Russification, etc, as if Russia somehow wasn't large enough already.

, well, now and then I get a notice, a way to keep tabs on what's going on.
Becoming informed is not the same as taking the notices/stories seriously.
I'm guessing those propagandists/influencers are having an impact, but it's unclear how much.

Canada has so much wide open space, it can take even more than the US. — Metaphysician Undercover

Well, I don't think that many immigrants are headed out in the wilderness (or build residences etc), be it in the US or Canada. :) Typical destinations are metropolitan centers or larger to medium urban areas. They need a foothold before they can start living and doing stuff.

A pretty face, and some 634K followers on x/twitter as of typing, networked.
An example of what mad dis/mal/misinformation/bullshit campaigning can look like:

Liz Churchill

At a glance, it looks like noisy satire, except a couple of classes below The Onion.
I wouldn't want to impede their right to post nonsense, though some accountability would be great.

Does it work, are they making a difference?

^{2023Aug21 | 2023Oct20 | 2023Dec18 | vatniksoup | vaxopedia}

Amazon or the like doing test runs?
At least the areas seem right, but maybe not that plausible, you'd think someone would speak up.

Amazon successfully tests using delivery drones in Italy (— Reuters · Dec 5, 2024)

Amazon's drone delivery program takes flight (— CNBC · Dec 10, 2024 · 2m:4s)


Amazon poised to launch European drone delivery service after Italy flight tests (— Aerospace Testing · Dec 13, 2024)

, regardless of the murderous rampage, with unaddressed injustices, don't expect the problem to go away.
Putin's Russia employs industrialized suppression, Russification, propaganda, manufactured events/threats, whatever, to preempt eventualities (which is harder in more transparent democracies).
Anyway, the environments differ some.

Do Arabs accept Israel? As a state? (Which / how many do/don't, and how reliable is this?)
As an aside, would any of this change if, say, Israel exited the Golan Heights entirely?
Might as well get down to it: Should an Israeli state exist henceforth? And safe and with actual borders?
Your take, please. (←↑ addressed to everyone)

3-year-old data from the UK remains consistent with US data from 2022

Deaths involving COVID-19 by vaccination status, England: deaths occurring between 2 January and 2 July 2021
^{— Charlotte Bermingham, Jasper Morgan, Vahé Nafilyan · Office for National Statistics · Sep 13, 2021}



The Vaccination Effect on Covid-19 Deaths
^{— Martin Armstrong · Statista · Sep 13, 2021}

Russia and Iran abandon Syria, low on resources, can't keep it up, due to other crap.
Ripple effects related to Ukraine and the Middle East (Israel).
Russia apparently also needs North Koreans, maybe for Kursk in particular.
Might China take advantage of a weaker Russia? (Vladivostok/海參崴 came to mind.)

212,000 lives, $105 billion ...

Universal healthcare as pandemic preparedness: The lives and costs that could have been saved during the COVID-19 pandemic
^{— Alison P Galvani, Alyssa S Parpia, Abhishek Pandey, Meagan C Fitzpatrick · PNAS · Jun 13, 2022}

Study: More Than 335,000 Lives Could Have Been Saved During Pandemic if U.S. Had Universal Health Care
^{— Jenny Blair · Yale School of Medicine · Jun 20, 2022}

So, lower clouds ...

Recent global temperature surge intensified by record-low planetary albedo
^{— Helge F Goessling · Science · Dec 5, 2024}

In 2023, the global mean temperature soared to almost 1.5K above the pre-industrial level, surpassing the previous record by about 0.17K. Previous best-guess estimates of known drivers including anthropogenic warming and the El Niño onset fall short by about 0.2K in explaining the temperature rise. Utilizing satellite and reanalysis data, we identify a record-low planetary albedo as the primary factor bridging this gap. The decline is apparently caused largely by a reduced low-cloud cover in the northern mid-latitudes and tropics, in continuation of a multi-annual trend. Further exploring the low-cloud trend and understanding how much of it is due to internal variability, reduced aerosol concentrations, or a possibly emerging low-cloud feedback will be crucial for assessing the current and expected future warming.

Summaries at ... phys, abc

: Scandalous.

: Yeah. In some ways at least, it can go further than conspiracy theorists and such, when (otherwise seemingly well-meaning) intellectuals have no concept of what battles to fight (and when), and stoke the same fires, (again) to the silent cheers of other/larger adversaries. That's not to say they shouldn't (or shouldn't be allowed to), but "careful what you (appear to) wish for" remains applicable.