With the driving example, one thing that's important to point out is that we're not talking about propositional knowledge there, we're talking about "how to" knowledge at best--in other words, the ability to do something. In that scenario, by saying that it's evidence of subconscious mental content, you're ruling out that it can simply be akin to "muscle memory," and you're saying that it's necessary to think about it in some sense, just where you're not aware that you're thinking about it. So in the face of a challenge about that, we'd need to be able to provide evidence that there's necessarily something mental about it. — Terrapin Station
The driving home involves some sort of mental control. The physical body cannot achieve such things unaided. — Pattern-chaser
What's the support of the claim? — Terrapin Station
With the driving example, one thing that's important to point out is that we're not talking about propositional knowledge there, we're talking about "how to" knowledge at best--in other words, the ability to do something. In that scenario, by saying that it's evidence of subconscious mental content, you're ruling out that it can simply be akin to "muscle memory," and you're saying that it's necessary to think about it in some sense, just where you're not aware that you're thinking about it. So in the face of a challenge about that, we'd need to be able to provide evidence that there's necessarily something mental about it. — Terrapin Station
"You're dreaming even when you're not aware of any content of the dreams in question." — Terrapin Station
(b) A third-person observer is claiming empirical evidence of someone else's mental phenomena. — Terrapin Station
Just to clarify, the dispute isn't over whether the brain is involved in some way. It obviously is. The dispute is over whether there are mental phenomena occurring that we're not aware of. What are mental phenomena? — Terrapin Station
The content is conscious but the argument is that prior to that it was subconscious otherwise we would have prior knowledge of it or be able to predict it coming. — JupiterJess
IE: the observer predicts this mental content exists at X time and will be made conscious to the subject at Y time? — JupiterJess
They're phenomena that have to do with the brain, and its activities. This is about vocabulary, not more. "Mental" is the word we use for this purpose. — Pattern-chaser
There are people who posit that there is not only unconscious/subconscious brain activity, but that the unconscious brain activity consists of things such as thoughts, desires, concepts, etc. If you don't posit that then that's fine. — Terrapin Station
there is mental stuff of some sort going on when, for example, we drive home without conscious intervention. — Pattern-chaser
All you're saying there is that there is brain activity? Or are you saying that the brain activity in question is something in the vein of thinking, desiring, etc.--those sorts of things? — Terrapin Station
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