Ok, Let me try it this way, does fastest, most intelligent, strongest, closest to the four omnis, always result in a need to impose totalitarian or autocratic control/dominion over anything less? — universeness

You ask such as:

why would C take any notice of A?— 180 Proof

For a myriad of possible reasons, imo:

I know that hand waving points away is not normally your style ...

Seriously, I believe humans are capable of good reasoning based on truth, but I also think that requires an education that we are not getting. — Athena

If you think that ASI is impossible for us to comprehend then how do you know it won't be completely benevolent towards all lifeforms. — universeness

Of course I would say that the leadership of Hamas thinks far more like Bibi Netanyahu. That with talk you won't achieve peace. Appeasement is failure. Hence the stand of Hamas that Israel shouldn't exist. — ssu

I thought you had assigned some significant credibility to my suggestion that in the future, humans will live their life span, as they do now (also enjoying any extra longevity science is able to offer, without too much invasive augmentation) ... — universeness

... and then if death is immanent they can choose to merge with AGI/ASI intelligence and become a hybrid org/mecha symbiont.

Why do you think this is so unlikely?

... true believer optimism ... Roddenberryesque utopia ... I say all this as someone who once said the things you [@universeness] say. I recognize it now for what it was: fanaticism. — Jamal

No serious critic of Israel is going to condone Hamas' targeting of civilians, but understand that the actions committed by Hamas - so often labeled as terrorist - have also been committed twentyfold by the Israeli government, which has indiscriminately killed Palestinian civilians, including children and the elderly, or knowingly murdered journalists and medics [with] impunity. According to UN's OCHA, from 2008-2023 (excluding the October 2023 Conflict) Palestinian causalities exceed Israeli by 21x, while Palestinian injuries exceed Israeli injuries by nearly 24x. It is equally unserious for discussion to exclude this essential context, in addition to the horrific apartheid conditions that Israeli has imposed including severe restriction on travel, an air, sea and land blockade, which placed restrictions on the goods and services that can enter including medical goods and services, food, water and energy. This is an undeniable form of quotidian violence. Furthermore, of the two million Palestinians approximately half are under 19 years old, with over half the entire population living under the poverty line - a direct result of Israel's blockade. What precisely is the onus of responsibility assumed by a territory comprised primarily of minors? — Maw

Come join we optimists, we miss you and Vera, we need you both with us!
The solar system will remain insignificant, if we optimists are too small in number and too low in volume to be heard above the din of despair. — universeness

The limits of my language are the limits of my world because my 'belief' is the meaningstructure of the world, not something 'in' me. — plaque flag

That you don't know what it means is your reality and not my reality! — Ali Hosein

your reality — Ali Hosein

Good luck. — Ali Hosein

Perhaps you can share any thought you might have on Spinoza's perspectivism, and connections to Wittgenstein's 'I am my world.' — plaque flag

I have used "beyond" here to mean beyond the limit of cognition and beyond our cognitive apparatus. — Ali Hosein

beyond reality — Ali Hosein

About Spinoza, I am not sure that substance is the same as reality ...

My belief is that the Israelis want peace and their enemies do not. — tim wood

You can't keep humiliating and beating people to death, over and over, and expect nothing. — Manuel

Try to get through life as joyfully as possible while doing others and the planet as little harm as possible. — Vera Mont

This is a declaration "X" and "fact" are mutually exclusive. — ucarr

First of all, "flourishing" is too vague. What do you mean by it? — Jerry

Human flourishing (i.e. optimization of common agency via reduction of individual harms). — 180 Proof

... the flourishing you seem to be proposing, which is to make the human species as a whole "flourish", in terms of reducing harm and promoting good will towards others. — Jerry

One of the worst judgements of humankind is that humans are not objects, that they are something other than, something over and above the thing itself. I wager that no other idea has given a greater motive toward the destruction of these objects. — NOS4A2

I now prefer more virtue-based ethics than consequentialism ... — Jerry

I'll just go ahead and ask, why ought this be the goal? You say the grounding for it is, from what I understand, supporting our own survival — Jerry

Against us, no other species has a chance. Against us, neither have we. — Vera Mont

What should be the goal of a moral system? — Jerry

What is the grounding for the moral system, ...?

... and if we aren't obligated to do good deeds, why should good deeds happen?

The dinos had between 165 and 177 million years of existence on the Earth. What did they achieve? — universeness