I think this guy is right-on. I wish there was more people like him in this forum.

I think this guy is right-on. I wish there was more people like him in this forum. — synthesis

If there were more people like him on this forum, the concept of "what makes up a "person"?" would no longer make sense.

so adding on (bad stuff that isn't even real) seems to this observer to be unnecessary, — synthesis

My former partner called it paying interest on a debt you may never owe. My wife calls it borrowing trouble. That's me, but I'm working on it.

This seminal quote from Mark Twain portrays (with searing accuracy) one of the major limitations of our human intellect (apologies to any other life-form looking in). Instead of living life the way is, our minds (those incredibly clever magicians) take reality and, without so much as a sleight-of-hand, create all kinds of illusions that define the majority of our lives.

Even the most balanced among us must contend with disappointment, loss, pain, illness, and death as part of of our everyday lives, so adding on (bad stuff that isn't even real) seems to this observer to be unnecessary, yet we often feel relieved when we discover that our rogue intellect has once again taken us down this short path to Hell. Instead, shouldn't our reaction be to correct this repeating nightmare?

The human condition seems to be one of non-acceptance of those things that people can do little about and acceptance of those things that people can do a great deal about. Seems as if this inversion needs to be turned right-side-up. What say you? — synthesis

Lisa Feldman Barrett describes an internal ‘scientific’ process of prediction, interaction, data, error and revision that is heavily influenced by affect - to the extent that we can either: change predictions to reflect the data, select only data that fits the prediction, ignore data and maintain that the prediction is reality, or simply focus on the data - depending on how we respond to prediction error (pain, loss, humiliation, etc) in particular situations.

I think perhaps there’s a certain attitude towards life, particularly in the current climate, that leans towards predictions of powerlessness. There is so much in our lives at the moment (for many of us) that confines and restricts our options, it’s easy to feel helpless - which then affects how we predict the world. If we have a tendency to ignore sensory data and rely mainly on existing conceptual structures for prediction, then we’re less likely to focus on correcting the repeating nightmare...

Instead of living life the way is, our minds (those incredibly clever magicians) take reality and, without so much as a sleight-of-hand, create all kinds of illusions that define the majority of our lives. — synthesis

Do you mean... imagination?

The human condition seems to be one of non-acceptance of those things that people can do little about and acceptance of those things that people can do a great deal about. Seems as if this inversion needs to be turned right-side-up. What say you? — synthesis

I think you overestimate the degree of acceptance of those things that people can do a great deal about. We tend to think that we have freewill but that is largely an illusion. We can pretend, of course, and that offers some comfort, but the truth is that we are conditioned beings and have relatively little control of anything. The best laid plans of men are mostly fairytales who's ultimate design is to make us feel good about ourselves.

The human condition seems to be one of non-acceptance of those things that people can do little about and acceptance of those things that people can do a great deal about. Seems as if this inversion needs to be turned right-side-up. What say you? — synthesis

Not sure this is relevant but I am always surprised by how significantly people get in their own way. They are free, yet think they are trapped. They have resources yet think they are impoverished. They have what they need for a happy life but chase knowledge and systems to try to get to.... wherever the hell they think they need to be.

I'm not normally a fan of Žižek but this point resonates for me.

The problem for us is not are our desires satisfied or not. The problem is how do we know what we desire.
― Slavoj Žižek

The way that saying came down to me was ‘my life has been a whole series of crises, most of which never occurred’. I always took it to mean that many of things I (and we) fret over in life are really pretty inconsequential, even though at the time they can seem frightening or all-consuming. I liked it’s self-deprecating humour as well. And it pairs with another of my favourite sayings, from John Lennon - ‘Life is what happens to you when you’re busy making other plans’.

I dunno, man. Ol’ Samuel might be the darling of folk psychology, but he’s a lousy logician, even granting for the moment the possibility the quote is definitively attributable to him and not passed down through the centuries, beginning with Seneca, at least.

If it is a thing in my life, regardless of its relative severity, how could it not have happened? And if only some of the worst things in my life never happened, what makes them different from some of the worst things in my life that did happen? If I know a worst thing because it happened, how would I know a worst thing that didn’t? If I can’t know a worst thing that never happened.....why mention it in the first place? I get the purpose of the exercise, really, I do. It is....how to imagine reaping a bountiful anthropological crop from a barren epistemological wasteland.

So we begin with the dubious “seminal quote” explicitly attributable to Clemens alone, and end with the falsehood of “searing accuracy”. But hey.....don’t mind me none. Y’all’ll have to pardon me whilst I lament the gross indignities forced upon proper philosophy.

(End Andy Rooney impersonation)

If it is a thing in my life, regardless of its relative severity, how could it not have happened?

Here's a story...

A man is lost out in the desert and his fate seemed sealed. After wandering aimlessly for three days in 120F temperatures, nightfall mercifully comes, temperatures drop, but he collapses having finally succumbed to severe dehydration.

By some miracle, the man reaches out and finds a container of water and greedily drinks the life-restoring liquid, then falls into deep sleep.

