Possibly a gesture of goodwill, in return for all the Rhino horn that was pinched from Museums, in order to facilitate Chinese horns.

M

Rhino horns? I was wondering more about what China is hoping to express to the world with the gesture.

That's like asking why a cheesecake is made with cheese.

China is communist after all, and most tourists to Marx homeplace are from China.

Isn't it obvious..

China likes to pretend it's brutal version of Capitalism, is still wedded to Communist ideals.

You're thinking that it's standard procedure for countries to give statues to one another. One of the most famous cases of it: the Statue of Liberty in NY, NY, was a symbol of solidarity between France and the US. Is there supposed to be solidarity between China and Germany?

As the article in the OP mentioned, the gap between rich and poor in China is growing due to its embrace of capitalist practices. So I don't think it's a cheese situation.

Isn't it obvious..

China likes to pretend it's brutal version of Capitalism, is still wedded to Communist ideals. — Marcus de Brun

Maybe, but why not celebrate Marx in China? Surely they can find a spot somewhere. Why bestow the statue on Germany?

You're thinking that it's standard procedure for countries to give statues to one another. One of the most famous cases of it: the Statue of Liberty in NY, NY was a symbol of solidarity between France and the US. Is there supposed to be solidarity between China and Germany? — frank

The ulterior motive is good PR, rather obviously. China is trying to build something called the One Belt Road or something like that, that would create a corridor of trade between Europe and China, and they are trying really hard to appeal to the world in a positive light.

As the article in the OP mentioned, the gap between rich and poor in China is growing due to its embrace of capitalist practices. So I don't think it's a cheese situation. — frank

That's something the current leader of China is trying to solve. I don't follow the news in China that much; but, from what I gather Xi Jinping wants to go back to or appeal to communist ideals for the poor last I remember.

... because Marx is a German author, and his influence on the history of the last century exceeds the influence of any single book ever written, with the exception of the Bible or perhaps the Koran.

Yes, Marx is Modern Jesus. Deal with it. :cool:

Are we waiting for a Second Coming?

The ulterior motive is good PR, — Posty McPostface

Really? If it was meant as a symbol of a bond between Germany and China, why not a Beethoven statue? I sense something other than plain good will.

I sense something other than plain good will. — frank

Like what?

Not sure. Maybe a prelude to a flex of its generous financial muscles.

Really? If it was meant as a symbol of a bond between Germany and China, why not a Beethoven statue? I sense something other than plain good will. — frank

Really? What's the shared history of China and Beethoven (besides the trillion of great chinese pianists?). Perhaps are you just having too much of a hard time wrapping your head around the idea that for many, Marx was a great intellectual (and not Leftist-Hitler)?

I like China. They actually build bunkers for citizens in case of a nuclear war, instead of for politicians. And, I don't think they're lunatic like the presidents we had in the US. Not to portray them in a shining light of gold and silver; but, they've come along from the tendencies of Mao.

Really? What's the shared history of China and Beethoven (besides the trillion of great chinese pianists?). Perhaps are you just having too much of a hard time wrapping your head around the idea that for many, Marx was a great intellectual? — Akanthinos

If it was merely a goodwill gesture, China could have chosen a statue that wouldn't have resulted in protest marches in Germany. I'm sure the Chinese know Marx is a controversial figure. Beethoven isn't.

Was Marx a great intellectual in your view?

It's Marx's 200th birthday. Marx was born in Trier, Germany, which is where the statue was sent, and China likes Marx.

As a German citizen I can attest to the fact that Marx is not a four letter word in Europe the way it is in America. Not saying we all love him. But it's not the knee-jerk rejection of anything to do with him and his ideas that you get in the states.

They actually build bunkers for citizens in case of a nuclear war, — Posty McPostface

They have 1.37 billion people. That's a lot of bunkers.

They have 1.37 billion people. That's a lot of bunkers. — frank

Hey, will I give them an A for effort instead of adopting MAD policies of holding your enemies population hostage and exclusively saving the same people who profess such an ideology.

Have you been the US?

Hey, will I give them an A for effort instead of adopting MAD policies of holding your enemies population hostage and exclusively saving the same people who profess such an ideology. — Posty McPostface

What do you mean "holding your enemies population hostage?"

In MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction), you hold your enemies resources, population, buildings, land hostage, and so does your enemy to prevent nuclear war. That's the penalty for breaching the rules of the game. Thing is it just takes one lunatic or simple mistake to end everything that you hold dear. The premise of the whole game is that you hope your enemy is as rational as you are.

Too high a price to pay to maintain such a strategy, as I've always thought.

Thankfully, the USSR collapsed and the stand-off ended.

If it was merely a goodwill gesture — frank

What else could it be? It's not Trojan Horse waiting to disgorge an army of chinese contortionnists...

China could have chosen a statue that wouldn't have resulted in protest marches in Germany. — frank

Why would China care for that?

I'm sure the Chinese know Marx is a controversial figure. — frank

Not so controversial for anyone with an historical, economical or philosophical education, or someone who hasn't had their mind rotten by the american school system.

Was Marx a great intellectual in your view? — frank

Yes, indubitably. You don't have to shill for someone to recognize that he is one of the great ones.

Thankfully, the USSR collapsed and the stand-off ended. — frank

Yeah, living in fear is no fun. Glad we ended up lucky in the end.

What else could it be? It's not Trojan Horse waiting to disgorge an army of chinese contortionnists... — Akanthinos

Well it was 15 ft tall. Somebody should probably check.

Yes, indubitably. You don't have to shill for someone to recognize that he is one of the great ones. — Akanthinos

He arose from global angst. His thought was global revolution. Others imagined attacking the problem one small piece at a time. The names of the moderates are not as well known, but they won in the end. Look at China's economy for proof of that.

Yeah, living in fear is no fun. Glad we ended up lucky in the end. — Posty McPostface

Yep. :up:

The title of this thread is misleading. The municipal government of Trier, Marx's birth city, accepted the gift from China. The German federal government had nothing to do with it. Trier accepted the statue mostly because it wanted publicity and tourists.

Xi gave a speech last week in front of delegates at the Great Hall of the People honoring Marx's life and legacy. Marx still has propaganda and ideological value for the Communist Party, even though China's version of state capitalism is something Marx would have probably criticized.

Marx became one of the most influential thinkers in human history. He got a lot of things right and a lot of things wrong. His analysis of capitalism, despite its many flaws, remains the most insightful and comprehensive one ever attempted.

Marx became one of the most influential thinkers in human history. — Uber

What would you name as significant examples of that influence?

He arose from global angst. His thought was global revolution. Others imagined attacking the problem one small piece at a time. The names of the moderates are not as well known, but they won in the end. Look at China's economy for proof of that. — frank

Have you red the Capital? Or any other of his economic texts?

And no, modern China is about as Imperialistic a country as any of the other powers. Marx nowadays might have prefered modern capitalist (read north-american exc. Mexico and Western European) to Chinese Communism based solely on the degree of social mobility being somewhat higher in the formers than the later.

The capitalism of Marx's days was a beast to be slain. Such beasts still exists today, and others have grown (like Google) that needs slayin'. Marx is still relevant.

Have you red the Capital? — Akanthinos

One of my copies has margin notes written in Chinese. I got it from a used book store.

The capitalism of Marx's days was a beast to be slain. — Akanthinos

Agreed.