something is evil when the person is suffering — MoK

Do you want to maybe qualify this? I suffer every morning when I put my body under immense pressure to achieve a better body.

Good and evil creatures like pleasure and suffering, respectively, and dislike suffering and pleasure, respectively, as well. — MoK

So you would claim that evil creatures like suffering and dislike pleasure?

Do you want to maybe qualify this? I suffer every morning when I put my body under immense pressure to achieve a better body. — AmadeusD

Experiencing evil is not a bad thing per se. I am not in your position, so I cannot judge why your suffering is unpleasant to you. Suffering is not unpleasant to me. There is, of course, a reason for that if you start believing that they might be creatures in charge of Judging us that we are not aware of.

So you would claim that evil creatures like suffering and dislike pleasure? — Leontiskos

Correct.

That seems to run against the definition, and practical use of 'evil'. It seems a descriptor for that which is particularly unpleasant in an arbitrary manner.

Could you outline how you're using 'evil' here? I don't think many would recognize it.

That seems to run against the definition, and practical use of 'evil'. — AmadeusD

Humans are mostly inclined toward good, prefer good over evil. There are plenty of people who enjoy evil, such as masochists.

It seems a descriptor for that which is particularly unpleasant in an arbitrary manner. — AmadeusD

I don't think so. Do you mind elaborating after reading this post?

Could you outline how you're using 'evil' here? I don't think many would recognize it. — AmadeusD

Depending on the person you are, you are a good person, you only enjoy/like good experiences. I don't know why you are suffering.

The goal should be equality for humans. — MoK

Why?

Why? — 180 Proof

So you think that inequality in humanity is right? Someone starves to death while others enjoy the wealth! Each person is unique and has the potential to grow. Is that proper to leave such a potential in poverty?

You made the statement so you should answer for it: why "the goal should be equality for humans"?

You made the statement so you should answer for it: why "the goal should be equality for humans"? — 180 Proof

I invite you to reread and rethink my last post. Think of a situation in which you are living on the street.

- :up:

I am wondering why you like @180 Proof post. Do you like to live on the street?

- People on TPF often refuse the burden of proof, even when they obviously have it. When you start a thread promoting equality, then you are clearly the one who needs to defend your equality-claim.

People on TPF often refuse the burden of proof, even when they obviously have it. When you start a thread promoting equality, then you are clearly the one who needs to defend your equality-claim. — Leontiskos

I already asked you a question that you didn't answer. That is the key to the discussion. So, I repeat the question: Do you like to live on the street and lose all the luxury that you have right now? Some people live on the street, and they apparently don't like it. This situation seems unjust. If it is, and we could not realize the reason for being just, then we have ignorance about the situation! We are, however, minds in the core, plain and simple. The question is, why should minds be treated differently? We could believe in the Divinities, saying things are just for a reason, but just humans are ignorant of it. Why should humans be kept in ignorance? Do you have an answer to the last question?

:roll:
:clap: :up:

So many details left out of the OP. Do you believe (as I do) that "good" and "evil" are subjective descriptors? If not, whose definition of the terms is the objectively correct one? In your experience, do most acts of "evil" occur because someone had a warped set of moral codes, say believing that murder is okay, or because of a failure to follow a standard set of moral codes, that is believing murder is wrong, but performing it anyway because of desiring the payoff if they did?

Why don't you answer my question?

So many details left out of the OP. Do you believe (as I do) that "good" and "evil" are subjective descriptors? — LuckyR

Mind experiences. Good and evil are features of experiences.

If not, whose definition of the terms is the objectively correct one? — LuckyR

I would be happy to know if I am wrong somewhere.

In your experience, do most acts of "evil" occur because someone had a warped set of moral codes, say believing that murder is okay, or because of a failure to follow a standard set of moral codes, that is believing murder is wrong, but performing it anyway because of desiring the payoff if they did? — LuckyR

Killing a human in most cases is wrong, since life is the main property of an individual. There are cases where individuals require death assistance, like people with locked-in syndrome. In this case, it is allowed!

Too many non sequitors ...

