Another question we could ask is "If this is the case, why are we typically having such boring sex with each other?" Maybe we should step up our game.

Another question we could ask is "If this is the case, why are we typically having such boring sex with each other?" Maybe we should step up our game. — Terrapin Station

I agree! And frankly, @Maureen, I think watching more pornography would be a good way to fire up your imagination!

In my opinion because sex becomes like dinner, whereas pornography is (almost always) like a meal, of sorts, out at a restaurant.

You need to watch some. Then you'd begin to know the nature of the beast. Or, better, Youtube videos of interviews with porn stars about aspects of their work.

Or else why does it make real sex seem less exciting? — Maureen

I think you need to do some field research. I think It'll make more sense to you then. If you aren't willing to do that, I'd explain it to you like this: you can see anything you want, at any time you want. Mankind has used its knowledge of the universe to create a mechanism for its pleasure greater than those that came before.

there must be something about pornography in general that makes it more exciting than regular sex, although it's anyone's guess as to what that is. — Maureen

Pornography is produced to meet a very wide variety of tastes. Practically, no matter what you are into, somebody is making porn that you will like. Because porn images are often shared and re-shared on social sites, Tumblr, BlogSpot, et al, the selection of images becomes even more specific and refined.

Watching a fairly narrow selection of porn is likely to raise one's expectations. Bodies are buff, organs are large, skin is healthy and tanned, the action that is shown is often "the best of". An ordinary person (one's self and one's mate) are likely to fall short.

In the other direction, unsatisfactory sex may lead individuals to seek pornographic stimulation. People who are unhappy, depressed, ill, and so forth may not feel like having sex, or giving the sexual encounter their full attention. Their partner may seek satisfaction using porn.

Pornography of a sort was produced in the Roman Empire. The invention of printing increase the supply of images. In the late 19th century, photography made possible a more explicit pornography. It takes much more time to draw and paint a sexual episode than to capture it on film. When motion pictures came along, still images were supplemented by short films.

Then sound and color were added (enabling us to hear all sorts of ecstatic moaning that rarely occurs in real life). But it wasn't until the late 1960s when the legal restrictions on producing and distributing pornography were removed that high quality porn became plentifully available at an affordable price. Since then it has gotten better and better. (Sex is sex; sex hasn't gotten better. It's the technical aspects of producing porn that have improved. So, our experience with ubiquitous porn is relatively recent.

As good as porn is, most porn productions are exemplars of third rate movie making. If it wasn't for the sex, NOBODY would watch it. Ever. I avoid porn with a plot. I want to look at just the high points of the show. The hottest parts of the hottest scenes. And stills are perfectly acceptable.

But if it causes the kinds of problems that I have described here then I have to wonder why exactly that is the case, as in why is viewing pornography supposedly better/more exciting than actual sex? Or else why does it make real sex seem less exciting? — Maureen

When I have sex with a person, I want intimacy with someone I like. It's one way, not the only way, of being close to someone you care about. As I've gotten older, I know that I would never want to have sex with someone who isn't my friend. Real sex is play. It's fun. The object is to give pleasure to he other person. Nothing particularly kinky - mostly skin on skin, lips, two people. No pain. Nothing disgusting. I don't need anyone helping out if all I want to do is ejaculate. I've gotten really good at that on my own.

On the other hand - I have a very vivid fantasy life. There are things I imagine doing that I would never want to do in real life - Causing pain. Using vulnerable people. Having power over others. Also - sex can be frustrating. It can be emotionally painful. It can be hard to find someone generous who likes you, is sexually attracted to you, and who shares your tastes. There are a lot of people in the world, probably mostly men, who feel angry and resentful that they can't find someone who wants to be intimate with them. Pornography can appeal to people who have not been able to find satisfaction in sex, love, and intimacy. That's not necessarily a bad thing.

I doubt pornography does much damage. Whatever damage is done comes from living in a society where people can't find a sense that they belong and are valued. Unless it is having effects in your life that are causing problems for you, your friends, or family, I wouldn't worry about it. Keep in mind that pornography - it's value and effects - is probably a lot easier to understand if you are a man than a woman.

Another question we could ask is "If this is the case, why are we typically having such boring sex with each other?" Maybe we should step up our game.

