This is extreme. One can be a hard worker without also being a walking zombie. — Heister Eggcart

I don't care. I work for the money, not because it's an opportunity to work hard. — Sapientia

I get paid per hour. Whether I use that time to work really hard or just sit there doing little, I'll still get paid the same. So what's your point exactly? — Sapientia

There was a time not too long ago when I had two jobs and worked 7 days a week with no day off, and one of those jobs was full-time. When I first started my current job, I frequently worked 12 hour shifts over the busy Christmas period. And I'm always the first person that the management team turn to for overtime, because they know that I'm reliable and will say "yes" without hesitation. So I'm no stranger to hard-work if that's the kind of thing you mean. — Sapientia

I've had poor vision since I was born--congenital defect. The biggest vision improvement for me has been computer screens and the digital books; the screens on tablets allow for comfortably larger print, so in the last 7 years I have greatly increased the amount of reading I do. I've always read a lot, but small print was a hard slog. Like the big thick Shakespeare book when I was in college (1966) was very small print, and the notes were even smaller. I read them, but one learns better when one can read easily. — Bitter Crank

btw did you know Trump's son-in-law is a slum lord, among other things? — Bitter Crank

They could build more council housing, scrap or reform 'right to buy', put in place legislation to make it harder for private landlords to refuse tenants on housing benefit, increase the minimum wage — Sapientia

There's nothing about being a Communist that suggests one should be a spendthrift. — Bitter Crank

I've often wished to drive, but don't because I can't see well enough. Vision in one eye took a dive this winter (effects of glaucoma) so I'm finding that even biking around town has become a bit more hazardous. Even if I were totally blind, there is fairly good public transportation where I live. — Bitter Crank

"Working harder" really isn't good advice, especially for people who are already doing so and can't get themselves up and out. — Heister Eggcart

Sounds like a bachelors degree here in the States, which is not anything to write home about, really. — Heister Eggcart

In Christian language, I'd say that the current path I'm on is my calling. The good in me would best be expressed by not working at McDonald's. This really isn't that outlandish a thought. — Heister Eggcart

It never follows that the poor are always poor because they don't work hard, and the rich are rich because they worked harder than everyone else. Living in this modern capitalist West means that a lot of people get shafted and/or fall through the cracks because a small segment of the population are disproportionately wealthy in relation to the rest of citizens.

"Working harder" really isn't good advice, especially for people who are already doing so and can't get themselves up and out. — Heister Eggcart

Arrogance. You just need to work harder. — Heister Eggcart

Yes, but the government should do more to help people like me than people like Mr. Rich and his gold digger wife. — Sapientia

How long of a degree? — Heister Eggcart

I don't see how this applies to what I said? — Heister Eggcart

Yes, you are! You've spent quite a lot of time bashing education — Heister Eggcart

Where is this supposed ego of mine? I'm not seeing it. — Heister Eggcart

They should grow a back bone. Some people have real problems. "Honey, I simply must have that Chanel handbag. Buy me it! It's only £10,000.", "Okay, darling. If you insist". — Sapientia

I work full-time, and my free time is priceless. I'm not going to give up any more of it than I already do. — Sapientia

If you think taking classes in a school room is going to teach you how to make a bridge perfectly in real life, I dunno what to tell you. — Heister Eggcart

So, your ranting and raving here and about useless an education is doesn't mean that education is shit? — Heister Eggcart

Again, I just keep reading silly expectations from you while you're trying to blame everything else but yourself for not being in the position that you'd like. — Heister Eggcart

You're not addressing my point. Retry. — Heister Eggcart

What? Your quote is precisely my position. Re-read what I wrote if you couldn't figure that out. — Heister Eggcart

My character and expertise would be wasted flipping burgers. Period. — Heister Eggcart

If the right argues for gender supremacism, the left for gender equality and the center for everyone with their chosen / assigned role, I argue for genderlessness, as in the abolishment of gender which I view as an obsolete social construct. — Noblosh

And, even though the state can help, for someone like me, there are obstacles preventing me from getting that help. I have little-to-no hope of getting a council place because I'm considered a low priority and because demand is too high and supply is too low, and the majority of private landlords refuse to accept anyone on housing benefit. So I'm kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place. Which is just... great. — Sapientia

"Civil engineering is a professional engineering discipline that deals with the design, construction, and maintenance of the physical and naturally built environment, including works like roads, bridges, canals, dams, and buildings." — Heister Eggcart

Best educated? I thought your education was shite? — Heister Eggcart

So you went through with your "education" with the idea that you would never be taken advantage of or that you'd never have a shit boss? — Heister Eggcart

