These are both informal fallacies, not logical fallacies. — Banno

Can you explain how this relates to the OP? Have I made some mistakes in the above?

I thought at one time I would be happier and healthier in an institution. I don’t think so anymore. — Noah Te Stroete

What made you think so? I'm looking for a place to stay for the rest of my life or such.

I just don't know how much it would cost and where exactly; but, the plan is to completely resign myself from society.

Rational people are not always good, nor are all rational minds, acts, etc. So, I'm not sure what you're aiming at here. — creativesoul

No, it's treating the sentence: What is good is rational, as an empirical or truth-apt sentence, that gives rise to the above.

Hey man, I got committed to a psych unit for a week due to a psychotic break. I'm no good for society and am currently looking for a permanent place to commit myself, though, out of the country.

Sorry to hear about your struggles.

I'm so broken that I need to get into some sanatorium or such.

Anyway, I don’t care if you think I’m crazy. — Noah Te Stroete

I'm in the same boat or rather I know, that I am mentally ill.

How has meditation helped you in terms of emotional resilience to negative outcomes? I wish I could meditate more; but, lately, I am somewhat phased by recent unfortunate events.

Also, go fuck yourself, you smug prick. — Noah Te Stroete

Uhh, what? And, I didn't mean to ignore you. Sorry!

Reification (also known as concretism, or the fallacy of misplaced concreteness) is a fallacy of ambiguity, when an abstraction (abstract belief or hypothetical construct) is treated as if it were a concrete, real event, or physical entity.[1] In other words, it is the error of treating as a "real thing" something which is not a real thing, but merely an idea. For example: if the phrase "holds another's affection", is taken literally, affection would be reified.

Another common manifestation is the confusion of a model with reality. Mathematical or simulation models may help understand a system or situation but real life always differs from the model.

Note that reification is generally accepted in literature and other forms of discourse where reified abstractions are understood to be intended metaphorically,[1] but the use of reification in logical arguments is usually regarded as a fallacy. For example, "Justice is blind; the blind cannot read printed laws; therefore, to print laws cannot serve justice." In rhetoric, it may be sometimes difficult to determine if reification was used correctly or incorrectly.

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In philosophical ethics, the term naturalistic fallacy was introduced by British philosopher G. E. Moore in his 1903 book Principia Ethica.[1] Moore argues it would be fallacious to explain that which is good reductively, in terms of natural properties such as pleasant or desirable.

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Does that help?

Yes, if we changed many aspects of society things would be better for those who have mental health issues. — Isaac

Can you provide your thoughts about the specific type of change that would allow those with mental disorders or issues to lead a more fulfilling life?

On point... :ok:

If someone comes to a psychologist with, say depression, they can hardly say "Oh, that's because you don't have any meaningful employment, let me just pop off and get you a really rewarding job, back in a minute". — Isaac

But, that's how they treated a Vietnamese farmer who stepped on a land mine in Vietnam. The psychologists bought him a dairy cow and his depression was resolved...

Depends on what you mean by give up. I thought you meant suicide or something like that. If you just mean move away from society and live by yourself...then no, society doesnt owe you support or anything else. Society is a social contract we make with each other, if you choose not to participate in that social contract then yes youbare on your own. — DingoJones

Generally speaking, by "giving up" I mean, the rejection of commonly held values that guide Western economically driven sociopolitical mechanisms of incentives and disincentives that shape or to some degree govern human behavior in those particular societies.

Sorry for causing anxiety to some; but, it really worries me to what lengths some will go for absolute domination.

And then there's this:

https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/search/site/psychotronic

Uhh, verging on the loony; but, has anyone seen the movie The Men Who Stare at Goats?

I too am afraid God might exist. That is why I read the bible and try to distill its perennial wisdom. — Nils Loc

God is incomprehensible. We should drop Jesus' name more.

Bleh!

What kind of duress? — Judaka

Emotional, financial?

