:grin:'So many constructs!' — csalisbury
Have you looked at I am a strange loop? It's dreadful, but also excellent. Your constructs within constructs... strange loops indeed. There might be some similarity between what you describe and Hoftader's thesis. I found it helpful in similar circumstances, especially in identifying the more persistent strange loops so that they can be explicitly dealt with. — Banno
But then what is that voice, exactly? And are there multiple voices (I think there are)? Does the internalized interlocutor, and one's relationship with it, determine in part how one acts? If one acts in a different way, does that change one's internal monologue? — csalisbury
I hope you remember jootsing. And implicitly, jootsing in and at the right time, the right place, for right reasons, for right purposes and ends.but I did read Godel, Escher, Bach — csalisbury
-- At 31, most normal aspects of life are still a struggle for me. Becoming able to get a minimally sustaining work-from-home job (after an excruciating in-office decade) to get my own apartment, and to take care of my expenses; that is basically the sum of what I've achieved in terms of day-to-day life. It was hard-won, and I am grateful that I have gotten to this point, but, as a achievement, it places me far behind the curve. — csalisbury
However many voices there may be it all amounts to the same thing, which is that internalised conversation. Whether it’s true or not I don’t know, but evidence seems to suggest a high rate of suicide in poets. (What the rate is among builders, or plumbers I don’t know, so how can we be sure the poet figures are high?). My feeling is that poets spend too much time in that internalised space. Philosophers are the same. Mathematicians might be considered in that light but their language is maths.
My personal feelings are that action is the only thing to put the internal voices in place. Action is about moving forward, literally one step in front of the other. In the end you are removed from where you were. The voices never do that. To spend too much time in that conversation is profitless. Do they determine how one acts? very rarely in my opinion.
If the way one acts in a different way is action then it doesn’t change one’s internal monologue, it shuts it up long enough to put you in a different space ( then one may have a different conversation). In extreme active situations that monologue is completely shut down, it’s no longer relevant, it has no benefits. — Brett
t seem'd for a while back then that we were about to find out something really profound, to do with reflexive iterations, self-similarity, Chinese rooms and so on. Then Google Translate came along and beat all that over the head with blind, brute calculating power and statistical analysis, while neural networks seemed to lead in a different direction.
Bump. I'd like to see more thought on the eternal gold braid. — Banno
But all of this is too speculative and needs something much firmer to hang from. — Banno
The ego cannot change itself — csalisbury
Heaven and earth are ruthless, and treat the myriad creatures as straw dogs;
the sage is ruthless, and treats the people as straw dogs. — Lao Tzu
What if you're in checkmate, but there is no way to move out a frame, and reinscribe the impasse as a resolved outcome on a new level? — csalisbury
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