How to combat suicidal thoughts?

Shawn

I've been struggling with suicidal thoughts since I was 15. Now, I am nearly 29 and the thoughts are reaching a crescendo. A lot of stuff has been going on; but, the persuasiveness of the thoughts are becoming too real. The rationale is that I don't feel like I'm in control of my life, and have to deal with too much crap going on around me.

The main motivating force is that I know I will die at some point of my life and having control as to when and how is quite appealing. The only reason why I do go on living instead of committing suicide is that I have a caring mother. It would be too much for her to handle for me to do such an act. Not that she wouldn't be able to cope with it; but, I don't want her to suffer because of my selfish act.

Now, I have tried countless medications, therapy, and such; but, the thoughts are zapping away what little enthusiasm for life that I have. I am in a precarious state of wanting to go on and not wanting to go on.

It's been nearly fifteen years of trying to banish the bad thoughts away, yet, here I still am in this miserable state of existence. Any thoughts or help appreciated.

Please don't just focus on "me" here, as I do notice quite a few of these motifs around here too by other members.

I like sushi

Take control. This requires change. When there is nothing left I think it is worth trying some drastic change in order to shake things up and then to build structure and control out of such circumstances.

At worst such change will put the previous ‘lack of control’ in perspective.

Shawn

Take control. This requires change. When there is nothing left I think it is worth trying some drastic change in order to shake things up and then to build structure and control out of such circumstances.

At worst such change will put the previous ‘lack of control’ in perspective. — I like sushi

One of the few things that I learned about depression is that it is mainly a lack of sense of control in one's life that contributes to the malaise. Yet, I have meager income and little that I can do about my current situation. I have thought about moving out; but, have no savings or money I can spare to move out of the country. Ideally, I want to return back to Europe and live out my days over there.

But, the issue is that somewhere back in the recesses of my mind, there is a part of "me" that drags me down and observes me in this precarious state and when "it" sees the opportunity, then it lunges forward and chastizes me for choosing to live. When I don't listen to this part of me, it tends to manifest in bad decision makings, such as seeking out drugs or some such matter. It really wants things its way...

It sucks, or this part of me needs to go away for me to move on in life, yet it is there.

Have you ever had depression?

I like sushi

↪Wallows

Of course! I imagine most people have to some degree or another.

My simplistic understanding is that sometimes it is best to hit the bottom in order to bounce up again ... but sadly it’s not without pain and not without risk. Generally speaking fear can be extremely debilitating. I personally think most of people’s day-to-day woes are a repercussion of ‘fear’ - which is, in my experience, 95-99% misleading and/or stupefying.

There is no one size fits all approach, but I firmly believe that addressing inner fears and concerns is a good road to start on - with or without trepidation (depends on individual circumstances). Honestly with the ‘self’ is always ‘partial’ honesty :)

Shawn

My simplistic understanding is that sometimes it is best to hit the bottom in order to bounce up again ... but sadly it’s not without pain and not without risk. Generally speaking fear can be extremely debilitating. I personally think most of people’s day-to-day woes are a repercussion of ‘fear’ - which is, in my experience, 95-99% misleading and/or stupefying. — I like sushi

I have been living on rock bottom for about 4-5 years. No income, on disability, nothing really accomplished, even college not completed. I mean, I don't mean to come off as a slob; but, I really did try throwing myself at trying to accomplish something since I moved back to the states 10 years ago. College, military service, maintaining a simple job, been there done that. Now, that I am on disability, it's figurately rock bottom for me, and the only way forward is upward. Yet, I often repeat to myself in a mantra, that I have everything I could wish for and that I should be more appreciative or grateful for what I already have.

What am I getting wrong here?

Matias

↪Wallows

I can relate to what you wrote. I have been suicidal since my compulsory military service (1986-87!), which really knocked me out mentally. It is an on-off thing, fluctuating with the mood swings.

Apart from my personal experiences with that topic I think that people should not kill themselves until they have reached the age of about forty. A lot of things can happen when you are young (and 29 is still young), but when you have reached age 40 you have seen what is in stock for you. The rest can be extrapolated from the way travelled so far

From the philosophical viewpoint I do not see any reason why somebody should not switch off his or her own light. It's just a shortcut to nirvana. Nobody is obliged to wait and suffer till the reaper comes and drags you to the grave.

fdrake

No algorithm will tell you what to do, the self help books don't help you when you finish them.

