If Trump built himself an igloo out of human excrement, the Republicans would cut each other's dicks off to be the first to dive in and claim it was a five-star hotel. The guy owns their souls. It's fascinating to — Baden

So there's an igloo formed of human shit, and for some reason the only way to enter it is to dive into it, and then a bunch of people lop off their genitals so they can complete their dive, and then, when they do, they cry out "I'm in a 5 star hotel"?

I mean maybe, but I just don't think this is going to happen.

A lie.

Where was it proven false?

There was this long investigation by a man named Robert Mueller that found no such crime, namely, because no such crime existed in the first place.

There was this long investigation by a man named Robert Mueller that found no such crime, namely, because no such crime existed in the first place. — NOS4A2

A lie.

I suppose you mean to say Trump was "totally exonerated"?

In the end, the money was given and weapons were provided in excess of what the prior administration gave, despite not having received the dirt he wanted. — Hanover

Because he got caught.

It's the equivalent of saying a bank robber should get let off the hook because he was stopped before he could get his hands on the money.

There was this long investigation by a man named Robert Mueller that found no such crime, namely, because no such crime existed in the first place. — NOS4A2

A lie.


"Mueller: President Trump was not 'totally exonerated' in Russia probe and can be indicted after he leaves office"

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/07/24/mueller-testimony-trump-was-not-totally-exonerated-in-russia-probe.html

“The investigation did not establish that members of the Trump Campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in its election interference activities”.

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/5955118-The-Mueller-Report.html

So much for your conspiracy theory.

The whole impeachment thing is a political process. It's simply not an objective fact finding mission. You have partisan people pushing forth political agendas, and the greatest nonsense is the talking point of the Dems where they say their objective is to protect the holy Constitution, a thing greater than themselves that transcends all party affiliation. No one on the right takes it seriously. It's seen a a coup. — Hanover

If it's just politics, - no justice, just theater -, why are republicans crying out for the show to be stopped now? If it's all just politics, the new game, same as the old game, then aren't republicans just being sore and hypocritical losers?

When Mitch et al. blocked Obama's supreme court appointment, he was just doing politics: resisting a democratically elected president in a purely partisan agenda... That's what the impeachment trial is right? So why should democrats lose a single wink over spilled republican milk?

Cleared of conspiracy, but what of obstruction?

The only question now is whether this maneuvering will more energize the left or the right in the upcoming election. It's doubtful it will change a single vote from one side to the next, but it might cause more people to go to the polls. — Hanover

There is probably a lot more to this matter than what you make of it here. The Democrats may have layered the strategy. The Senate has a complex election system, with representation by state. It is likely that some Senators will have a tough decision to make. Some Republican Senators will face the prospect of not getting re-elected if they side with Trump. There may be a shake up of the Senate, or there may be division in the Republican party. Either way, the Democrats come out ahead.

Round the office, implodes again; that's the Satyr's play!
Faster faster; tremendous: best!~

There's no longer any knowing,
Which direction we are going.

There's no knowing why they're crowing,
Or which way the boons are flowing.

Is it warming? Is it snowing?
Are more hurricanes a-blowing?

Not a feck of light is showing.
Shall we assume the dangers must not be growing?

Are the circus lights just a-glowing?
Or is the grisly she-reaper mowing?

Yes, the danger must be growing,
For the crowers keep on crowing.

And they're certainly not showing
Any signs that they are slowing...

There is probably a lot more to this matter than what you make of it here. The Democrats may have layered the strategy. The Senate has a complex election system, with representation by state. It is likely that some Senators will have a tough decision to make. Some Republican Senators will face the prospect of not getting re-elected if they side with Trump. There may be a shake up of the Senate, or there may be division in the Republican party. Either way, the Democrats come out ahead. — Metaphysician Undercover

37 Republican Senators have already gone on record as opposing removal. https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/politics/senate-impeachment-votes/

They need 67 to remove. It was over before it began.

We know Trump is extremely unlikely to be convicted by the Senate. The issue is which Republican Senators will be inclined to vote against Trump to ensure personal re-election, and what kind of division this will create within the party. And if they do not vote against Trump they face the prospect of being replaced by a Democrat.

I do have to admit I find the whole impeachment process politically bizzarre. The outcome is predetermined: Trump will be exonerated in the senate, which he will spin as proof the whole thing was a witch-hunt, as he was saying all along, and the democrats have quite literally handed him a defeat of their own making on a silvered platter. It seems to defy any good political sense. Why would anyone hand a victory over to your sworn opponent? Not to mention that it would make any other attempt at impeachment almost impossible. Least we forget, Clinton was never more popular than after his aquittal. I simply don't understand the political logic here.

We know Trump is extremely unlikely to be convicted by the Senate. The issue is which Republican Senators will be inclined to vote against Trump to ensure personal re-election, and what kind of division this will create within the party. And if they do not vote against Trump they face the prospect of being replaced by a Democrat. — Metaphysician Undercover

The real question is the number of Democrat detectors there will be. In the House, 3 Dems defected and 0 Repubs. I'm not sure why you think it'll be any different in the Senate.

