Are we at a dip?

Usually, the logic is to sell when everyone else is buying and buy when everyone else is selling.

Have you watched the movie The Big Short? It is a great movie, probably not especially related, but it brings me to mind when I think about the economic 'bubble' and the possibility of an ultimate crash that raises my suspicions of cryptocurrency in parallel of the movie. For me, the effective forking mechanisms are necessary in block-chains to ensure consistent innovation, but the continuity relies on resources that will stretch to a point of eventual collapse; we can put a stop to it, but that will slow innovation to a point that value would scarcely change and what would be the point? I just think it will eventually fall short.

I am also a bit hesitant primarily because of the legal domain, or lack thereof, and while data protection regulations are in the process of being implemented vis-a-vis block-chain database security [in Australia, we are soon to legislate anti-money laundering laws], can we ensure integrity from any data manipulation particularly as it becomes privately managed? This is a serious problem relating to international organised crime.

There're always dips because there're so many different 'currencies'

Is it all the rage where you are as well?

It has generated some interesting discussions on the subject of international law. Why are you a sceptic?

I mostly worry about the environmental sustainability of it. The energy consumption to make it work is ridiculous and I think this needs to be tackled.

The second problem is speed. We're moving to financial markets and consumer services that offer instant payments. Any distributed ledger is going to be slow in comparison.

The third is the theoretical vulnerability when one party can resolve 50% or more of the blockchain, which makes it possible to insert incorrect data.

There's a few others but I don't consider those unresovable.

Was hoping someone could prove my scepticism justifiable

Do you own any cryptocurrencies?

Guy at work sold a bitcoin yesterday. He still has one left. Him and another have also invested in litecoin. I'm tempted to join in.

bitcoin and eutherium are the ones I've tracked a bit. I have an interest in eutherium because it has a programming language suitable for contracts and I'm considering learning it (solidity).

I became curious when I was doing my tax return and the Australian Taxation Office offered bitcoins and I was like :-| enough to change legislation this year where people now have to pay capital gains tax on any profits. It is certainly legitimate.

Once again I ask, which came first the Cryptolock or the Cryptocurrency? Cryptocurrency became the vogue way of paying off the ransom to those who Cryptolocked their systems. I am pretty sure that the very lock I am speaking of was attempted at PF but there was no money to be had, so they unlocked it and moved on but not before making financial requests of Paul while holding the forum hostage.

Bit Coin or Ethereum are just like any other currency but it's value is the same the world over. As I understand it, the currency exchange market isn't necessary when using Cryptocurrency. So if I were to travel with my BitCoin Visa card from the USA to Mexico, I won't need to exchange my dollars into Pesos which cuts out the middle man, along with not being bound by Federal laws here in the states.

Every time I question how it can remain legal as it feels like it is subverting the Federal law, I am told that it would be like the USA trying to manage the Euro or the Peso, it cannot be done because it is an international currency.

"It is just the choice of payment which has changed from conventional fund transfer methods to bitcoin due to the ease of transactions, pseudonymity and transparency"

Bah. I'm trying to get into this but none of the exchanges are accepting photos of my ID when I'm trying to verify my account. If I miss out on a big profit because of this, I'm going to be super pissed.

Yes I'm all over it. Top things you need to know that aren't in the mainstream news:

* Invented by NSA in 1996. Satoshi's 2009 paper is strictly for the tourists. You probably don't believe me. Here's the paper. http://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.805/articles/money/nsamint/nsamint.htm

* Bitcoin security fails if there's centralization of miners, but the top three Chinese miners now control over 50% of the hashing capacity of the network.

* It's a huge pain in the ass to actually fund an account on an exchange and actually buy cryptos and then secure your wallet. There is no way this is going to scale to the public until some of these issues are solved.

* It's not going to bring down the bankers. The bankers will control the space like they've controlled money for thousands of years.

* There's plenty of opportunity to make money. If you missed bitcoin don't worry, there are plenty of altcoins out there. Bitcoin itself has terrible scaling and organizational and centralization problems that will probably kill it at some point.

That said, it's very interesting. Blockchain solves the problem of establishing end-to-end trust on decentralized, distributed ledgers. It's a fantastic technical achievement that will change the world.

Bah. I'm trying to get into this but none of the exchanges are accepting photos of my ID when I'm trying to verify my account. If I miss out on a big profit because of this, I'm going to be super pissed. — Michael

Did you try Gemini? They couldn't verify my ID (same problem you're having) but they emailed me and said I can link a bank account. Coinbase is absolutely hopeless. It's amazing that Coinbase is the supposedly well-funded big dog in the space. No support, the entire system locked up for two days when bitcoin hit 10k. Imagine everyone trying to get their money out during a crash. Coinbase won't last. Bad management IMO.

