• Banno
    25k
    The OP looks like an abortive attempt to defend the doctrine of original sin.

    So are human beings good or badinvicta
    The blatant fallacy inherent in the phrasing of this question is black-or-white.

    It's a shit OP.
  • hypericin
    1.6k
    That was my whole argument regarding all those "crowning achievement" superlatives early in the thread. I wasn't putting humans down; merely pointing out that better or worse depend entirely on the criteria of comparison.Vera Mont

    But humans, unique among animals, can conceive of something better. This ability to conceive is also the possibility of realizing it, and is what is truly superlative about humanity, above every other animal.
  • Vera Mont
    4.3k
    But humans, unique among animals, can conceive of something better.hypericin
    Conceive, yes. At least, according their own code of morality and standards. Achieve, no.
    Quite the reverse: having the unique ability to conceive of what they themselves consider better than animals, and the ability to recognize their own potential for less good than other animals - what they call evil - they proceed to do an astounding amount of the latter.

    and is what is truly superlative about humanity, above every other animal.hypericin

    How is that "above", except in terms of power to destroy?
  • frank
    15.8k
    But man must eventually learn right from wrong good from evil and hence morality.invicta

    Yes, but that happens at the end of the story. The meat of the story has to be about adversity and horrific shit for the reasons Schopenhauer explained.

    You can't have a happy ending without fear, grief, rage, and pain.
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