Besides, as @Leontiskos points out, the burden of proof is on you – answer my question:

https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/999752

Too many non sequitors ... — 180 Proof

A simple question cannot be a non-sequitur! The answer to that question is the key to understanding why equality is the goal. We have a dichotomy of just and unjust. Do you think that humans' lives are just? We have a dichotomy of equality and inequality as well. I think that just lives for humans is when there is equality. It seems that you think otherwise. You think that it is right that people live on the street.

Why don't you answer my question?

https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/999752

I did. Please reread my post here.

Think of a situation in which you are living on the street. — MoK

It would be a hard situation, but I can't see if it is related to inequality. Perhaps it is more connected to my personal circumstances which make me live on the street. In my humble opinion, I believe we should consider why I could end up living on the street rather than if it is a lack of inequality. Living on the street may be a personal decision to escape from reality rather than a cause of financial issues.

I'm not detecting answers to my questions, so I guess we can't converse.

It would be a hard situation, but I can't see if it is related to inequality. — javi2541997

Correct, it is hard! However, some people on the street might wish for a different life, might deserve a different life. Is there any social system to support such individuals? Equality is related to being in a situation you deserve.

Perhaps it is more connected to my personal circumstances which make me live on the street. In my humble opinion, I believe we should consider why I could end up living on the street rather than if it is a lack of inequality. Living on the street may be a personal decision to escape from reality rather than a cause of financial issues. — javi2541997

Equality does not mean that all people should be similar. Equality is about receiving the required income for all individuals so they can constantly contribute, constantly grow, etc.

I understand your point, and I can't disagree with that. But I want to point out that there can be a possibility that the person you are thinking of doesn't want to live accordingly. I mean, there are some nomads out there. There are examples of people who live here and fro without having a constant house to live in. Perhaps it would be interesting to study each individual case rather than trying to promote access to housing for everyone.

Indeed, it is interesting to study each individual case!

There are plenty of people who enjoy evil, such as masochists. — MoK

but this violates your use of 'evil' as that would not be suffering.

I don't think so. Do you mind elaborating after reading this post? — MoK

I cannot see a reason beyond 'it's unpleasant' to label any given x 'evil'. It doesn't work for most examples I can think of, other than as an arbitrary label for 'unpleasant' which we alreayd have and use.

Depending on the person you are, you are a good person, you only enjoy/like good experiences. I don't know why you are suffering. — MoK

This seems non sequitur.

but this violates your use of 'evil' as that would not be suffering. — AmadeusD

I think I should have used the word "like" instead of "enjoy" to avoid confusion: There are plenty of people who like evil, such as masochists.

I cannot see a reason beyond 'it's unpleasant' to label any given x 'evil'. — AmadeusD

If by unpleasant you mean dislike, then that couldn't be correct. I already illustrated in the OP what I mean by good and evil and what I mean by good and evil creatures.

This seems non sequitur. — AmadeusD

It is not. You are a good person, by a good person I mean that you prefer pleasure instead of suffering. You expressed that you don't like pain in your first post in this thread. Therefore, you could not be an evil creature.

I think I should have used the word "like" instead of "enjoy" to avoid confusion: There are plenty of people who like evil, such as masochists. — MoK

This doesn't solve the issue. If Evil is as you describe, no amount of enjoyment is acceptable under that category. That's a serious problem here.

I already illustrated in the OP what I mean by good and evil and what I mean by good and evil creatures. — MoK

And you have not used htem consistently, as noted here and prior. That's the entire point of these replies. The inconsistency is, I believe, leading you claim things you don't hold true.

by a good person I mean that you prefer pleasure instead of suffering. You expressed that you don't like pain in your first post in this thread. Therefore, you could not be an evil creature. — MoK

1. No i didn't. At all. And the post is right there. Here's the post:

Do you want to maybe qualify this? I suffer every morning when I put my body under immense pressure to achieve a better body. — AmadeusD

That's the entire post. So, either you're lying or thinking of something else. I am unsure whether you're having some trouble, or you just forgot what thread you were in?

2. That concept of a Good person is a non sequitur. As noted.

3. That doesn't fit with either your conception, or general conceptions. If you 'like' pain, then you enjoy it and prefer pleasure to suffering (you have confused suffering and pain here, to be sure).

Non sequiturs all the way down, it seems.