Plenty of profits to be made in the coming years. This is the Internet in like 1986 when research labs were still developing the underlying protocols. The idea that the public can bet on engineering experiments is nuts. The real money will be made when actual companies provide actual services to the public. Think Amazon, Google, Facebook. Nobody ever heard of them in 1995 when the Internet first hit public awareness.

Bitcoin's insane energy consumption, explained

According to one widely cited website that tracks the subject, the Bitcoin network is consuming power at an annual rate of 32TWh—about as much as Denmark. By the site's calculations, each Bitcoin transaction consumes 250kWh, enough to power homes for nine days.

Who would have thought that cryptocurrency could significantly contribute to global warming by consuming vast amounts of power? The growth curve is such that, if it continues, Bitcoin will absorb all the world's power production in a few years.

Once again I ask, which came first the Cryptolock or the Cryptocurrency? Cryptocurrency became the vogue way of paying off the ransom to those who Cryptolocked their systems. I am pretty sure that the very lock I am speaking of was attempted at PF but there was no money to be had, so they unlocked it and moved on but not before making financial requests of Paul while holding the forum hostage. — ArguingWAristotleTiff

Depends on how precise about it you want to be. Programs like Cryptolocker became popular around 2012, when hackers started mass producing ready-for-use hacking suites like Nanocore and the Burp suites. But Cryptolocker is really no different (except in complexity and range) from most ransomware programs, and ransomware dates back to 1989, the PC Cyborg Trojan from J. Popp, which forced programs to lock and show a new license agreement fee which had to be agreed to to unlock them, looking legit enough, and sent the money directly to Popp.

I've had more luck with CEX. Just need to verify a bank transfer and then I'm good to go. :)

Largest Crypto-Mining Exchange Confirms It Was Hacked, $62 Million In Bitcoin Stolen

Yes the exchanges and wallets are the weak point in the system. The core protocol is cryptographically secure (unless the NSA already has a backdoor, which I regard as highly likely) but the exchanges and wallets are a target for every hacker in the world.

Here's a guy who lost $155k worth of bitcoin (probably worth a lot more at today's price) over the unsecured WiFi in a restaurant. What a brave new world we live in.

↪fishfry I've had more luck with CEX. Just need to verify a bank transfer and then I'm good to go. :) — Michael

Thanks for the tip. I'll check them out.

ps -- CEX has a much higher price for bitcoin than the other exchanges. Also there are some Reddit complaints about it being difficult to get your USD out. Best to check around before committing too much money to these guys. Or any exchange for that matter. All the exchanges are awful at the moment. It's a problem.

You can go paper.

I have reviewed this craze, declare it a fad, and await its demise. Carry on.

A fad that can be easy money.

Just got an email from them in response to my query regarding the long wait for verification: "From entire CEX.IO team, I ask for your patience - please allow us some days to go through the request log."

Gonna try again with CodeBase tonight. Had an issue yesterday where the photos of my ID weren't high enough quality so they were rejected, and that placed a 24 hour block before I could try again. Hopefully I'll have more luck this time.

A fad that can be easy money. — Michael

And also easy losses of money.

Trading of fictive commodities without much underlying value is always a zero-sum game.

Trading of fictive commodities without much underlying value is always a zero-sum game. — Agustino

There could be a lot of real, down-to-earth value to algo mining, if it was applied to other domains of research. Cryptocurrencies that allow smart contracts writing, like Ethereum, also technically empowers those that can write them to somewhat organise a self-containted legal system, creating settings where the funds are only accessible on certain dates, past a minimum balance, if only a number of the currency ownership group agrees to the spending, and only to be spent on certain things. The ability of the miner to determine the range of use of the currency is, in a way, a sort of value.

Okay, so how does this translate into economic value? Who exactly, in what industry, would be helped?

Okay, so how does this translate into economic value? Who exactly, in what industry, would be helped? — Agustino

Anyone who would want to set up regulations on their funds without having to pay banking or wiring fees. It doesn't specifically helps an industrial domain, it just empowers you to do what you ask your bank to do. More or less.

Anyone who would want to set up regulations on their funds without having to pay banking or wiring fees. It doesn't specifically helps an industrial domain, it just empowers you to do what you ask your bank to do. More or less. — Akanthinos

Right, except that it's very risky. If your Bitcoins get stolen, that's it, you're finished - they're not backed by anything.

The only case where it makes sense really is for illegal activities. Drugs, arms trading, etc.