• Deep Songs
    ↪Olivier5
    :lol: :up: I lived in Atlanta on and off for over a decade and I never heard that but it sounds right to my carpetbagger ears (especially since the B-52s were from nearby Athens, GA).
  • What are you listening to right now?

    "Happy Blues" Live at Ronnie's Scott's (6:00)
    Ella in London, 1974
    writer Ella Fitzgerald
    performers Ella Fitzgerald w/ theTommy Flanagan Quartet:
    - Tommy Flanagan - piano
    - Joe Pass - guitar
    - Keter Betts - double bass
    - Bobby Durham - drums

    NB: The last of three tunes I hope someone makes sure get played at my funeral – the other two (in order) are "Gin and Juice" by Snoop Dogg & "Born Under A Bad Sign" by Jimi Hendrix. :smirk:
  • Deep Songs
    ↪Olivier5
    :clap: "Tin. Roof. Rusted!"
  • Deep Songs
    ↪Hanover
    :cool: :up:
    I seem to recall it was my senior year in high school (c1980) when Mr. Waters' gave me this "short sharp shock" ... of recognition(?). I must have spent the next few years rummaging through his sonic night-sweats and melodic fevers of Pink Floyd's albums from Meddle to The Final Cut, an ordeal that didn't quite "destroy" me, but left me (as the Joker said in his best Freddy parody) a little stranger by the mid-80s – my lost decade.
    … I've got a little black book with my poems in
    Got a bag with a toothbrush and a comb in
    When I'm a good dog, they sometimes throw me a bone in

    … I got elastic bands keepin' my shoes on
    Got those swollen-hand blues
    I got thirteen channels of shit on the T.V. to choose from
    I've got electric light
    And I've got second sight
    I got amazing powers of observation
    And that is how I know
    When I try to get through
    On the telephone to you
    There'll be nobody home

    … I've got the obligatory Hendrix perm
    And the inevitable pinhole burns
    All down the front of my favorite satin shirt
    I've got nicotine stains on my fingers
    I've got a silver spoon on a chain
    Got a grand piano to prop up my mortal remains

    … I've got wild staring eyes
    And I've got a strong urge to fly
    But I got nowhere to fly to
    Ooh, babe when I pick up the phone

    … there's still nobody home

    … I've got a pair of Gohills boots
    But I got fading roots

    "Nobody Home" (3:20)
    The Wall, 1979 (live 1980?)
    lyrics Roger Waters
    Pink Floyd
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    READ FIRST
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/FBI_search_of_Mar-a-Lago
    IFF YOU CAN "HANDLE THE TRUTH." :mask:

    ↪NOS4A2
    1. The "raid" wasn't "unannounced". His residence was not "raided".

    2. Two of Individual-1's lawyers were present on the premises the entire time and was obligated to contact her client as soon as the warrant was served (Eric Trump got the call).. Individual-1 knew the FBI was at Mar a Lago as soon as they had arrived that morning and watched some of the search remotely via live feed through surveillance cameras.

    3. The Federal search warrant was not authorized by the Attorney General. Merrick Garland had only approved (signed-off on) his Prosecutor's filing for the warrant with the Federal District Court.

    4. I stand corrected: Judge Reinhart was previously a defense attorney in matters related to Jeffrey Epstein, Individual-1's deceased pedophile trafficking BFF (once upon a ride on the "Lolita Express" ago)

    https://www.businessinsider.com/judge-bruce-reinhart-fbi-search-warrant-trump-mar-a-l
    During his time as a federal prosecutor, Reinhart worked on the case against now-deceased Jeffrey Epstein, a convicted sex offender.

    But, he switched sides in the middle of the case, quitting the US Attorney's office and going on to defend several of Epstein's employees.     — Business Insider, 11August2022
    In other words, while not a Trump appointee, Judge Reinhart is not a "Democratic operative" or evangelical "Never Trumper" either. No "witchunt", Trumptards! :victory: :sweat:
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    ↪NOS4A2
    :eyes: :roll: :mask:
    It is the responsibility of intellectuals to speak the truth and expose lies. — Noam Chomsky
    I know this ain't your superpower, NOS, but try to process the following inconvenient truth:

    • A Trump appointed Federal Prosecutor in South Florida issued the search and seizure warrant after Trump's lawyers lied in writing about Trump having any more US government documents in June.