This is easy for you to say over the internet. — Heister Eggcart

The world always needs good doctors, persons who have the passion to treat and operate on those in need. Blame not the profession in itself, but those who fail to live up to the standard that is still being upheld by those commendable individuals who are doing a great job. — Heister Eggcart

As far as I'm concerned, my plan to become a licensed counselor and clinical therapist is perhaps the least selfish career path I can take. And getting a proper education to facilitate this, my career aspiration, is not egotistical, or bastardly, or whatever else. Don't lecture me about not being a good person merely because I don't want to work retail or be in the restaurant business. My character and expertise would be wasted flipping burgers. Period. — Heister Eggcart

Those people can downgrade and still easily live a much more privileged and luxurious life than the vast majority. — Sapientia

Just to afford my modest studio-sized, one-bedroom apartment (which was one of the cheapest I could find on the market in my area, and which I can just about afford), I have had to pay about 75% of my basic wages each month into a savings account set up for the next 6 months rent. (I have to pay 6-months-worth of rent in advance every 6 months because my salary means that I fail the letting agent's test of affordability). I'd say I'm one of those "just about managing" people. But if I were to downgrade, my options would be considerably more limited and much less desirable: shared accommodation, move back to mum's place... — Sapientia

When I started working in 1971, I earned about $390 a month--working for a Catholic college. $90 went to rent an efficiency near the college, I had a small loan to repay, and then the usual expenses. I managed to save by living frugally, which I more or less did from then on out. However, I didn't have children, I didn't own a car (can't drive), and I always rented cheaply so I wasn't tied into housing costs that couldn't be reduced on short notice. As a result, I was never close to being broke (by my standards, anyway). As my income increased, I was cautious about improving living standards, and was always prepared to cut costs abruptly when adverse circumstances came along. — Bitter Crank

What one can't do is save money on any income while regularly upgrading one's quality of life to match the larger paycheck. For instance, a bump in wages may lead someone to begin buying lunch every day, plus expensive coffees, instead of bringing one's lunch and drinking the office coffee. One can spend $5000 a year (or more) doing that. Substantially uppgrading housing as one's income rises sounds the death knell of savings. So does having several children, even if both parents are working and being somewhat thrifty, especially in a high cost area. — Bitter Crank

See, told ya you're a reactionary! ;) — Sapientia

Well, unlike yourself, I'm probably not one of the best educated people on the planet, but I'm sure I could teach them a thing or two in the hope of removing their head from their arse and putting things into perspective. — Sapientia

Where can I make a donation to those earning £80,000 or more who struggle to make ends meet? Anyone know of any such charities? Agustino's comments have been pulling on my heart strings. — Sapientia

I'm not saying that, but government can help, and depending on which party is in government, they'll likely do more to help or less. Voting for what's in your best interest as a small business would be a start. — Sapientia

That's not your only recourse. The government can intervene in helpful ways. For example, it recently came to light that Tesco deliberately and repeatedly withheld money owed to suppliers to boost its sales performance artificially, in a serious breach of supermarket regulations. In response, Labour has come up with a plan to crackdown on late payments. — Sapientia

By that definition pretty much everyone is "struggling" just by virtue of having to work, so it's not particularly helpful. — Baden

Be a good Christian, Agustino. — Michael

What possible privation would you attribute to someone earning 80K a year? — Baden

And these people are not typical, and not struggling in anything like the same way, and do not deserve anywhere near the same amount of sympathy. — Sapientia

Nope. That's about what my Brother has been earning in the most expensive part of the UK (London) over the past 10-15 years and he's saved enough to buy several houses and flats in Ireland which he now rents out. He's not even remotely struggling. — Baden

#1 is tax law. The rich are protected by a variety of laws which allow, enable, and encourage them to evade taxation. — Bitter Crank

#2 is finance. The rich are able to benefit from the manipulations of currency, stock, interest rates, etc. — Bitter Crank

#3 is the control their wealth enables them to exercise over economies; the rich get richer because they are running the show. — Bitter Crank

Entrepreneurs who are aiming for the "original accumulation" might walk the concrete trying to find people to buy their ideas. Yes, some do, and a few become colossally rich -- like Bill Gates. Most of them succeed on a much, much more modest scale, or they fail and try something else. — Bitter Crank

One of our problems is that the extreme disproportionate distribution of wealth hurts young, gifted, and greedy entrepreneurs as well as low-wage workers. The rich and the super-rich have tied up so much money that the masses of wage earning workers, small businesses, and institutions do not have access to enough cash to buy some of these great new ideas some people are trying to peddle. — Bitter Crank

