My theory is that it's the same reason humans can't just sit quietly eating pumpkins. We lust for hardship. We need to risk life and limb. We need poignant wars. — frank
All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone — Pascal
:clap: :smirk:The whinger is an armchair warrior. It's a way of feeling a sense of purpose without expending so many calories. If so, then whinging might be the closest we can get to being a peaceful species.
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If I'm right, then socialism will require some sort of dysfunction that will create peaceful angst. I think there's a portion of society that won't be satisfied with that. The best option would be to send them off-world, to Mars maybe. — frank
This question is tied to a preoccupation I've developed around neoliberalism, which I think is partly fuelled by a desire to create strife in the same way a video game does. — frank
The whinger is an armchair warrior. It's a way of feeling a sense of purpose without expending so many calories. If so, then whinging might be the closest we can get to being a peaceful species. — frank
There's no need to, or as you say, "no escaping your historical contingency". So why are you trying to escape yours? why evangelize that – all the antinatal whinging about how – we all should escape our historical contingencies (i.e. somehow 'delete' or 'reprogram' our fundamental biological-pronatal hardwired software) when you know damn well we as a species cannot? :sweat:There's no escaping your historical contingency. Perhaps preventing future people born into it. What is the purpose of anyone being born to do anything at all in the ways of a society? Work, seek comfort, keep mind occupied, repeat. Who really needs to experience 80 to 100 years of that? — schopenhauer1
There's no escaping your historical contingency. — schopenhauer1
Same shit, different flies. Those who would "prevent others" would be trying to escape their own, as well as the species', historical contingency of being biological aka "reproductive species", which you admit, no one can escape. 'Existence preceeds essence', no? Well, species-beings are what we are preceeding the individuals who we (can) choose to be; individuals cannot escape being enabled-contrained by belonging to an evolved (i.e. adaptive, therefore reproductive) species. All "antinatal" (or less than pronatal) species are already extinct, schop1 – homo sapien sapiens ain't one of them (with the exception of an insignificant fraction of individuals aka "mutants").Prevent others from entering it. — schopenhauer1
Same shit, different flies. Those who would "prevent others" would be trying to escape their own, as well as the species', historical contingency of being biological aka "reproductive species", which you admit, no one can escape. 'Existence preceeds essence', no? Well, species-beings are what we are preceeding the individuals who we (can) choose to be; individuals cannot escape being enabled-contrained by belonging to an evolved (i.e. adaptive, therefore reproductive) species. All "antinatal" (or less than pronatal) species are already extinct, schop1 – homo sapien sapiens ain't one of them (with the exception of an insignificant fraction of individuals aka "mutants"). — 180 Proof
All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone — Pascal
"allows a person to enjoy themselves without a minimum threshold of stimulation that constantly needs to be maintained or increased." — Shawn
I’ve always been the kind of person who never gets bored, because my own mind is full of my own interesting thoughts to entertain me. I’ve also pretty much never even been tempted to do recreational drugs. Most all of my suffering in life has come from negative stimuli, not any absence of positive stimuli.
Most of 2019, I found myself suddenly and inexplicably struck with existential dread the likes of which I had never experienced before. It was only then that I understood what people talked about when they searched for a “meaning of life”. To me that had always seemed like a non-question, but suddenly I understood it, the feeling like there's some bottomless hole in one's soul that needs to be constantly filled by... something. From my perspective, it seemed the usual hedonic order had been flipped around: instead of feeling fine by default as long as nothing awful was happening, I felt awful by default unless some positive stimulus pushed me out of it, temporarily filled that hole inside of me, the hole that had never been there for my entire life before.
The thought that for a lot of people that empty feeling, the worst thing I’ve ever experienced in my life, is their normal, is terrible, and I’d love if something could be done to alleviate it for them.
I’ve also thought before that introversion and extroversion might be related to this, since from my introverted perspective, it seems to me like introverts are people who neither need to dump their excess emotions on others nor charge up on others’ emotions, maintaining emotional homeostasis alone, whereas extroverts need other people to give or take stimulation from them in order to achieve emotional balance. — Pfhorrest
Only in this sense am I an antinatalist (i.e. a "mutant") too. :up:You can prevent yet another person from the historical contingency. It'spreventionon the margins, not necessarily wholesale. — schopenhauer1
:ok:it seems to me like introverts are people who neither need to dump their excess emotions on others nor charge up on others’ emotions, maintaining emotional homeostasis alone, whereas extroverts need other people to give or take stimulation from them in order to achieve emotional balance. — Pfhorrest
Can you define neoliberalism as you're using it here. Generally, it means laissez-faire capitalism, free-trade, and globalization. — T Clark
If one can occupy himself with the battles in his skull he need not pay attention to the ones that require actual effor — NOS4A2
I think this method is inherent in socialism. It’s a false philanthropy because it seeks to delegate any duty we have to our fellow man to someone else, whether society as a whole or some other group. — NOS4A2
What followed was a global backlash. Manufacturing was replaced by finance. The power of labor was demolished. Regulations of all kinds diminished. Finally a new elite came into being as a result of what was supposed to be a return to freedom.
Read David Harvey's book on it. It's good. One of things it will tell you is why there are 5000 orphans on our southern border. — frank
The Unborn (or Never-To-Be-Born) cannot be "saved" because they don't exist to be "saved" — 180 Proof
Aww, you mean other people should sacrifice themselves for you?However, you have probably heard my idea of catharsis by now, right? There is a catharsis in antinatalism for us already born who can't escape the existential situation. There is something to the idea that we can communally recognize the negatives, and then are deciding to do something about it on an existential level (not just at the everyday micro level). It's more an aesthetic of understanding. — schopenhauer1
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