So much for your conspiracy theory. — NOS4A2

Was Trump, in your view, "totally exonerated"?

The conspiracy that Trump is a Manchurian candidate, that he colluded with Russia, made it to the highest parts of the government. To the chagrin of many it was proven false. This was literally concocted by the Democrats as their Russian-sourced dirt was used as the impetus for the investigations. There was no such investigation of Obama. — NOS4A2

That is a straw man argument since as far as I known news source (left wing or otherwise) has made such claims. What they have claimed is that Russia has been trying to meld in US politics and in the 2016 election they used such melding to help Trump get elected. Why they prefer Trump over Hillary isn't clear but rumor has it that Putin has a video tape of Trump with some escorts (as well as other things) which could be used as leverage if Trump decided to make things difficult for Putin. Whether there is any truth to this or the idea that Russia believes Trump as president will undermine the US is a bit speculative...all that is really known is that Russia did interfere and while Trump isn't directly guilty of collusion with them, he is far from being innocent in the whole matter.

Other administrations misused funds and none of them went to jail as far as I know. Meanwhile Trump is getting impeached. So I’m not so sure your common sense is working in this regard. — NOS4A2

Are you talking about administrations that did it and didn't get caught like Trump and therefore were more difficult to try to impeach or are you talking about some that was caught doing something along the lines of what Trump did and the Republicans were totally asleep at the switch at doing anything about it. Which is very hard to believe since they like to shit storm over any little thing that happens.

Also the argument that Trump should be able to get away with it because it is possible that some other administration "might" have been able to get away with something almost just as bad is similar to the argument that any murder should be set free since there have been people in the past that have managed to get away with murder.

I try to understand what the fuck you could be thinking and I don't get it. — frank

When one throws truth out the window in lieu of whatever works... rhetoric, propaganda, double standards, etc., and the American people already see that as normal...

There ya go.

Something to note... the Republican talking points are always fairly simple sounding, easy to understand, and everyone is on the same page saying the same things about the same stuff.

That matters more than most realize I think... indoctrination works the same way...

There are witnesses who have direct access to the president that have relevant yet to have been heard testimony about the articles of impeachment...

Those witnesses need to be heard, particularly if they have been previously ordered to not obey subpoena.

Mitch McConnell's statements about coordinating with the president and already having the exact some position as the president on the matter, when he's supposed to be acting as an impartial objective unbiased judge on the matter is dereliction of duty...

I do have to admit I find the whole impeachment process politically bizzarre. The outcome is predetermined: — StreetlightX

It's not supposed to be.

Dereliction of duty.

It's not supposed to be. — creativesoul

But it is.

The process is a literal show trial. Like, actual political theatre. That anyone at all is invested in it is utterly bizzare.

Hmmm...

Seems a bit more to me that perhaps the reason it all seems so bizzare is because the very fact that someone like Trump has won, and is being protected at all costs by the Republican party even when that protection is a clear and undeniable contradiction to the US Constitution shows that there are some very compelling reasons governing their behaviour...

And it's not because they like Trump personally, although they seem to have gotten over the fact that a tactless unreserved rude crass spoiled rich kid attained the power of the presidency...

That it is a known fact that Russia successfully interfered with the election, but nothing at all has been done about making sure that it does not happen again..

OUGHT MAKE US ALL WONDER WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON IN WASHINGTON?

He won't tell unless we do.

Seems a bit more to me that perhaps the reason it all seems so bizzare is because... — creativesoul

No this has nothing to do with what I said.

But it is. — StreetlightX

Not quite predetermined but with an atmosphere of predetermination. The odds are not x to zero.

The fascinating bit is the contest of simulacra. The Trumpists are attempting to foist on us a doozy of a simulacrum.

I'm saying... simply...

The Republicans and their donors ARE invested.

It's not bizarre unless the above is not being seriously taken into consideration.

I'm not sure why you think it'll be any different in the Senate. — Hanover

I see at least three major differences. There's no need for any Democrats in the Senate to defect because conviction is highly unlikely. Also the population represented is different as Senators represent an entire state. And, I think there are a number of Republican senators who have expressed dislike of Trump in the past..

50 years from now nobody's going to care.

It'll be history, and there is always people who care about history

.

I'm not sure why you think it'll be any different in the Senate. — Hanover

I forgot to mention the most important thing. There's sure to be at least one republican Senator who want's Trump's position. That's why Trump wants the trial to blow by as fast as possible, and the Democrats want to drag it out a bit, let the wannabes stoke the fire..

It'll be history, and there is always people who care about history — Metaphysician Undercover

It's not like the US blew up Iran in 2019. That would be historic.

I'm saying... simply...

The Republicans and their donors ARE invested.

It's not bizarre unless the above is not being seriously taken into consideration.

Three democrats voted against.

Speaking of investment, DNC dark money is huge right now. The PACs are working overtime for a return on it.

Let's not get ahead of ourselves. Trump HAS NOT been impeached yet. Unless and until the articles of impeachment have been transmitted to the Senate, there has been no impeachment. https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-12-19/trump-impeachment-delay-could-be-serious-problem-for-democrats

So, back to your business. Nothing to see here so far except for a bunch of House members bickering.