Do your expectations match your composure under duress? I can't say much about myself in that manner. :confused:

How durable are you if you don't mind me asking? — Qwex

Not very. It sounds like a different hell.

I actually can't wait for your suffering to end.

You sound like a human who has suffered enough. — Qwex

Yes, and I can see that you are suffering too. I hope your suffering ends in a non-dramatic and totally cool manner.

(Antipsychotics sometimes cause akasthesia, a hellish state of being...)

Call it falling to hell, or picture it as you, right now, suffering. Up to you. — Qwex

Yeah, well, I suffered enough in my life, and I made the personal decision, that I won't try anymore.

I don't feel bad about it, would you?

I mean, you might be being punished. — Qwex

That's incomprehensible. Will the secrets of my own mind reveal itself after I die, or do I read a book and fly to the moon to go to heaven?

That sort of line of reasoning is gibberish.

Nothing wrong with giving up, thats someones personal choice. — DingoJones

But, wait. Here's the point.... Should people who have "given up", be, supported by society anymore, or left to fend for themselves?

Maybe you're meant to feel this way. — Qwex

Ontological placeholders aside, what do you mean by that?

Maybe giving up is the quick way out. — Qwex

You know, I feel your vibe here, coming as an SZ put on two antipsychotics; but, giving up is not really the quick way out. The quick way out is put simply suicide, and that position is self-refuting and untenable.

No ones to blame. Thats just being dealt a bad hand, an unlucky toss of the dice. — DingoJones

Yeah, so, if it is, then what's wrong with giving up?

An interesting side thought seems to me to be that in places where society is left unchecked or immune from responsibility, and all liability is placed on the individual, then the issue becomes exacerbated.

Deja vu... — DingoJones

No, I mean seriously. IF some people are born abnormal or develop profound abnormalities in their life that prevent them from functioning adequately in society, then who's to blame for such an occurrence? The individual?

That would be unjust and wrong.

It's OK to give up.

That's something that does not get respected enough in society.

The hate is somewhat excessive, don't you guys think?

Hello, there!

I would instead say that the highest pleasure is for life to feel meaningful, the feeling I call ontophilia or love of being; and the meaning of life is to bring pleasure, to oneself and to others. — Pfhorrest

Aren't those quite high expectations? Maybe some can get by with less?

hedonism — TheMadFool

Hedonism has this ability to subsume everything. There is no way to refute it because, the most frequently presented "counter-examples" to it can easily be reworked into a form that is in its favor, just like you have. If I must say anything at this point is that a theory that explains everything explains nothing. — TheMadFool

:up:

OK, I've already begun preparing for another 4 years of this guy.

*happy thoughts*

I wanted to post a thread about Neuralink.

I am betting very hard on this technology to treat my psychiatric ailments. It is one of the very few things that gives me hope about the future.

I am honestly very tired of my schizophrenia, ADD, and profound depression, and this sounds like a Godsend just for me.

Anyone else waiting for this to become a standard procedure for those with disabilities?

I'd think the causes of suicide are very complex, and not quite as often caused by single events (like divorce, job loss, or incarceration), but by deeper emotional struggles. — Hanover

Sorry to get back to you so late; but, my mind works in mysterious ways even to myself.

I don't think it's that complex. See my other thread 'Against Suffering' as an example. If people constantly feel ill or unhappy to the point of suffering, then it seems to me that before C occurs, then we should strive to (not eliminate) or at least lessen the amount of suffering in the world.

What do you or others think?

What is your next line of thought or emotion when presented with such a harsh attitude towards life or one's self?

Mine is something like:

*Fuck!*

I’d rather follow a warrior than a poet. — Brett

:100:

What a failure of a life or has life been for me.

I need to fall in love now :flower:

Supposedly veterinarian people get the highest rated of suicide followed by dentists.

No idea where philosophers are on that list.

Not kidding. I mean my whole life I've lived by some ego ideal Stoic sage, and seem to have gotten lost in that escapade.

When you do turn inward like that all I can see are ego-ideals. Maybe I hate myself or something like that