    • A Federal District Magistrate Judge appointed by Trump cconsidered the Trump appointed Federal Prosecutor's showing of probable cause and granted legal authority to the FBI to execute the search and seizure warrant.

    • A Director of the FBI appointed by Trump signed-off on an team of agents to execute the warrant at Trump's residence.

    • Trump himself made the FBI search public lying that it was a sudden evening "raid" when, in fact, the search and seizure warrant was executed around 9 am and concluded around 6:30 pm.

    • One of Trumps' attorneys was present the entire time the FBI team was searching and retrieving evidence from Mar-a-Lago.

    • The FBI agents were dressed as civilians, without and "FBI" identifying markings on their jackets or vehicles. Neither the FBI nor DoJ publicized that they executed search and seizure warrant at Trump's residence.

    This was not a "raid". These are facts as the Trump appointed FBI Director and US DoJ have recited them and have been corroborated by Trump's attorneys and by South Florida media and police. As for the warrant itself, read "Attachment A" and weep (relevant section on crimes for which there was probable cause cited here:

    https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/728607

    Since Friday, Trump has shut his piehole and gone dark (though his fundraising operations have gone on full tilt ripping-off mindless MAGAnauts who love to be lied to like you, NOS :rofl:) because it's thoroughly explained to Trump that he is now irreparably fucked and that "the deep state" TRUMP HAD HELPED MAKE WITH HIS APPOINTMENTS has finally "got" him ... the way they "got" e.g. Al Capone, John Gotti & Saddam Hussein.

    The old orange fascist conman has fucked around one too many times and has now found out. So, @NOS4A2 (TPF's resident alt-Right, MAGA-clown), STFU with your cluster-FOX'd Noise AND STFD. :shade:

    Update: correction of factual errors.
  • Currently Reading
    ↪T Clark
    :ok:
  • What type of forum is this?
    ↪jgill
    :smirk:
  • The paradox of omniscience
    ↪Kuro
    :up:
  • Currently Reading
    ↪T Clark
    "Creepy"?
  • Currently Reading
    ↪T Clark

    Not yet, I just started. I'll let you know. Check out her wiki
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karen_Barad
    and the synopsis of her "agential realism". I'm interested in her "feminism" only insofar as she grounds it in (her) ontology, which is new to me (in this formulation).
  • Currently Reading
    ↪_db
    :cool: :up:
  • Currently Reading
    • Meeting the Universe Halfway: Quantum Physics and the Entanglement of Matter and Meaning, Karen Barad
    • Critical Realism: An Introduction to Roy Bhaskar's Philosophy, Andrew Collier

    ↪Daniel
    :up:
  • What type of forum is this?
    I use this well-moderated forum to discuss problematic questions raised or answers given in a variety of topics. Many members do likewise, giving and taking reasons in order to learn something or to help others learn, but too many also ask IMO idle or merely tedious wiki/google-like pedantic questions which tend to detract from rather than promote fruitful discussions.

    Also, some merely preach – not discuss – their pet dogmas (they can be fun to rope-a-dope occasionally) which are almost always as uninformed as they are uninformative, just earnest sophistries of rationalized woo-of-the-gaps (i.e. magical thinking), pseudoscience, ideological biases (i.e. propaganda) and other flagrant irrationalities. And apparently some are here just for argumentative point-scoring and/or to incorrigibly troll discussions they do not understand.

    This forum is like a rowdy neighborhood / college bar – agora – where some revelers do not know how to drink or dance or socialize, needing to be cut-off and eventually tossed-out by the bouncers. Come for some intellectual company, stay for the dialectic, and contribute to the never-ending symposium (à la Plato) :party: – do Q&A homework, preach pet dogmas, and spew sophistries elsewhere! – I say. :victory: :smirk:
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    @Benkei –

    The stated predicates for the 8 August 2022 search and seizure warrant for Individual-1's Florida residence is recovery of evidence of the following (ongoing) Federal crimes:
    18 USC 793 (re: Espionage Act) > min. 10 years in prison / offense

    18 USC 2071(re: to hide, damage or destroy Government Records) > max. 3 years in prison / offense + lifetime ban from federal office

    18 USC 1519 (re: to falsify, destroy or cover up government records to Obstruct ... Justice) max. 20 years in prison / offense

    Addendum to
    ↪180 Proof
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    :clap: :rofl: hey trumptards ...