I think there is more to it than this, otherwise so many people would not have the same problem of getting excited by porn but not as much by regular sex after the fact. It's like if you take 100 people who have watched porn and all of them believe that having regular sex isn't as exciting as porn. The point is that porn is what caused them to believe that sex is boring.

otherwise so many people would not have the same problem of getting excited by porn but not as much by regular sex after the fact. It's like if you take 100 people who have watched porn and all of them believe that having regular sex isn't as exciting as porn. The point is that porn is what caused them to believe that sex is boring. — Maureen

Well... has this experiment been done? I would be very surprised if, in one form or another, it had not been done. There is a ton of research published on pornography and sexual behavior. Have a look. It's perfectly safe to read -- it's not pornographic or sexy.

People do tend to like novelty. Porn can become boring and dull. Sex with the same person doing exactly the same moves time after time can become boring and dull (maybe not in a week or two, but give it 20 or 30 years...)

There's much to be said about having eyes for one person. The level of intimacy is unparalleled. The depth of love unmatched. All of the pages of the future are a bit brighter if we're both disciplined and lucky.

:wink:

That said, if you want porn, don't be surprised when it not only comes up empty, but also seems to create other unforeseen issues. With two people capable of mutual consent, do-whatcha-like.

If this post isn't allowed for whatever reason then feel free to delete it, but I was reading an article online that says watching pornography makes it hard for some men to be satisfied with ordinary sex or hard for them to get an erection. So this seems to suggest that there must be something about pornography in general that makes it more exciting than regular sex, although it's anyone's guess as to what that is. — Maureen

Since it's only "some men", it might be worth looking into the sexual preferences of these men and check whether they are actually still attracted by their partners. It might be as simple as pornography catering to their actual desires.

I have personally never viewed pornography myself, but I have read that it changes people's brain chemistry, which is what initially led me to do this research in the first place, and it appears as if pornography does a lot more harm than good on the surface level. — Maureen

You'd be hard pressed to find any activity that, with sufficient repititon, does not alter brain chemistry. One can get "addicted" to porn much like one can be "addicted" to a range of other activities when your brain comes to expect a certain sensation at certain times. This is potentially harmful (especially to people whose sexuality is not yet mature), but much depends on the specific case.

These kinds of alterations of brain chemistry or "addiction" are essentially "bad habits" that can be cured via behavioural theory. What damage excessive consumption of a wide variety of pornographic material might do to a developing sexuality I don't know. I can certainly imagine it's not healthy to base your expectations on the kinds of things you can see online.

this seems to suggest that there must be something about pornography in general that makes it more exciting than regular sex, although it's anyone's guess as to what that is — Maureen

Try 'the pursuit of endless variety and limitless consumption of extreme sexual arousal and gratification'. That would be close. I'm at a loss to see how that is mysterious, although perhaps in saying that, I'm giving something away.

Anyway, it’s worth stating upfront that the overall availability and access to pornography that global internet culture has enabled is completely unprecedented. There’s never been anything remotely comparable in scope and scale. Billions of people - not an exaggeration - now have connected devices and are able to anonymously view utterly explicit pornographic imagery of a kind and quality that has never existed before. (Not only pornography, either, but all manner of cyber-mediated sexual activities.)

You might say pornography has always existed, as it simply means the graphic depictions of sexual acts intended to arouse (actually 'pornai' originally meant 'description of the activities of prostitutes'.) But the digital means of production and dissemination are unlike anything that existed previously. Besides, pornography in the modern sense could only have existed since the development of cinematic and photographic technology, so is quite recent in historical terms. But even a generation ago, access to pornography was strictly regulated by law and practically impossible to access, given the difficulty of literally finding it.

Whereas now practically anyone, including practically any child, can get instantaneous access via the very same device they're expected to use for school, to unlimited kinds of porn. I won't bother to google some of the stories on it, but I recall that some very large majority of 14 yo males had already accessed porn and presumably began to use it. (This means something different to a user, I suspect, than to the casual reader.) There have been sporadic stories in the media over the last ten years of teen girls suffering from various psychic and physical ailments as a consequence of being expected to perform the many acts that are commonly depicted in pornography.

How to assess the moral and ethical consequences, is a very difficult question. I know that amongst the internet-literate, there is a dogmatic commitment to the inherent wrongness of any idea of restricting access to pornography, protected under the umbrella of 'freedom of expression'. I understand the sentiment, but I do suspect that for many people, particularly men, who have become habituated to porn, the language of 'freedom' in this context is a bitter irony. There are large and thriving internet sites specifically set up to assist users in overcoming their habituation - I won't use the word 'addiction' - to pornography, and there is also a genre of literature dedicated to this end. Plus also encounter groups, therapists, and so on, dedicated (usually) to 'men's problems', many of which no doubt revolve around loneliness and the inability to realise any real intimacy in a world where intimacy is nowadays stock-in-trade for an entire industry - which you can effortlessly access from the device in your hip pocket.

