Wrath is an excess of anger, again, it's defined such that it's always wrong.Wrath is inherently wrong, agree or not? — Baden
You just have an unnatural aversion to violence, such that you don't see that it's ever good. — Agustino
Violence in-itself is not a problem. — Agustino
What is violence in-itself? To me, in-itself it is always contextual. — Agustino
Facts can be inconvenient. But they're all we have to work with. If it was a close thing on the statistics it'd be arguable. But I really don't think it is, overall. — Baden
There is something amiss though, which is our tendency towards violence, which is violently repressed in modern states, thankfully. Of course, the problem is we have bigger sticks and we can throw them further. — Baden
A whole lot of our nobler passions are predicated on our knowing we're economically secure. — csalisbury
Lyotard has a fantastic essay, 're-writing modernity' that attempts to show that the self-condemnation of western civ is a an extension of the same project that led to them doing what they have to apologize for. I'll have to try to find a link. — csalisbury
The reality is that no one wants my tomatoes. — unenlightened
And you are all telling me that I should be grateful for this to the state violence that protects me. — unenlightened
And I do not believe you. I believe it is because this is a neglected corner of the empire, that is of little interest to powers of all kinds. Not worth planting a bomb here, unless the forces happen to choose it for their celebrations. Too poor to sustain its own Mafia, and too under resourced to to be worth fighting over. The reality is that no one wants my tomatoes. — unenlightened
I thought this said it all and well-said at that, anything else being mere detail.Hurrah for sapiens sapiens, a territorial primate, who’s closest cousin, in a manner of speaking, is pan troglodytes? I see it as in the nature of the beast, which may be modified somewhat by civilization. Hurrah for civilization, as imperfect as it is! — Stan
Mafia-like organizations thrive in poverty, in areas that are truly of little interest to powers of all kinds. This is how Fascism was able to take roots as well. Impoverished areas, like the Po Valley, with no recourse to State Relief. are provided a second strong-arm state by those with ambitions to power, who sniff places out like this as if by instinct. Enough areas like this, the more the shadow state is strengthened, and the possibility of a political coup. — csalisbury
Okay, how do we live in peace if I want X, and you also want X, and we both can't have it? Must there not be some means or manner for the two of us to negotiate, or at least for the two of us to determine who gets X and who doesn't? If there is such a means, then that means itself is violent, under the definition we are using. — Agustino
That's not true. Violence does not always produce resentment. — Agustino
I am seeking to justify something - armed deterrence - that you call violence and that I do not. The state that results from that, I call peace and you do not.I think you are trying to justify violence and pretend it is peace. — unenlightened
As far as this goes, I am in passionate agreement. Your OP was poetic and moving. Poetry can evoke powerful emotions, in this case, for me, emotions of sadness that we, like all other animals, have violence indelibly written in our genes.I have merely pointed out and lamented that the world that we live in is founded on violence. — unenlightened
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