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/aug/13/nuclear-or-not-classified-or-not-mar-a-lago-files-spell-out-jeopardy-for-trump

    happy friday :party:
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    (@NOS4A2)

    Hey Trumptards, this is what TREASON looks like:

    https://www.politico.com/news/2022/08/12/search-warrant-shows-trump-under-investigation-for-potential-obstruction-of-justice-espionage-act-violations-00051507

    LOCK PUTIN'S BITCH UP! :mask:
  • The paradox of omniscience
    Or maybe it really is the case that it’s possible to be wrong even if you know everything. — Michael
    Yeah, in other words, 'knowing everything' that is true, not-true & unknowable.

    And I think certainty is only possible if the truth is necessary, so non-fallible omniscience requires that all truths are necessary. — Michael
    I don't think knowledge entails "certainty" (Peirce-Dewey, Popper-Taleb); only logic & mathematics (i.e. tautologous syntactic transformation systems) produce "necessary truths" (Spinoza, Hume, Witty).
  • The paradox of omniscience
    We then conclude that I could be wrong even if I know everything (and assuming that some p is not necessarily true): — Michael
    Couldn't we be "wrong" about this conclusion?

    Doesn't knowledge presuppose the fallibility of knowing?

    Wouldn't "omniscience" consist in (1) knowing the entire set of non-truths and (2) knowing that truths belong to a subset of the set of non-truths (corollary: knowing what we do not know (contra – not knowing what we do not know))?
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    ↪Benkei
    Yeah, but no pardon for state & local crimes or relief from payouts to plaintiffs in dozens of civil lawsuits to come. If all that doesn't make Melania a widow sooner rather than later, this p-o-s will die savagely broke and maybe even in prison too. :pray: :sweat:
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    ↪Benkei
    Yes.
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    @Benkei –

    If Putin's bitch has kept in his unsecure residence "top secret" documents concerning US Nuclear Weapons (or those of foreign powers), then there is no question he has violated the Espionage Act of 1917. Upon the release today (or sometime soon) of the search warrant for Mar-a-Lago, tr45h will be exposed for the traitorous clear and present danger to the US (at least) he has seemed to be since 2017 and therefore unelectable as well as, once prosecuted, disqualified from holding any Federal office.

    Consider:
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-espionage-act-fbi-raid-b2142685.html

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Espionage_Act_of_1917

    update: Besides the potential crime noted above, the Atomic Energy Act of 1946 also comes into play if, in fact, nuclear documents were found among the two dozen or so boxes Individual-1 stole from the US government. Deep shit. :eyes: :fire:

    Addendum to
    ↪180 Proof


    update:
    https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/728496
  • Bannings
    ↪Hanover
    :rofl:
  • James Webb Telescope
    ↪Banno
    :starstruck:
  • Shamanism is the root of all spiritual, religious and philosophical systems
    God" is an elementary religious subterfuge used by all the religions. — javi2541997
    :100:
  • Evidence of Consciousness Surviving the Body
    VVLTP :mask:

    Death, therefore, the most awful of evils, is nothing to us, seeing that, when we are, death is not come, and when death is come, we are not. — Letter to Menoeceus, 3rd century BC
    ... the greater the damage to the brain, the greater the corresponding damage to the mind. The natural extrapolation from this pattern is all too clear – obliterate brain functioning altogether, and mental functioning too will cease. — The Myth of an Afterlife, 2015

    https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/586454
  • TPF Quote Cabinet
    Under the rubric of 'Wisdom': — Torus34
    Why buy when you can rent the cow?
    Why rent the cow when you can borrow her milk?
    Why borrow her milk when you can steal some?
    But why steal when you can live without?

