:fire:

:100:

:groan:

The sheer depth and breadth of that wiki page should avail me alone.

Nah it's not that bad, @Baden is watching over us, and he understands these artistic licenses.

Nah, apparently totally random, but I'll just post the link to the wiki here, at risk of mod freak-out-mode. The story is in that link somewhere

I want to post a youtube link to "Swastika Girls" by Fripp & Eno from their 1973 (!!!) proto-ambient record, (No Pussyfooting), but apparently both the name of the track and the name of the album, combined with the sheer obscurity of the record in general prevent it from being available on the general interwebs. Sad. Look it up, kids.

*Bulling balls

What an excellent thread. I hope I can contribute soon. Gratitude isn't one of my strong suits.

No, infanticide is unfortunately considered necessary in many tribal cultures and paleoanthropological evidence seems to suggest it has been since human culture began, so yes the decision to end a life in the face of interminable suffering is, unfortunately 'normal'. — Pseudonym

Sure, maybe that was my mistake, then; but to call infanticide "normal"? Normal has an ontological and epistemological connotation beyond simple cultural acceptance. Normal against what?

Further more, I don't care about paleoanthropomorphicaloligal evidence (typo on purpose). I can't be bothered to give a shit.

Why would you assume I find that funny? To the contrary, I find your expression of that situation horrifying.

That reality is only normal within a modern world in which these things are possible. I couldn't give a rat's ass about that "normal" modern world. The ability doesn't suggest the moral.

Bill Bruford's KC debut :fire: :fire: :fire:

Btw, I was laughing at your comment that 6,000 people in the UK decide to end their own lives is "normal".

:lol:

Normal? What's normal about it? This is great; we suddenly arrive at a purely emotional argument when we get here.

So let's have the rest of your argument - the part where you show how, once we've concluded that a foetus is actually a human, that it follows automatically that we cannot terminate it. — Pseudonym

Are you a human? Can I terminate you?

Anyways,

What do you mean by "those"?

I'm joshin' you, I've been a musician since age 6.

No, I don't.

How/where/at what point?

More like without american standards, there would be no pop/[rock], and without bop, there would be no american standards, and without swing, there would be no bob, and without ragtime, there would be no swing, and without delta blues, there would be no ragtime, and without negro spirituals, there would be no delta blues, and without traditional african music, there would be no negro spirituals. But that's an over-simplification.

Examples?

And, examples that I only like "modern music", which is a failed copy of "classical music?" What does that even mean?

You have a lot to learn.

Bullshit.

What is "proper taste"?

Yeah, I think the Cosby case is the real case; it's the one that we can all agree on. Was that the case that started the #metoo movement? I can't remember. If so, then it was certainly justified.

But lesser cases, as I think @Bitter Crank has well illustrated, are less clear.

And yes, that it's a personal response is of course, completely acceptable. Even rational, ironically. I don't disagree with you, T Clark.

Nah.

It is an uncomfortable thought that I have been strongly affected by someone whose motives are suspect. — T Clark

But isn’t it relatively rare for influential artists, philosophers, etc., to be totally innocent of morally reprehensible behavior? And what of things people have done that no one knows about? I just don’t think it’s realistic to restrict your consumption of art etc. to people who, as far as you’re aware, led upright lives, or lives that agree with your own morals. If everyone you looked up to in art/ philosophy etc was found to be morally degenerate, what would happen to your philosophy? Your aesthetics? What if only one upright person was left? Would they become your god? Whatever they say, whatever they create, is “right” or “good” in your eyes?

I am saying you are an exemplar of manipulation via hyper-partisan tactics, — Maw

And you're an exemplar of what; non-partisan tactics? Convince me there's no "hyper" in your modus operandi.

:up:

Will you endorse his behavior by viewing his film? — Cavacava

Viewing the film isn't endorsement of behavior; it's a crapshoot to see if the film itself was good or not.

the question is will you go see the next movie by someone who had sex with a 14 year old? — Cavacava

If the movie is good, yes. If not, no.

Haydn is long gone, but his works remain. — Bitter Crank

Exactly.

Garrison Keillor, the avuncular Prairie Home Companion, produced hundreds and hundreds hours of perfect radio. — Bitter Crank

And even going further than your admissions on his behalf, he produced hundreds and hundreds of hours of perfect radio. Period.

This is, actually, true for all of us, whether we are artists or common laborers. If I perform 8 hours of honest labor for you, you got what you paid for. If the other 16 hours of my day I drink, fuck whores, smoke pot, shoot up heroin, and piss in public, but am ready to work again at 9:00 a.m., what's it to you, Jack? — Bitter Crank

Again, totally agreed.

"He always sold more than his quota of vacuum cleaners, but you know, he cheated on his wife." So, why should Electrolux care? Maybe he needed to sell a lot of vacuum cleaners to keep both his wife and his mistress happy. Fuck Electrolux. They should be happy he was strongly motivated. — Bitter Crank

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Lol, what?

We've agreed that they are not yours. — Rich

Where?

What do you know about me from my words?

You know nothing about me personally, so the work is already done.

So we agree? We have to separate the art from the artist?

Right, every artist, every philosopher, every politician, puts themselves into their work. The good, the bad, and the ugly. So?

I don't understand why people can't separate art from artist. It's fundamentally hypocritical, and indicative of our hero-worship celebrity culture; the heroine falls; we spit on her.

This is amazing