Because we fear death, and because there's nothing you can do about it. While it is possible to come to terms with your own mortality, not everyone has -- and even when you have the fear doesn't disappear. It's just something you have accepted.

Also, one's relationship to death is fairly personal. So talking about death is something you do with people you are close with, since you are revealing something that is vulnerable about yourself.

Because we fear death, and because there's nothing you can do about it. — Moliere

Would that make us irrational then, to fear death? If nothing can be done about it's inevitability then isn't the proper attitude to calmy accept it?

Rationality always works within a delimited field. Death is outside that. Its beyond rationality/irrationality.

Rationality always works within a delimited field. Death is outside that. Its beyond rationality/irrationality. — csalisbury

It's after finitude, for sure.

So, whereof one cannot speak, one must be silent?

But, this just reinforces the social stigma of talking about death.

Would that make us irrational then, to fear death? If nothing can be done about it's inevitability then isn't the proper attitude to calmy accept it? — Posty McPostface

I don't know. I think I'd put it like this -- there are different kinds of fear. And one kind of fear of death is where death ends up ruling your life. I think I'd term this sort of fear an irrational fear. This, I believe, was the target of Epicurean therapy -- in some interpretations the fear of death was thought to be the root cause of accumulating wealth and power, for instance, as if you could literally stave off death by becoming powerful or immortal in the minds of others.

But simply feeling the fear? I don't think that's irrational. I don't know if it's rational either. But I do believe that death and vulnerability are closely linked together, and that the ancient therapies which made nothing of death were also aiming at something almost inhuman -- invulnerability. Since we are mortal they aimed at an invulnerability of the mind or heart.

I suppose I'd say that if you or someone happens to land in a place where death is nothing to you, and you live in ataraxic equanimity then that's great. But I don't know if it's necessarily a goal. More like -- if it happens to you and you're happy then fine, but if not then you can come to terms with your fear, feel it, without it dominating your life. And the latter seems like a much more achievable, human goal.

Oh no I think its a thing worth talking about - I just mean the way in which its talkable about is outside of reason. Its inherently emotional. I *would* disagree with something like: 'Whereof one cannot provide a rational resting point, thereof one must be silent"

Have you heard of "Death Cafe"? No, it's not a term for really, really bad food. It's a simple program where people meet over coffee and cake and talk about death for 90 minutes or so. Usually a 'Death Cafe' will meet several times.

There's no agenda beyond people getting together and talking about death and dying. They don't have to be anywhere close to dying (at least as far as they know).

We don't generally talk about death with other people. The topic, in general, is often seen as a negative or faux pas. — Posty McPostface

Death is a buzz kill, no doubt.

When I was a young man I didn't think about dying, didn't happen to have many funerals to attend, didn't talk about death much. AIDS changed that. People I knew who were my age or younger were dying difficult -- agonizing -- deaths. Later on my parents died, a brother and a sister died, my partner died, and there were others -- brothers in law, a niece, two nephews, friends, acquaintances. Cancer, old age, heart disease...

Get used to dying; it helps to be on a first name basis. You won't die sooner or later because of it, but it's less of a dread.

Have you heard of "Death Cafe"? — Bitter Crank

I haven't. Thanks for bringing that up. I doubt I'll attend any meetings; but, it's cool that they have those.

It's much worse than it seems. The Angel of Death isn't content to leave you alone until your final day, but is continually attempting to hack pieces out of you until the final fatal blow. We die in stages, in degrees, continually. Senses dull, faculties slow, and fail. All along the journey, it requires a near super human effort to maintain health, contentment, presence... gravity twisting and distorting you, muscles tiring from overuse, and others atrophying from underuse. Every stress taking its toll.

But, I'm alive right now, and my own death is pure fiction. Right now is all that exists, and my own death doesn't, but all of those pressures trying to slowly kill me... that's another story.

We die in stages, in degrees, continually. Senses dull, faculties slow, and fail. All along the journey, it requires a near super human effort to maintain health, contentment, presence... gravity twisting and distorting you, muscles tiring from overuse, and others atrophying from underuse. Every stress taking its toll. — All sight

That's not death. That's life under less than ideal conditions (which is generally the case).

Just remember... you're slightly uncomfortable? Pains in too many joints? Don't see well? Can't hear worth a damn? You tire easily? Your hair is gone? You're no longer beautiful/handsome/just too marvelous for words? Oh dear...

Just consider the alternative. As it says in Ecclesiastes, "It is better to be a live dog than a dead lion."

but all of those pressures trying to slowly kill me — All sight

Stop bellyaching. We're all in the same boat.

I only mean to say that "death" isn't a thing, it's an abstraction, that's definition has changed over time, from failure of the heart, until we started restarting them, to failure of the brain. It's abstract, and vague, but the things that are killing you are very crisp, and very real.

I don't know what you're identifying with through time. Clearly we are our body and faculties, and like the heap problem, at what point we are no longer ourselves, as we've been too damaged, or altered isn't clear. Even a drastic change in outlook, one can say that they are not the same as before. Under ideal conditions... perhaps, but I think that the ideal conditions we're speaking of is the health and functionality of our faculties which as a totality constitute us, and the degradation and loss of those faculties until their complete loss.

It's after finitude, for sure. — Marchesk

Well its after (following on @unenlightened's post) anything you can think. you just cant get there from here, thinking. tho youre fated to get there nonethless.)

When you think about it, there's not much to talk about, is there?