The sexual revolution came to an end with the advent of Herpes, AIDS and Hep C.

But people are naturally promiscuous.

So they live their promiscuity out in fantasies.

Non-fantasies are restricted to one or zero number of partner. This creates a lack of intimacy, a lack of excitement, a lack of lack.

Pornography lives in the cultures of the western-types of democratic and socialist republics.

if you take 100 people who have watched porn and all of them believe that having regular sex isn't as exciting as porn. The point is that porn is what caused them to believe that sex is boring. — Maureen

Not that that would actually be the result of the poll, but what would you surmise is different if it's not the quality/creativity/variety of the sex?

Plus also encounter groups, therapists, and so on, dedicated (usually) to 'men's problems', many of which no doubt revolve around loneliness and the inability to realise any real intimacy in a world where intimacy is nowadays stock-in-trade for an entire industry - which you can effortlessly access from the device in your hip pocket. — Wayfarer

So, I’m a little curious. Is there a way that we can distinguish between real intimacy and fake intimacy? Is there a superiority that real intimacy has which we can recognize through raw experience unfiltered by our culture? For example, imagine a person who is completely unfamiliar with the common attitudes expressed by our culture surrounding the nature of true intimacy. How could this person know that the intimacy involved in pornography is not as profound as the intimacy involved in a non-cyber relationship? Would he be able to draw that distinction instinctively or must he live in a society that recognizes the distinction? These are questions that I’ve sort of been grappling with myself. Another interesting question that I thought about involves the following thought experiment; imagine that a baby was left alone in a technological fortress where he had all his needs met by a variety of AI. As the boy grew, the AI instructed the young boy on how he could gratify his social needs by chatting with people online on a platform like Google Hangouts and he could alleviate his sexual needs through pornography and paying a cam model to have an online relationship with him(we can imagine that the AI gave him the money to pay the cam model). Eventually, the boy grows up and is freed from the fortress and gets to meet people outside of the Internet. Do you think that he would wish to spend more time in the outside world or remain online most of the time?

For example, imagine a person who is completely unfamiliar with the common attitudes expressed by our culture surrounding the nature of true intimacy. How could this person know that the intimacy involved in pornography is not as profound as the intimacy involved in a non-cyber relationship? Would he be able to draw that distinction instinctively or must he live in a society that recognizes the distinction? — TheHedoMinimalist

I think as a culture, we're finding that out. I daresay if you dug into the academic journals of sociology and sexuality, there would be a lot of data. But, intuitively, I have the romantic idea that a consensual relationship within which sexual intimacy is an expression of love and commitment is superior to the habitual pursuit of sexual excitement through digital media.

One of the comments often made by individuals seeking to unshackle themselves from porn habits, is that they can't experience meaningful intimacy with another person. People are often quite imperfect compared to digital simulations. And they do a lot of things other than moan 'yes! more!' And furthermore, they stay maddeningly the same, year in, year out. Whereas in the porn world, there's an endless variety of imaginary and appealing partners. But then, they're not real, and the result in the end is just complete isolation and loneliness. That's what a lot of people are finding out.

I think, in a broader sense, many people are losing touch with reality - they have no sense of what is real at all, as if life itself is a computer game or simulation or fantasy. That has been commented on particularly by media studies scholars, like Jean Baudrillard, Neil Postman, Marshall McLuhan, and others. I think you can use media - I work in digital industries myself - but you have to keep your feet on the ground, a connection with human reality and nature. It's crucial.

But then, they're not real, and the result in the end is just complete isolation and loneliness. That's what a lot of people are finding out. — Wayfarer

That’s interesting, why do you think that some people cannot always alleviate loneliness with digital media as easily as they could by interacting with people outside of the Internet? I’m asking this question mainly because I rarely interact with people outside of my work and family myself and I usually prefer to spend time online by myself. Yet, I never seem to have any difficulties with this lifestyle. Though, I also don’t remember the last time I felt something I recognized as loneliness. It may be that I just don’t experience loneliness or don’t experience it very often.

I work in digital industries myself - but you have to keep your feet on the ground, a connection with human reality and nature. It's crucial. — Wayfarer

That seems to be the general consensus. But crucial for what? And what is a connection with human reality if you’re already human?