• Agent Smith
    9.5k


    A celestial dictatorship, a kind of divine North Korea. — Christopher Hitchens (atheist, author, journalist) :flower: :death: RIP

    God is The Supreme Fascist as per Paul Erdös (Hungarian mathematician :flower: :death: RIP).
  • Bartricks
    6k
    God is morally good by definition. A morally good person is not a dictator. Therefore, God is not a dictator. That is, God does not make people do as he wants.

    Look around you - are you in a world in which everyone is made to do as God wants? Clearly not. So, God is not a dictator. And we are not living in a divine dictatorship.

    What does a good, all powerful person do? They tell others to be kind and so on. But they do not make them be kind and so on. They 'could', of course, for they are omnipotent. But they do not have to (for they are omnipotent). And nor would they do so, for they are morally good and morally good people don't do that kind of thing.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    But they do not have to (for they are omnipotent).Bartricks

    Status: Approved

    I can shoot you, if I have a gun, but will I?

    Does God have free will?
  • Bartricks
    6k
    Does God have free will?Agent Smith

    Yes. He can do anything. Doesn't get much freer than that. Plus God clearly values free will and so would make sure he had it.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    Yes. He can do anything. Doesn't get much freer than that. Plus God clearly values free will and so would make sure he had it.Bartricks

    If you say so. :ok:
  • Bartricks
    6k
    No, it is manifest to reason. If you think God lacks free will, explain why (and do so without attributing to God something that contradicts the definition of God).
    And if you think God is a dictator, explain why without, once more, contradicting the definition of God. So explain how he is a dictator consistent with him being morally good. I think dictators are not morally good people - I don't think morally good people want to make other people do their bidding. Don't you?

    So, as God is good then he wouldn't behave in that way, would he? He wouldn't be a dictator. So he isn't.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    What's the difference between God and your garden variety dictator?
  • Bartricks
    6k
    What's the difference between God and your garden variety dictator?Agent Smith

    God is morally good and, as I have literally just told you, doesn't make people do his bidding.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    God is morally good and, as I have literally just told you, doesn't make people do his bidding.Bartricks

    Yes, you did say something, but it isn't necessarily true now is it?
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    Does God have free will?
    — Agent Smith

    Yes. He can do anything.
    Bartricks

    There's the link between free will & omnipotence. Thanks for bringing it to my attention, sir/madam, as the case may be. :up:
  • Bartricks
    6k
    That's true of anything anyone has ever said.

    I did not say that it was 'necessarily' true that God is not a garden variety dictator. I said he is not. And the basis of that belief is that God is morally good and garden variety dictators are not. I am having trouble understanding how you are not understanding this.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    I did not say that it was 'necessarily' trueBartricks

    Then you have no argument.
  • Bartricks
    6k
    What on earth are you on about? Here's the argument:

    1. If God is a dictator, then he is morally bad
    2. God is morally good
    3. Therefore God is not a dictator.

    Look, it's not my fault your view is so easily demonstrated to be confused. But confused it is.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    What's the difference between a dictator and God?

    The 10 COMMANDments!

    The situation is worse than I initially imagined it to be. We're practically slaves, God's our master.
  • Bartricks
    6k
    You are now confusing God with the bible.
    A good person is not a dictator. Thus, God is not a dictator.

    I assume you don't think it is morally good to be a dictator? If you think it is morally bad to be a dictator and you also think that God is a dictator, then you are having contradictory thoughts.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    You are now confusing God with the bible.Bartricks

    Am I now? Thanks for noticing.
  • Bartricks
    6k
    Yes, like most atheists, you confuse 'God' with 'Christianity' and think that hackneyed criticisms of Christianity can just be lazily peddled against anyone who defends God.

    Doesn't work. Once more: God is by definition morally good. Dictators are morally bad - and that's something you believe too, yes? So, God is not a dictator.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    Yes, like most atheists, you confuse 'God' with 'Christianity' and think that hackneyed criticisms of Christianity can just be lazily peddled against anyone who defends God.

    Doesn't work. Once more: God is by definition morally good. Dictators are morally bad - and that's something you believe too, yes? So, God is not a dictator.
    Bartricks

    You're right!
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    Omnipotence = Dictator
    It's as inevitable as summer follows spring!
  • Bartricks
    6k
    You're right!Agent Smith

    I know!

    Omnipotence = Dictator
    It's as inevitable as summer follows spring!
    Agent Smith

    The problem is that you don't.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    You're now absolutely right!
  • Bartricks
    6k
    You're now absolutely right!Agent Smith

    No I'm not.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    Omnipotence (absolute power) = Dictator (absolute power)
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    Yes, you're correct.Bartricks

    :up:
  • Bartricks
    6k
    No, that's incorrect.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    Why is God like a dictator or conversely why is a dictator God?
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    Omnipotence. What follows? A being that can do anything and everything cannot be reasoned with, if that being has decided upon a course of action, oui?

    Why is omnipotence a divine attribute? What did we gain and what did we lose?

    Well, if you're not allowed to do anything, f**k off! — Eddie Izzard
  • universeness
    6.3k
    2. God is morally goodBartricks

    You don't even state which god you are referring to. Your own god? The one that admits to being a 'jealous' god in the Old Testament (or popular book of fables). An omnipotent that suffers from one of its own deadly sins. Which god do you advocate for?
  • universeness
    6.3k
    God is by definition morally good.Bartricks

    Total BS. What evidence are you basing this on?
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