    Thus Spoke 180 Proof

    Ultimately, it is the desire, not the desired, that we love. — Beyond Good and Evil
    :fire:

    You may be a lover,
    but you ain't no dancer!     — Macca '68
  • Your Absolute Truths
    ↪dimosthenis9
    Yep. Not paying attention. :roll:
  • Your Absolute Truths
    ↪dimosthenis9
    Your question makes no sense as I've pointed out. My stuff ain't "complicated", dimo, you're just not paying / refusing to pay attention. NB: philosophical discussion or dialectic =/= casual (barstool) conversation.
  • Your Absolute Truths
    ↪dimosthenis9
    No. I take "my existence" – that I exist – for granted and "me taking for granted" itself presupposes "my existence" but does not prove it (pace Descartes). "My existence" does not require "proof" or to be demonstrated as a truth – "absolute" or otherwise; assuming so is a category error.
  • Is the mind divisible?
    You say 'talking meat', I prefer 'embodied mind'. — unenlightened
    :smirk:
  • Your Absolute Truths
    ↪dimosthenis9
    At most Descartes' "cogito" presupposes existence; it does not prove "ergo sum" (therefore I exist).
  • Your Absolute Truths
    I think, therefore my thought exists (Is that right?) — T Clark
    Thinking (happens), therefore thinking exists.
  • Your Absolute Truths
    Have you heard of Poincaré's recurrence theorem? In short: a closed system in thermodynamic equilibrium will (if you wait long enough) randomly reach a state of lower entropy, And then increase again, so you get fluctuations in entropy. Moreover, if I may refer to one of my favourite little books "The Character of Physical Law" Feynman makes a good case for physical laws to be symmetrical and therefore in theory allowing for objects to fall upwards, time to flow in reverse and entropy to decrease. — Benkei
    Yes, I'm familiar with some of Poincaré's and more of Feynman's works, and while I won't quarrel with these scientific geniuses, I'll point out that these are (no doubt, highly informed) speculations at best and, as far as I know, have no experimental / applied bearing on non-equilibrium statistical mechanics, physical cosmology or information science.
  • TPF Quote Cabinet
    One must say Yes to life and embrace it whenever it is found — and it is found in terrible places; nevertheless, there it is. For nothing is fixed, forever and forever and forever, it is not fixed; the earth is always shifting, the light is always changing, the sea does not cease to grind down rock. Generations do not cease to be born, and we are responsible to them because we are the only witnesses they have. The sea rises, the light fails, lovers cling to each other, and children cling to us. The moment we cease to hold each other, the moment we break faith with one another, the sea engulfs us and the light goes out. — James Baldwin
  • Is the mind divisible?
    ↪TiredThinker

    I imagine that a hemispherectomy ain’t no walk in the park either. — praxis
    One side-effect of split-brain surgery is two distinct minds (i.e. phenomenal self models) with personalities which can diverge over time. Also, split personality disorder demonstrates the "divisibility" of human mind.
  • Your Absolute Truths
    ↪noAxioms
    :up:
  • Your Absolute Truths
    ↪T Clark
    At most, IME, Descartes only "proved"
    cogitatio fit, ergo cogitatio est, not that "I exist".
  • What do normative/moral terms mean on a realist construal?
    Although, im sure from the perspective of the Nazi, there was indeed sufficient meaning and purpose to justify such suffering. — Cartesian trigger-puppets
    I think conspiratorial rationalizations are never "sufficient ... to justify suffering" and mass murder. :brow:
  • What do normative/moral terms mean on a realist construal?
    For example, would you say that the holocaust was bad? — Cartesian trigger-puppets
    No. The Shoah was evil.

    If yes, are you saying that it was bad because the things that happened there go against your desires?
    No. The fascists systematic mass murder was against "the desires" (Spinoza's conatus) of their victims & the survivors as well as further dehumanized themselves as co-conspirators & perpetrators.

    Or, the desires of those afflicted?
    Yes. See above.

    Was it bad independent from any desires?
    If by "desire" you mean preference, taste, attachment, lust, greed or the like, then I say yes. If, however, you're referring to fundamental, or intrinsic, 'drive to persist in one's being' (Spinoza's conatus), then I say no – nothing "morally bad" is "independent" of increasing diminishment or causing destruction of 'the drive to persist in one's being' (i.e. gratuitous suffering).
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