So, why is it taboo to talk about death? — Posty McPostface

It's only taboo to those who've not come to acceptable terms with it. Many are taught to fear it. That teaching can run deep. Others are taught that it can be an honorable thing, in specific instances, including suicide in ancient Japanese cultures. This is honorable as a result of not allowing oneself to be captured or killed by the enemy. Hence, the kamikaze pilots and the samurai falling onto his own sword.

When you think about it, there's not much to talk about, is there? — Ciceronianus the White

Indeed, yet we are here talking about it.

It's only taboo to those who've not come to acceptable terms with it. Many are taught to fear it. That teaching can run deep. Others are taught that it can be an honorable thing, in specific instances, including suicide in ancient Japanese cultures. This is honorable as a result of not allowing oneself to be captured or killed by the enemy. Hence, the kamikaze pilots and the samurai falling onto his own sword. — creativesoul

I don't feel as though we are taught to fear it. Think about elephants or chimpanzees that mourn the dead. They don't show fear towards the dead, just a sense of loss.

I don't feel as though we are taught to fear it. Think about elephants or chimpanzees that mourn the dead. They don't show fear towards the dead, just a sense of loss. — Posty McPostface

Certainly some animals mourn. I do not see the relevance of that to death being a taboo subject to some people.

You may not have been taught to fear death. Many are. Not all.

Certainly animals mourn. I do not see the relevance to death being a taboo subject to some people. — creativesoul

Well, animals mourn and are not fearful of death. It's just a natural thing for them that they witness every day. Animals can become depressed or sad or anxious; but, never fearful of death. Is it our self-awareness that comes into play that makes us fear death?

"death" isn't a thing, it's an abstraction — All sight

Sure, as a noun naming a completed process it's abstract, but in concrete terms, death is a material process. Except if we are killed instantly (as in exploded, vaporized) death follows various courses. Various diseases instigate progressive organ failure, for instance. Death finally occurs when the life-supporting capacity of the vital organs (heart, lung, kidney, liver, lower brain functions) collapses altogether.

Sherwin B. Nuland wrote a best seller, "How We Die" in 1994. He himself died at 84 of prostate cancer in 2014. Nuland, a surgeon, provides straightforward information on how we make our departures from this world -- what tends to fail first, how how one organ failure can cascade, etc. Good book.

Indeed, yet we are here talking about it. — Posty McPostface

Are we? It seems to me we're talking mostly about the fact people fear it, people and other animals mourn the death of other people and animals, and whether and why it's a taboo subject. True, there has been some mention of causes of death, and when death occurs. We can talk about planning for death, how to face death, how death is caused in various cases, how we react or should react to death, whether there's an afterlife, whether the soul survives death, whether there are ghosts, but death itself?

That does sound like a good book. Thanks for mentioning it.

Talking about death can be cathartic, I think, and seeing as we have only a finite amount of emotion in us with regard to any topic, once you've exhausted that, you can probably equally take it or leave it. And I don't think there's a particular taboo surrounding death any more than any other depressing topic, more so than just confusion about what to meaningfully say. Like, what do you say about it beyond platitude in the context of the way we live now? Maybe the way we live now just is on the basis that nothing can be said of death beyond platitude. As long as we keep that going, all's well. Just thinking aloud, but that's what occurs to me.

We can talk about planning for death, how to face death, how death is caused in various cases, how we react or should react to death, whether there's an afterlife, whether the soul survives death, whether there are ghosts, but death itself? — Ciceronianus the White

Well, yes, all of that constitutes what death is. The planning, reaction, and whole drama with death are conducive to elucidating what death is.

And I don't think there's a particular taboo surrounding death any more than any other depressing topic, more so than just confusion about what to meaningfully say. — Baden

Why is that?

So, why is it taboo to talk about death?

I read a quote once I forget by who that reads.

He was afraid of death because he never lived.

Or words to that effect.

I suspect that we fear death more these days because we are so full of our own sense of self importance, the undeniable counter argument to our self importance and validity is death.

The notional construct of God is perhaps a derivative of our fear of death and regardless of its origins, it has certainly been significantly diluted since the advent of science. I suspect that we fear death more in the West because we are so wealthy and so removed from God, from the truth of ourselves, from community and from nature. Our wealth allows us to live very independent lives, we have our own cars houses, private worlds and lives on the internet etc. The more materially independent we are the more we are removed from nature and from the realities of nature. Death is final word from nature, and when we are removed from a dialogue with nature death is more distant and more alien to us.

Today we face the ultimate challenge (death) relatively more alone than ever before. Undoubtedly when the environment begins to collapse and man is returned towards a dependent interaction with and reliance upon nature and community death will be far less. I suspect that people who are more fundamentally honest with themselves and who are more intouch with 'nature' are less worried by death.

M

I suspect that we fear death more in the West because we are so wealthy and so removed from God, from the truth of ourselves, from community and from nature. Our wealth allows us to live very independent lives, we have our own cars houses, private worlds and lives on the internet etc. The more materially independent we are the more we are removed from nature and from the realities of nature. Death is final word from nature, and when we are removed from a dialogue with nature death is more distant and more alien to us. — Marcus de Brun

I think God factors in only insofar that we have a notion of what death ought to look like. Death just doesn't fit the narrative of identity. We are used to the idea of identity having a non-temporal permanence; but, that just isn't so. So, death is a direct onslaught on our conception of our/ones/my identity. I don't want to die because I have identified with myself in a non-temporal fashion.

Indeed.. but lots of presumption here.

What does it mean to have 'lived'.?

What does it mean to identify with ones self.?

I think if one gets a really good slice of life's pie, one will be satisfied and have less fear of dying, just like its hard to feel or fear hunger after Christmas dinner.

M