A personal purpose can be any methodology which helps heal the illusion of division which is fundamental to the human experience. — Jake
Christianity has lasted 2,000 years because the experience of love which it suggests works in helping people dilute an experience of reality as being divided between "me" and "everything else", an experience which generates fear and suffering — Jake
The typical person is not overly concerned with abstractions like enhancing social unity, but is instead engaging in religion to address their own personal situation. — Jake
Don’t need religion for this purpose. If fact, religious beliefs and practices may get in the way of fulfilling this purpose. — praxis
Christianity has lasted 2,000 years because the experience of love which it suggests works in helping people dilute an experience of reality as being divided between "me" and "everything else", an experience which generates fear and suffering — Jake
Why would you suggest that? — All sight
I would even add that traditionally "philosophy" is not mere idle talk, but meant a way of life, which is precisely why religion is one of the center stage subjects, and the idle musings on technical subjects that one in no sense practices is what is not philosophical. — All sight
The essential or primary purpose is to provide a system of meaning that can bind a community in common values and purpose, like a kind of glue that holds a tribe together. — praxis
The "purpose" of religion is to provide a context for consideration of the other, beyond the self, and an inter-subjective understanding of our place in the world. — Relativist
Religion is the appeal to the ineffable for answers to questions not otherwise answered. — tim wood
I think it’s an early attempt at building a metaphysical model of the universe — Devans99
[Religion]'s real value is as a philosophy, and it ought to be treated as such — S
...it ought to be treated as such, and compared to other philosophies as though on a level playing field, not mindlessly worshipped or placed on a pedestal — S
For Hadot...the means for the philosophical student to achieve the “complete reversal of our usual ways of looking at things” epitomized by the Sage were a series of spiritual exercises. These exercises encompassed all of those practices still associated with philosophical teaching and study: reading, listening, dialogue, inquiry, and research. However, they also included practices deliberately aimed at addressing the student’s larger way of life, and demanding daily or continuous repetition: practices of attention (prosoche), meditations (meletai), memorizations of dogmata, self-mastery (enkrateia), the therapy of the passions, the remembrance of good things, the accomplishment of duties, and the cultivation of indifference towards indifferent things (PWL 84).
.Please help me determine which claim with no evidence I should go with.
.Why could it not simply be that the universe just exists with us being a part of it?
.That is what theists claim about their god - that it just exists and has always existed.
.Also, we have a problem in defining "god", no?
.What is a "god"?
If you do not care to treat religion with respect, that's your business. But ad hominem attacks on those who disagree with you is hardly structured thought, never mind philosophy.... :chin: — Pattern-chaser
I also agree that a key problem for religion is that it typically tries to use thought (beliefs etc) to solve the problem, when in fact thought is the source of the problem. It's a process which can be like an alcoholic trying to cure his disease with a case of scotch. — Jake
First, we can observe in our own lives that we experience reality as being divided between "me" and "everything else". "Me" is very very small, and "everything else" is very very big. This is a perspective which naturally generates fear, which in turn generates inner and outer conflict and all kinds of related problems. — Jake
Jesus suggested "dying to be reborn", sometimes called love, a process of surrendering the "me" to something or somebody else. To the degree the "me" melts away in a particular situation, so does the perceived division, and thus the fear, and thus the inner conflict, and thus the outer conflict. The user dies to division and fear, and is reborn in to peace. — Jake
First, we can observe in our own lives that we experience reality as being divided between "me" and "everything else". "Me" is very very small, and "everything else" is very very big. This is a perspective which naturally generates fear, which in turn generates inner and outer conflict and all kinds of related problems. — Jake
All of them. Now the ball is in your court to show evidence for just one.He’s claiming that there’s no evidence for any of the wide variety of diverse beliefs of people who use the word “God”. He’d need to specify a particular belief, in order to speak of whether or not there’s evidence for it. — Michael Ossipoff
Exactly. It is a conglomeration of evidence that provides proof, and there isn't one bit of evidence for the existence of god that can't be explained better without invoking the word, "god". Again, the ball is in your court.The first definition listed in Merriam-Webster, for “evidence” is “outward sign”. One thing for Harry to understand is that evidence isn’t necessarily proof. — Michael Ossipoff
It is they that approach me, or create posts on this forum. I merely question their unfounded claims. I don't go around announcing my atheism. There is nothing to announce.If you’d wanted to find out more about their beliefs, then you’d need to have approached them a lot more politely. No one’s obligated to talk to someone conceited, rude and aggressive. No one’s obligated to participate in an argument. Would it be surprising if Theists aren’t interested in conversation with the likes of you? — Michael Ossipoff
The burden to define god is on the person making the claim.You have a problem specifying what you’re talking about.
If you don’t know what you mean by it, then maybe you aren’t in a position to rule, or decide for others, about it. — Michael Ossipoff
First, we can observe in our own lives that we experience reality as being divided between "me" and "everything else". "Me" is very very small, and "everything else" is very very big. This is a perspective which naturally generates fear, which in turn generates inner and outer conflict and all kinds of related problems.
— Jake
Speak for yourself.
It seems to me, thanks to the knowledge science is providing, that everything is interconnected. I don't experience a fear of everything else. I experience curiosity. If it is fear that you experience, then no wonder you turn to a delusion - to alleviate that fear. — Harry Hindu
It seems that your first and second paragraph contradict each other. If existential anxiety is a natural consequence of how our minds evolved, then existential anxiety is natural. Any attempt to separate human beings from nature would be a mistake. Every animal has it's own unique set of physical and psychological adaptations to its environment. Humans are no different.I think that Jake may be generally referring to existential anxiety. I don’t see how it could be natural to fear largeness or otherness.
Existential anxiety could be a natural consequence of how our minds evolved and, in a sense, is caused by ‘thought’. Our ability to form concepts of self and death, combined with our ability simulate and anticipate future events may naturally lead to it. — praxis
If the universe has a cause, then yes, science should be able to explain that causal relationship.Do you think science will be able to definitely answer how the universe was created one day ?? — Rank Amateur
If the universe has a cause, then yes, science should be able to explain that causal relationship. — Harry Hindu
I disagree that "thought" or dualism is the problem, however. I believe the problem may center around particular thoughts, or rather concepts, that arise in our cultural conditioning, particularly those involving our self-concept, our personal narratives, etc. — praxis
"Me" is very big or significant, and "everything else" is small or of less significance, and it's this selfishness that makes us fail to act cooperatively. — praxis
In a perfect world, religion functions to reduce our selfishness and increase our cooperation for the mutual benefit of all. — praxis
I see things in much the same way, but it’s much more difficult than it can be made to sound in that kind of analysis. — Wayfarer
True, truth can be hard to take in. I know that's not what you mean but I just thought I'd just add to the argument. — MountainDwarf
This is why I believe Christianity went through a reformation. — MountainDwarf
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