If it is a question worth asking, then the answer must be that it is worth living, if only to ask the question.

But I suspect it is not worth asking. Rather one finds out in each case, or does not, but only too late.

Oooo!!! Suicide!!! That’s always a cheerful topic to discuss! :starstruck: I loove talking about suicide :heart: . I think it’s always good to start the discussion with 2 top 10 lists for reasons to commit and not commit suicide:

Top 10 reasons to commit suicide:

1. It can prevent all the suffering that you would have to endure if you don’t commit suicide. I think this is undeniably a strong advantage. There’s a lot of suffering that comes after your loved ones die and with all the health problems towards the end of life. Also, having all the daily stress of life and having to deal with being tired and hungry and having to use the restroom but you can’t alleviate yourself because you have to work. Then, there’s the boredom of work as well and having anxiety that something terrible might happen at any moment. Also, having to deal with being sick. That’s not fun either. Also, feeling ashamed and embarrassed about your past words and actions sucks. So, it’s understandable why some people wish to end their life.

2. It can prevent you from being dissatisfied with your life for longer than you have to. I don’t think this is really an advantage but some people might consider life dissatisfaction to be bad for reasons aside from the suffering that it causes.

3. If you’re a dick then you get to prevent all the suffering that you are going to cause to the world! Yay :grin: !!! I don’t really think that this matters much either though

4. If you desire to die, then suicide can fulfill your desire. But, I sincerely doubt that it matters that you got what you wanted unless you had a rational reason to want it in the first place.

5. If you’re a cock blocker, then your death will prevent the deprivation of pleasure that you would of caused to others with your cock blocking ways! Obviously, this is a silly reason.

I know this was supposed to be a top 10 list but I could only come up with 5 reasons to commit suicide and 4 of them suck! Now, let’s see what the top 10 reasons for not committing suicide are....

1. If your suicide attempt fails, then your life might be a living hell.... I’ve heard lots of stories of suicide survivors who had their “fool proof plan” fail and the consequences are terrible. If it’s a gun suicide, then it’s pretty common for them to be left without a face or teeth or eyes. The biggest mistake you can make attempting suicide with a gun is aiming under the chin. Please, do not aim under the chin! You will miss your brain and get defaced instead! Also, do not use a low caliber pistol! You should use a powerful shotgun if you want it to work. Also, do not use drugs or try to slit your wrist. Those methods almost never work. You’re just asking to suffer. I wouldn’t try hanging or CO2 poisoning or Innate Gas Suffocation either unless you really know what you’re doing. Jumping can work but you want to make sure you are doing it high enough. If you don’t, then have fun being in a wheelchair for the rest of your life! The coolest suicide method I heard about is decapitation with a rope and a car. It’s really going to leave behind a messy scene though. Same goes for guns. The most effective methods are the most nasty ones to show your loved ones.

2. Suicide attempts usually fail so you shouldn’t assume that yours will probably work unless you are using an extremely lethal method.

3. You might simply be unable to commit suicide effectively. As the old saying goes, ought implies can! If you don’t have access to guns because you don’t live in the good ol Murica where they are easy to get, then you might wanna not risk a less effective method. Also, if you are unwilling to show a blood bath to your family, then you might wanna reconsider as well. Also, if you simply can’t pull the trigger, then you simply can’t pull the trigger. Nuff said!

4. If there is an afterlife, then your suffering might continue after your death. I think there probably isn’t one but there’s always some possibility that it might exist. Though, if it does exist, then it’s probably not an eternal pit of torture that Christian think you will end up in. It’s more likely to be about as bad as your current life. This is assuming that it is probably going to be an embodied afterlife where your “container of experience” flows into a different body and you get to live another life with a different personality and memories that will develop.

5. Committing suicide will deprive you of all the pleasure that you would have if you didn’t commit suicide. Think about the future orgasms that you won’t get to have. Think about all the experiences of love that you will miss out on. Think about all of the pleasant experiences of arguing with people on TPF that you will throw away.

6. Being in a suicidal state of mind creates additional suffering for your life and makes you feel even worse about the circumstances of your life. This is not an argument against suicide directly but it is an argument against encouraging your own suicide ideation.

7. Your suicide will cause your loved ones a great deal of suffering. Especially if you leave a brutal scene. It might be better to wait till some of them die out but then you would have to endure the suffering of the bereavement caused by their death.

8. Your suicide will also deprive your loved ones of all the future fun they would of had together with you if you hadn’t died.

9. It’s a pain in the ass to have to get up and try to plan your suicide. Who’s got time for that shit?

10. Well.... your life MIGHT get better in the future. There’s always a possibility...... However small........

Suicide is never the problem, depression and impulsiveness among other things are problems and suicide is sometimes a symptom of those problems. Suicide is not a logical solution to really any of the problems nor does it ever help the individual. It is a symptom of our flaws and it itself leads to nothing. Whether we agree with someone's suicide or not, it is always the symptom of tragedy and is itself a tragedy.