One of the first steps is to be frighteningly honest with yourself. If you can't mitigate your depressive habits, find out why you need them. Then challenge it.

You have to live like life's a battle on all fronts, since your mind has a habit of following you everywhere.

Baden

↪Wallows

"I don’t know: perhaps it’s a dream, all a dream. (That would surprise me.) I’ll wake, in the silence, and never sleep again. (It will be I?) Or dream (dream again), dream of a silence, a dream silence, full of murmurs (I don’t know, that’s all words), never wake (all words, there’s nothing else).

You must go on, that’s all I know.

They’re going to stop, I know that well: I can feel it. They’re going to abandon me. It will be the silence, for a moment (a good few moments). Or it will be mine? The lasting one, that didn’t last, that still lasts? It will be I?

You must go on.

I can’t go on.

You must go on.

I’ll go on. You must say words, as long as there are any - until they find me, until they say me. (Strange pain, strange sin!) You must go on. Perhaps it’s done already. Perhaps they have said me already. Perhaps they have carried me to the threshold of my story, before the door that opens on my story. (That would surprise me, if it opens.)

It will be I? It will be the silence, where I am? I don’t know, I’ll never know: in the silence you don’t know.

You must go on.

I can’t go on.

I’ll go on."

(Beckett.)

Shawn

Apart from my personal experiences with that topic I think that people should not kill themselves until they have reached the age of about forty. A lot of things can happen when you are young (and 29 is still young), but when you have reached age 40 you have seen what is in stock for you. The rest can be extrapolate from the way travelled so far — Matias

Well, forty isn't that far away. But, if anyone has been in depression, they know that time tends to drag out quite a bit, and sometimes weeks feel like months, and months feel like years. I will probably make a final decision when my mother passes away, which I hope will come about as far away into the future as possible. Having at least one person that cares about you makes everything worthwhile in my mind.

I will continue on this haphazardous existence that fate has dealt me, I don't want to encourage suicide although the thought is appealing as hell (pun intended?).

Best of luck to you.

Shawn

One of the first steps is to be frighteningly honest with yourself. — fdrake

Tried that. Talked with my therapist, and he has the attitude of being honest with me when I am not with myself as much as I should.

But, when depression robs you of any desire to get better, then what do you do? Cope?

Shawn

↪Baden

:strong:

fdrake

Tried that. Talked with my therapist, and he has the attitude of being honest with me when I am not with myself as much as I should. — Wallows

Will just leave this here.

Terrapin Station

The main motivating force is that I know I will die at some point of my life and having control as to when and how is quite appealing. — Wallows

It might be worth contemplating why you have such a need for control of everything that you'd rather die sooner while having control of it than live longer while not having control of how you'll die.

In short, why is control even more important than life to you?

What is it in your experiences and dispositions so far that gives you such an overpowering need for control?

YuZhonglu

EDIT: Computer games. They're a good antidote to depression.

tim wood

Now, I am nearly 29 and the thoughts are reaching a crescendo. — Wallows

If you're serious, then you need to find a good ("good" as in good and not bad) mental health professional, probably a counselor/therapist and probably not a medical doctor. And go from there and stay with it. What you have is an illness amounting to a disease - you gonna treat that at the grocery store?

Or you're not or you don't. What do we say to you then?

Shawn

↪fdrake

All I got out of the concept of "games people play" was the wrong assumption that the depressive likes the game her or she plays. In most cases, the depressive simply hates playing games at all. In my case, I never cared for establishing a relationship.

Shawn

In short, why is control even more important than life to you? — Terrapin Station

Deep question. Goes back to how my father blew up our already meager family relationship. In short, given my upbringing, I've become averse to either being in control (over the fear of losing control), and not being in control (over the fear of losing control).

It's a no-win attitude that is exacerbated by my depression. (insight achieved?)

fdrake

All I got out of the concept of "games people play" was the wrong assumption that the depressive likes the game her or she plays. In most cases, the depressive simply hates playing games at all. — Wallows

I'm not saying you like it. I think the deeper point of games people play is that it reveals that patterns and habits which are difficult to break usually have some pay off.