The fact is, most people (no matter their performance in most degree programs) require, receive, and learn their trade in On-the-Job-Training (OJT). High schools, trade schools, and colleges can give you some, a moderate supply, or lots of basic skills, but in the end you have to learn how to use what you have got doing the job

I've been receiving dental care at the U of MN College of Dentistry for about 30 years, and have had everyone from first year dental students to post docs working in my mouth, From what I've seen and heard, it's pretty clear that once they learn some head and neck anatomy before they start trying to anesthetize, say, the lower left jaw (they practice on each other before they practice on patients); it's pretty much OJT from then on. What the teachers are telling the first year students is not theoretical, it's how to do the job. Then the instructor comes round every 20 minutes or so to see how they are doing. At the end of the very long appointments, the job is done well, but slowly. Students at the end of their training (third year) are much faster, more confident, and get little supervision. Post docs get consultations more than supervision. OJT.

The same is true in less technical fields too. — Bitter Crank

I would like the 5% of the population who have sucked up a hideously disproportionate share of the wealth — Bitter Crank

I work as a musician, composer and arranger. — Terrapin Station

No, it isn't, it's called fairness — Sapientia

But it's not punishment, it's a fairer method of being able to implement a policy which will be a benefit to society. — Sapientia

No, that's a terrible idea. That would be elitist. Decisions should be made in the interest of those who will be effected by them, not in the interest of a privileged class at the expense of the less well off. — Sapientia

So? These things are obviously of great benefit to society as a whole, and they're essential for most. The needs of the many outweigh the interests of a privileged minority who don't have to rely upon these vital public services. — Sapientia

The UK is the fifth largest economy in the world. We've had higher taxes in the past, and we were still raking it in. Yes, there will probably be some who will take their wealth elsewhere, but there won't be a mass exodus, and we can manage without them. The way we're currently headed is a race to the bottom, which will only benefit those at the top at the expense of the rest of society. This wealth doesn't trickle down to those who need it most. — Sapientia

No, it isn't, it's called fairness. What possible alternative are you suggesting? Equal tax for all, regardless of income, assets, status, and so on? — Sapientia

No, I don't think you are. Is it the university's fault that you got an education just to be a construction worker? — Heister Eggcart

Again, you're trying to pigeon-hole your failed education experience into a macro problem for everyone, which is dubious thinking. In fact, I'm going to start a thread about this topic, since none of this has anything to do with Question's OP. — Heister Eggcart

I don't know how you got your job, or any job you've had in the past. If you're gonna hipfire how simple everything is, don't be so bummed when someone like me slams you with equally dismissive replies. — Heister Eggcart

Credit enough not to land me a decent job, yeah. I'd be pretty well off if I could only tap into my Americaness, and my whiteness, and my maleness, and my <insert any other supposed privilege> — Heister Eggcart

systems in place that are supposed to ensure such success — Heister Eggcart

Again, "just go start your own business, hur dur" is equivalent to the person who laughs at my unemployment and just says, "lul, you have a degree that can't land you a job? Stop complaining, there are so many jobs out there! Like, you could flip burgers at McTrump's!" — Heister Eggcart

Okay, Joel Osteen. I'm sure you'll want a tithe before you share your secret expertise, amirite? — Heister Eggcart

If I train myself to be a doctor and cannot be a doctor, for whatever the reasons, then I'm not making that work — Heister Eggcart

the position where I have to be a slut and sell myself to any career path that enables immediate money, however much that may be. — Heister Eggcart

the reason that there are specialized fields to begin with is to make available for those that would want it a career path that is narrowed and focused on a niche — Heister Eggcart

If one gets training in field x, they worked in field x. That's it. No reworking, no retooling, no, "lawl, just find something else to do, hehe XD". To NOT place someone in the field that they have experience in would have been seen as complete and utter madness. — Heister Eggcart

It merely means that that safety net needs to be worked on, not for people to treat those who are trying to go after specific careers they'd like to work in as being lazy, unreasonable asswagons. — Heister Eggcart

Paying tax isn't a punishment. It's a necessity. — Michael

So, what, the more tax you pay the more votes you get? That's not a democracy; it's an oligarchy. And if all the power rests with a small number of the most wealthy then you end up with something like Russia. Is that really the sort of society you want to live in? — Michael

The rich don't get sick or suffer injuries? — Michael

They don't have bins in their houses that need to be emptied? — Michael

They don't drive anywhere? They don't require an army to protect them from foreign invasion? — Michael

Or a police force to protect them from would-be burglars? — Michael

Or an independent judiciary to ensure that business contracts and the like are honoured? Their properties never catch fire? — Michael

They still live and work in the US or the UK or France or wherever. So I really don't understand what you're trying to argue here. — Michael