Existential philosophy frames the question of life in a depressing and unhelpful way. Life does have meaning, we create that meaning ourselves and the lack of objective meaning is as irrelevant as the lack of all other objective version of subjective things. Most of the beautiful things in the world are subjective and personal and their beauty and value are accentuated rather than diminished by their subjective nature. Instead of framing the question of life around the things we don't have, it'd be better to frame it around that which we have gratitude for.

As Camus famously put it: "“There is only one really serious philosophical problem, and that is suicide. Deciding whether or not life is worth living is to answer the fundamental question in philosophy." the question of life's worth and suicide has been going around my mind for months now.
Do you think that life is worth living? And if so, what fuels that belief?
And what would your reaction be if on your commute you saw someone on the verge of taking their life by jumping off a bridge? — Rhasta1

I very much doubt that philosophical discussion ever decided anyone's view on suicide. It never came up much when I was a Samaritan, whatever. I certainly came to believe that only a very small minority didn't feel very different given a chance to talk about it, though I've known friends make a purely rational decision, when terminally ill, to be off to Switzerand, not needing discussion. On the whole, I think life is worth living if somebody cares whether you live or die. If in serious doubt, ring the Sams, though they won't discuss philosophy much!

"An act like this is prepared within the silence of the heart, as is a great work of art. The man himself is ignorant of it. One evening he pulls the trigger or jumps. [ ... ] Beginning to think is beginning to be undermined. Society has but little connection with such beginnings. The worm is in man’s heart.

There are many causes for a suicide, and generally the most obvious ones were not the most powerful. Rarely is suicide committed (yet the hypothesis is not excluded) through reflection."

~Albert Camus (1942)

Do you think that life is worth living? — Rhasta1

I'll let you know when I'm done with it.

And if so, what fuels that belief? — Rhasta1

'20-20 hindsight'.

And what would your reaction be if on your commute you saw someone on the verge of taking their life by jumping off a bridge? — Rhasta1

Slight annoyance that s/he picked rush-hour to do it and thereby grind traffic to a halt with all the damn rubber-necking (i.e. cell photos/videos for "ooo wow" "i was there" shitz-n-giggles facebooking & youtubing) this showy departure's bound to cause. Then I'd probably app-dial 9-1-1 ... :roll:

A suicide maxim: The switch doesn't flip itself On or Off.

Dealt a hand by nature-nurture, choosing [to kill oneself] is always ex post facto - to be or not to be - manifest in how one chooses to play that hand. Suicide (long) precedes the act; circumstances, it seems, postpone or delay or, yes, facilitate the outcome. — 180 Proof

:death: :flower:

:up:

As Camus famously put it: "“There is only one really serious philosophical problem, and that is suicide. Deciding whether or not life is worth living is to answer the fundamental question in philosophy." the question of life's worth and suicide has been going around my mind for months now.
Do you think that life is worth living? And if so, what fuels that belief?
And what would your reaction be if on your commute you saw someone on the verge of taking their life by jumping off a bridge?

We can think about it from an individual or communal standpoint. I'm limiting my points to discussions about healthy people here and not those who are extremely sick.

From a communal standpoint it's extremely damaging. The family and community is affected for years. Again, I'm excluding cases where the person has a serious illness or disability. There was a spate of suicides among my classmates when I was in high school.

From an individual standpoint we know as a species that there's just so much to experience while you've living: namely, love. We could also include art, music, good food, etc. Intentionally dying is an explicit rejection of that. Nobody knows what happens when you die. It is a much, much more prudent decision to operate in a world of knowns with definite goals and things to aspire to than to intentionally throw that all away and dive into a complete unknown.

Again, I'm excluding cases where the person has a serious illness or disability. There was a spate of suicides among my classmates when I was in high school. — BitconnectCarlos

Teens, a strong case can be made, are, in effect, "disabled" developmentally with respect to impulsivity due to immaturation of the prefrontal cortex (until, in most cases, their mid-twenties). Condolences; but many, if not, most of that "spate" were probably victims of adolescence (i.e. impatience, poor coping skills & social media-hyped status/peer-pressures) and not a thoughtfully negative appraisal of 'life's worth'.

I agree with your sentiment, BCarlos (if I read between the lines correctly): in non-pathological cases, killing oneself is only ever a permanent escape from (and not a solution to) a temporary problem, and thus, quite disproportionate (i.e. ir-ratio).

:up:

Well, my favorite philosophy professor in college had a better line about suicide:

"Suicide is like getting a tattoo. It's a permanent solution to a temporary problem."

As Camus famously put it: "“There is only one really serious philosophical problem, and that is suicide. Deciding whether or not life is worth living is to answer the fundamental question in philosophy." the question of life's worth and suicide has been going around my mind for months now.
Do you think that life is worth living? And if so, what fuels that belief?
And what would your reaction be if on your commute you saw someone on the verge of taking their life by jumping off a bridge?

Yes, I think life is worth living. I suspect I am biased because I have lived a good one.

To have been born and persisted (at least for a while) should be seen as a great honor because very few objects in the universe come to exist this way. Each human is rare in this respect, one of a kind, and is priceless thereby. I have come to cherish my life and the lives of others with this belief.