How, then, shall I respond to him who asks, "What was God doing before he made heaven and earth?" I do not answer, as a certain one is reported to have done facetiously (shrugging off the force of the question). "He was preparing hell," he said, "for those who pry too deep." — The Confessions (400) by Augustine
every physical effect (i.e. caused event) has physical sufficient causes — On the Causal Completeness of Physics (2006) by Agustín Vicente
Sumerians [...] were working on their sophisticated irrigation systems when the Father of All Creation reached down from the ether and blew the divine spirit of life into their thriving civilization
a Sumerian who appears to be scratching his head [...] "A booming voice is saying, 'Let there be light'"
Sumerian farmers, priests, and civic administrators were not only befuddled, but also took issue with the face of God moving across the water, saying that He scared away those who were traveling to Mesopotamia to participate in their vast and intricate trade system.
If there was a definite earliest time (or "time zero"), then anything that existed at that time, began to exist at that time, and that includes any first causes, deities, or whatever else. — jorndoe
1. if some deity could create something out of "nothing", as it were, then ex nihilo nihil fit is already violated, and we might as well dispose of the principle, in which case said deity is an extraneous hypothesis — jorndoe
if some deity — jorndoe
Might as well be replaced with "don't know", — jorndoe
outside of or not bound by time — Wayfarer
An object is abstract (if and) only if it is causally inefficacious. — https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/abstract-objects/
time is unparsimoniously multiplied, perhaps adding ("orthogonal") temporal dimensions. — jorndoe
strictly speaking 'the transcendent' doesn't exist, as 'existence' is what 'the transcendent' is transcendent in respect to — Wayfarer
The closest that comes to mind is abstract objects (perhaps a variety of Platonia). (As an aside, you don't define things into existence, word magic style.) — jorndoe
I wonder if logical and arithmetical principles are temporally defined?Suppose x is defined as atemporal, "outside of time". — jorndoe
Suppose x is defined as not spatial, "outside of space". Well, then obviously x is nowhere to be found. And x cannot have any extent, volume, area, length, or the likes, not even zero-dimensional (like a mathematical singularity). — jorndoe
Spacetime is an aspect of the universe, and "before time" is incoherent. — jorndoe
Suppose x is defined as atemporal, "outside of time". Well, then there can be no time at which x exists. And there can be no duration involved, x cannot change, or be subject to causation, cannot interact, and would be inert and lifeless. — jorndoe
Charles Sanders Peirce denied the existence of God, but argued for the reality of God. Something exists if it reacts with the other like things in the environment; something is real if it has characters regardless of what any individual mind or finite group of minds thinks about it. Existence is spatio-temporal, but reality need not be. Everything that exists is real, but there are realities that do not exist (in this sense).If Craig was to declare "Yahweh does not exist", then how would that be any different from atheism? — jorndoe
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.