• Mitchell
    133
    “self-consciousness, far from being an illuminating principle, as traditional philosophy has held, on the contrary shuts the human being in on himself and thus results in opacity rather than enlightenment.”
    Gabriel Marcel, The Existential Background of Human Dignity (1963), p. 34.

    I like this thought, although not unique to Marcel. It explains why I feel alienated from others, from nature, and, even sometimes, from myself.
  • Sam26
    2.7k
    It seems to be a core feature of being self-conscious that one is aware or illuminated, so to speak, but that doesn't mean there aren't negative aspects of being self-conscious. My belief is that being human is only one reality where self-consciousness presents itself, and that it probably expands in other ways. This seems to be what people who have experienced NDEs testify to.
  • Shawn
    13.2k
    To think of yourself as a subject and object is illuminating, just that you can't do it simultaneously.
  • Wayfarer
    22.3k
    self-consciousness, far from being an illuminating principle, as traditional philosophy has held, on the contrary shuts the human being in on himself and thus results in opacity rather than enlightenment.”Mitchell

    Hence the emphasis on the principle of ‘anatta’ in Pali Buddhism.
  • JustSomeGuy
    306

    I see you're a Sōtō Zen Buddhist. I've always thought Zen Buddhism sounded very interesting, but have never taken the time to really learn much about it. Are there any books you would recommend for a beginner?
  • unenlightened
    9.2k
    “self-consciousness, far from being an illuminating principle, as traditional philosophy has held, on the contrary shuts the human being in on himself and thus results in opacity rather than enlightenment.”
    Gabriel Marcel, The Existential Background of Human Dignity (1963), p. 34.

    I like this thought, although not unique to Marcel. It explains why I feel alienated from others, from nature, and, even sometimes, from myself.
    Mitchell

    There is an aspect of truth to this, and there is an aspect of utter nonsense equivalent to the argument that because we have eyes, that are sensitive to light, we cannot see anything. There is an inevitable shutting in of consciousness in the sense that sensitivity is limited; I am feeling this body, and seeing from this point of view, and not another's. This is a feature of bodies, not of consciousness, that this body is disconnected from that body.

    But in talking of consciousness, one is distinguishing the experiencer from the experienced, and if one does that rigorously, then the experiencer has no qualities, and thus no identity. One can no longer talk of my consciousness as being other than your consciousness, as they are identical featureless arenas of experience, and only the play of experience distinguishes them. All points of view are identically points, and only the view varies.

    To fully understand this, to 'realise' it, which is to make the reality of it present in consciousness at every moment, is to see through the opacity of self, or rather to see that the opacity of the other is simply a limitation of embodiment; that I am also there, seeing that, and saying from the limitations of that view, “self-consciousness, far from being an illuminating principle, as traditional philosophy has held, on the contrary shuts the human being in on himself and thus results in opacity rather than enlightenment.”, temporarily blinded by having eyes.
  • Wayfarer
    22.3k
    Try Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind, Shunryu Suzuki, first published in about 1969 but still a classic.

    And To Meet the Real Dragon, Gudo Wafu Nishijima - more recent, but also a very good text.

    Alan Watts' Way of Zen is also a good book.
  • Wosret
    3.4k
    Self-Consciousness is Adam covering himself, and hiding from God. It is to reflexively self-objectify. This is how I'm seen, this is how I'm perceived, this is what I look like, and am in their eyes. This self-objectification makes us immediately wish to block, manipulate, or otherwise control the perceptions of others and the world of ourselves.

    Being without this reflexivity, of being smart, being dumb, being beautiful, being ugly, etc. These judgments, these evaluations torment us on a near constant basis. The tree of the knowledge of good and evil, this self-reflexivity transforms Eden at once into a desert. Turns everything into work, and toil.
  • anonymous66
    626
    I was about to disagree with the OP. But, upon reflection, I would agree that self-consciousness is a negative quality... but self-awareness is not.
    from wiki
    Self-consciousness is a heightened sense of self-awareness. It is a preoccupation with oneself, as opposed to the philosophical state of self-awareness, which is the awareness that one exists as an individual being, though the two terms are commonly used interchangeably or synonymously.[1] An unpleasant feeling of self-consciousness may occur when one realizes that one is being watched or observed, the feeling that "everyone is looking" at oneself. Some people are habitually more self-conscious than others. Unpleasant feelings of self-consciousness are sometimes associated with shyness or paranoia.
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