Terrapin Station

↪Wallows

Maybe it would help to focus on being more comfortable in situations where you're not in control?

420mindfulness

Hi I am certain that you have tried many self help books, but I would like to recommend 'The Awakened Ape: A Biohacker's Guide to Evolutionary Fitness, Natural Ecstasy, and Stress-Free Living' by Jevan Pradas.
It is an audio book that helped me greatly before I ever reached the suicidal point, but I believe it could be of help.
Everything in life is just an experience. This includes depression. Use this experience to grow.
Realise that you are not in complete control of your mind. If you were you wouldn't be depressed.
It is reasonable to assume then that these thoughts are not yours, and therefore it is necessary to distance them from your deliberate thoughts. They are not yours, and not your concern as it were.
In case too, then, this means suicidal thoughts and intentions are not yours and should be seen only as 'passers by'.
Acceptance of this starts regaining control of your mind, and your life. Bad days happen. That's ok. They are done. They have happened and can't be changed. Bad days will happen again, this is no reason to worry now. All this achieves is another bad day today. Be aware of your thoughts and where they come from.
Please listen to the book.

Shawn

If you're serious, then you need to find a good ("good" as in good and not bad) mental health professional, probably a counselor/therapist and probably not a medical doctor. — tim wood

I don't have the luxury anymore of choosing my therapist or psychiatrist. Anyway, I've seen my fair share of head shrinkers and pill pushers here and in Europe.

I was never able to discern a common theme over the span of my duration of visiting those people.

Shawn

I'm not saying you like it. I think the deeper point of games people play is that it reveals that patterns and habits which are difficult to break usually have some pay off. — fdrake

In this regard, I lack insight into my own condition, and I really have no idea who would be able to discern the chaff from the wheat. All I have are a diagnosis that is being addressed individually with medication.

To be quite honest, I see this as a philosophical issue. Namely, as to whether attitudes can be psychologized in any way. I'm assuming that they can't.

Shawn

Maybe it would help to focus on being more comfortable in situations where you're not in control? — Terrapin Station

Well, I have set myself up for a situation that I have no need to control anything. I'm on disability and have no desire to change things as they stand. This attitude is essentially, a huge "f*ck you" both to others and myself. A super-volition if you will.

Shawn

↪420mindfulness

Thanks, man, I'll see if I can muster up anything and give it a skim.

420mindfulness

Let me know how you get on
Like literally.
I will be awaiting a message :)
It is available on audible, I'm pretty sure they do a free 30 day trial, and you can cancel it and keep the free month

fdrake

In this regard, I lack insight into my own condition, and I really have no idea who would be able to discern the chaff from the wheat. All I have are a diagnosis that is being addressed individually with medication. — Wallows

I don't mean to be a debby downer, but people without insight typically don't know where they lack insight.

Shawn

I don't mean to be a debby downer, but people without insight typically don't know where they lack insight. — fdrake

Then, you point it out for me if you care to. Is this a motivational issue or generic depression?

I'm going to assume both, so in that case what can be done about my lack of interest in games people play? This goes more towards my meta-sentiment of misanthropy and projection...

Shawn

One of the things that I learned from my therapist, that scared the living shit outta me, was the notion that depression evolves as time passes by.

Now, that's some scary shit.

420mindfulness

Thoughts when, maintained by focus and attention, gain intensity and power much like a snowball starting an avalanche.
Ignored each individually thought is nothing.
How many random thoughts have popped into your head in your lifetime. How many do you remember? Make the bad thoughts one you forget.

Shawn

How many random thoughts have popped into your head in your lifetime. How many do you remember? Make the bad thoughts one you forget. — 420mindfulness

Ah, but they do tend to leave a lasting impression on one's psyche. Tangled up garbage.

Shawn

I mean, at the least I have a fighting spirit from my mom's side of the family, so things aren't dire. I'm seeking out ways to address this issue apart from isolating myself into oblivion.

There's "hope" speaking out once in a while.

How to combat suicidal thoughts?

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