Sure. But think of all the other unsavory causes that would make this same point. For a non-believer, there's something a little disquieting about this kind of rhetoric'But it's only a radical minority!' is always the first hurdle.
But, again, what led you to start frequenting these sites? — csalisbury
Sure. But think of all the other unsavory causes that would make this same point. For a non-believer, there's something a little disquieting about this kind of rhetoric — csalisbury
Why do you think that?Yeah, but I think most of the attitudes they espouse are implicit in the way 'non-polemical' women behave
Yeah, I don't deny all these things exist. I just don't have the general impression, from experience, that woman are basically contemptuous and entitled - at least not any more than men. I honestly don't. Again, it might come down to differences in our respective social milieus, who knows. I get the sense that maybe you think that deep down I agree with you, but won't - or can't - admit it for certain reasons. Is that fair to say? — csalisbury
The split between men who confront existential displacement with honesty and authenticity and women who don't, who hate and cheat and feel superior - in some ways, this reminds me a bit of that experience I mentioned when I first went to college (in Boston, FWIW.) How everyone else seemed to be on this other wavelength, excluding, getting one another but rejecting everyone else, not really lonely, and how, as you pointed out and I later realized, this was mostly because I hadn't really gotten to know any of them well enough to know what they were actually like. — csalisbury
(though I do think that part of a certain male virtue signaling and ingratiation toward women involves attributing superior faculties of empathy and reasoning to women in various ways -- e.g thinking men are rigid and hierarchical and platonistic and autistic while women are subtle and complex and empathetic and so on -- obviously there's a shade of that in what you just wrote).
Yeah, I'm aware of those statistics. There are a lot of ways to look at suicide. I think it would be interesting to see what the correlation between philosophical pessimism/antinatalism and suicide is. "It is not worth killing yourself, since you always kill yourself too late." "I Can't go on, I'll go on." "suicide is a will thing too, you know" Philosophical pessimists tend to be very proud ppl, and suicide is giving in. — csalisbury
I mean, quite simply, that women don't usually seem to devise theories of everything, while a lot of men seem to be drawn to them. Would you agree with that at least? — csalisbury
heh the very name 'philosophy forums' suggests a vast meadow of mutual masturbation. That's why most people steer clear. What are we all doing here if not reinforcing one another's sense of being v smart, insightful ppl? — csalisbury
I think the crucial difference is still there. The sailor's virtue his own. He failed at his ideal. It lacks a social dimension. The "fallen woman" may have failed her own ideals, but she has also lost her virtue in the eyes of society and is now there to by exploited or punished as anyone sees fit.Not that different from a sailor lost in heroic dreams who realizes, at a crucial moment, he's failed his ideal and his treasured self-image no longer protects him against the world — csalisbury
And then he pounded a beer, gave himself a tattoo, punched his girlfriend, and landed the sickest kickflip any of us had ever seen.And life's just a bunch of pain, and that's it. There's nothing else, no depth to it or anything that makes it worthwhile.
You're right, all theorizing loses its luster during the Bad Times. It's just that pessimism, unlike the other approaches you mention, has an irksome tendency to train it sights precisely on the Bad Times, as a means to speak, magisterially (or with magisterial bluntness), a general truth. It does disservice both to the actual suffering of others and to one's own actually suffering self. — csalisbury
Rather, it is a sort of aesthetic outlook. Pessimism is the recognition of the instrumentality of existence. Our world imposes on us our survival needs and unwanted pain in certain environmental and cultural constraints. Our individual wills impose upon ourselves the need to transform boredom into goals and pleasures. Being that we can never have true satiation, we are always in flux and never quite getting at anything in particular. — schopenhauer1
I think it's wrong though. Pessimism as described there is just another example of "finding meaning in the large." A case of saying "there is no perfect world" as a means of distracting us from our boredom or pain. It's Will coming to understand itself and then stewing in it's own juices. — TheWillowOfDarkness
It is the larger picture, correct. But it is not "finding meaning" in the large.Pessimism as described there is just another example of "finding meaning in the large." — TheWillowOfDarkness
A case of saying "there is no perfect world" as a means of distracting us from our boredom or pain. It's Will coming to understand itself and then stewing in it's own juices. — TheWillowOfDarkness
The strength of pessimism is the seriousness with which it takes suffering and lack of perfection, but it is still only a moment of thought. It doesn't somehow render our moments of joy trivial and pretend. — TheWillowOfDarkness
The trick is stop thinking one must get anything particular. Just be what you are at any given time. — TheWillowOfDarkness
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.