Upon arising refreshed and invigorated the next morning, the man is horrified as he notices that the container he had found was an animal skull and the liquid, purifying brain-matter. He immediately vomits the contents of his stomach and was dead in three hours.

...proper philosophy. — Mww

Your shit doesn't stink?

I think you overestimate the degree of acceptance of those things that people can do a great deal about. We tend to think that we have freewill but that is largely an illusion. We can pretend, of course, and that offers some comfort, but the truth is that we are conditioned beings and have relatively little control of anything. The best laid plans of men are mostly fairytales who's ultimate design is to make us feel good about ourselves. — praxis

That's the difference between people who concentrate on what is happening outside of themselves v. those who seek their meaning from within. On the outside it's you against The Universe. On the inside, it's you. Once the inside you gets its act together, then you can go outside of yourself and navigate The Universe with skill and purpose, focusing on the good and helping with the bad.

Instead of living life the way is, our minds (those incredibly clever magicians) take reality and, without so much as a sleight-of-hand, create all kinds of illusions that define the majority of our lives.
— synthesis

Do you mean... imagination? — Caldwell

Not necessarily, but that works. Our conceptual mind takes 'what is' and morphs it into 'what we think it is' or 'what we imagine it to be' or 'what we would like ti to be' or 'what we fear it is,' etc.

I think perhaps there’s a certain attitude towards life, particularly in the current climate, that leans towards predictions of powerlessness. There is so much in our lives at the moment (for many of us) that confines and restricts our options, it’s easy to feel helpless - which then affects how we predict the world. If we have a tendency to ignore sensory data and rely mainly on existing conceptual structures for prediction, then we’re less likely to focus on correcting the repeating nightmare... — Possibility

Prognostication might just be the most absurd thing people attempt. Although we cannot even understand the simplest of things, there are those who believe we can understand an infinite number of things things that led up to an infinite number of events, then calculate all the possibilities (and do it in real time) when everything is changing moment to moment.

I would think it would be easier to make love to the ten most beautiful women in the world (and you don't know any of them) before noon tomorrow.

If there were more people like him on this forum, the concept of "what makes up a "person"?" would no longer make sense. — Gus Lamarch

Of course, it doesn't make a great deal of sense as it is.

Not necessarily, but that works. Our conceptual mind takes 'what is' and morphs it into 'what we think it is' or 'what we imagine it to be' or 'what we would like ti to be' or 'what we fear it is,' etc. — synthesis

Yes, each one's interpretation of practical reality -- or practical life -- depends, for a good portion, on ones' mind. But it is not necessarily true that it is warped. You've heard of the expressions, "get a grip" or "down to earth", that we utter from time to time when we want a person to see things better. The other person could get frustrated why others couldn't see or feel what he's feeling -- dude, there are zombies around, people are running for their lives....no clean water!! How could you even be relaxed? Are you crazy?!
But there have been studies of intelligence that focus mainly on how accurate our assessment of practical reality is -- there are measurements that can determine whether our take on reality is very good. People have been correct in their assessment of life, of the world.

I hope what I'm saying makes sense.

Good post. But how to correct it? That's a really difficult question. What surprises me in certain circumstances is that despite knowing better, our minds still insist that we obsess over things which it makes no sense to obsess about. Either do something that will fix or alleviate the situation, if you can't or don't want to or whatever, then stop worrying, because there are solutions. If there are no solutions, then worrying does nothing either. In short, worrying is most of the time quite bad. Yet we still do it. It's pretty ridiculous.

I think you overestimate the degree of acceptance of those things that people can do a great deal about. We tend to think that we have freewill but that is largely an illusion. We can pretend, of course, and that offers some comfort, but the truth is that we are conditioned beings and have relatively little control of anything. The best laid plans of men are mostly fairytales who's ultimate design is to make us feel good about ourselves.
— praxis

That's the difference between people who concentrate on what is happening outside of themselves v. those who seek their meaning from within. On the outside it's you against The Universe. On the inside, it's you. Once the inside you gets its act together, then you can go outside of yourself and navigate The Universe with skill and purpose, focusing on the good and helping with the bad. — synthesis

False inside/outside narrative designed to make believers feel good about themselves, and that's okay.

I think I was lucky in a sense to grow up as a chess player. Although I'm completely done with 'the game of failures' now. The skills I learned were how to start thinking, how to stop it and every single possible detour my brains can take.
I studied poetry but why would I read or write if it doesn't make me happy?
Do what you love and what makes you happy seems the most difficult thing in the world.
Yet I wish it for all of us

* I want to add that you also shouldn't do what you hate and what makes you miserable *

False inside/outside narrative designed to make believers feel good about themselves, and that's okay. — praxis

Well, as long as it's ok. :)

Yes, each one's interpretation of practical reality -- or practical life -- depends, for a good portion, on ones' mind. But it is not necessarily true that it is warped. — Caldwell

There are many reasons why we cannot access reality, so it seems as if our minds have a mind of their own and just fill in the blanks, so to speak. Unfortunately, being human, most of us have a tendency to go south with the analysis and end of creating our own hell on Earth.