Scriptures say many things, but there's a lot of debate what the role of scripture is within Christianity. When you go back to the earliest writings and distill from them the teachings of Jesus (Matthew and Luke), what you'll find is essentially Cynic (Hellenistic) philosophy.
This puts not only the New Testament in an entirely new perspective, but also severely puts to the question the position that Christianity came forth from Judaism.
When Christianity is viewed through this new light, it gives room for entirely different interpretations of heaven and hell.

If you're interested in this matter, I can share the sources with you.

This puts not only the New Testament in an entirely new perspective, but also severely puts to the question the position that Christianity came forth from Judaism. — Tzeentch

Sure, ones POV will change when one changes ones view of what god is.

Christianity is Judaism 2.0 and Islam is Judaism 3.0. This is undeniable.

I have not seen any Christian denounce Yahweh as a fraud. Have you?

Regards
DL

You said: "Sure, ones POV will change when one changes ones view of what god is."

So I think you answered your own question. The Christian God did not condemn us, we humans condemned him.

Christianity is Judaism 2.0 — Gnostic Christian Bishop

After having read much material on the subject, I am no longer sure whether this is true.

If you're interested, there are a number of lectures available on the subject on YouTube.

This is one of them;



What the video suggests is, like I have stated earlier, that the teachings of Jesus were Cynic, thus Hellenistic, in essence, and that much of what is practiced by Christians today in based on what has been added at much later dates and has little to do with Jesus's original teachings. Furthermore, it opens up the possibility of the New Testament being of an allegorical nature, rather than a literal one.

The Christian God did not condemn us, we humans condemned him. — 3017amen

I thought the point of acceptance of Jesus as your savior was to avoid eternal condemnation and gain salvation for your sins. It would seem then that you stand condemned but have a path for salvation, such being the whole glory of God giving his son to redeem the sinners.

Of course, being a Christian, you might feel no longer condemned because you've taken the path that you believe leads to all sorts of wonderful outcomes. Me, not as a Christian, and being I suppose condemned to the discomforts of hell, take the view that the Christian god isn't so benevolent.

Yes, I agree to your first point.

The idea of Hell is another Bible translation error. So you're okay!

What the video suggests is, like I have stated earlier, that the teachings of Jesus were Cynic, thus Hellenistic, in essence, and that much of what is practiced by Christians today in based on what has been added at much later dates and has little to do with Jesus's original teachings. Furthermore, it opens up the possibility of the New Testament being of an allegorical nature, rather than a literal one. — Tzeentch

This is an interesting approach that pervades much of Christian thought (and I suspect many other religions). Because the truth of Christianity is based upon past events, any current attempt to alter the way it is practiced must be justified upon a reinterpretation of past events. . You see these restorative attempts with Protestantism moving from Catholicism and, even in dramatic reinterpretations like Mormonism, they again claim themselves restoring the purer faith, not that they've arrived at a new belief system..

These efforts permit an ever changing interpretation and reinterpretation based upon current ethical standards, but ironically justified upon claims of conservation of the prior true practice.

Just an observation.

Of course you mean far-right Fundamentalist's, no? At least that seems to be the target of your interminable axe to grind... .

Free yourself, become a Christian Existentialist like me! (In layman's terms: Spirituality.)

Tzeentch — Tzeentch

The whole of the bible is allegory.

I read it as an esoteric ecumenist and see what happens in the bible as what sages want us to think is supposed to happen in all of our minds.

Have a look at the creation painting in the Vatican and note that god is sitting in a representation of the human right hemisphere of our brains.

That thinking is exemplified with these quotes and the thinking behind them.

Here is the real way to salvation that Jesus taught.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded

This is close to the Gnostic Christian thinking as it shows the savior ascending from within us and not descending form outside of us somewhere.

Regards
DL

Furthermore, it opens up the possibility of the New Testament being of an allegorical nature, rather than a literal one. — Tzeentch

Christianity was taken allegorically by 2nd-4th Century Christians which is its formative stage.

Fundamentalism came later. Strange, but true.

Christianity is still one of the mainstream religions that idol worship a genocidal prick of a god. — Gnostic Christian Bishop

But see:

The whole of the bible is allegory. — Gnostic Christian Bishop

This means that God is not a prick, nor is he genocidal because we can't take the claims of what he did literally. It is the story you must read, at least according to you, without regard to the literal translation. For that reason, if the Bible claims he killed all sorts of people, he literally did not, so you must decipher the meaning of the allegory.

Me, not as a Christian, and being I suppose condemned to the discomforts of hell, take the view that the Christian god isn't so benevolent. — Hanover

You are more gentle with your criticism than I.

I no longer mince words and use more of the language used in this quote.

“The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.”
― Richard Dawkins, The God Delusion

[deleted]

Regards
DL

The idea of Hell is another Bible translation error. So you're okay! — 3017amen

Not to the church's lying preachers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF6I5VSZVqc

Regards
DL

I just call Yahweh a genocidal and infanticidal prick. — Gnostic Christian Bishop

Sure, but that doesn't make your point, which is that the Bible ought be interpreted in an allegorical way, but it instead inflames and derails the conversation, pitting the insulted believers against the smug non-believers. It's just a waste of time when it phrased this way.

Of course you mean far-right Fundamentalist's, no? At least that seems to be the target of your interminable axe to grind... . — 3017amen

Yes. The more to the right you are, the less of a decent human being you will likely be. IMO.

If you do not have the same axe to grind, you are not living by the Golden Rule.

If you think you should live by the Golden Rule, change the labels in this quote to women, minorities, gays or children being brainwashed by religions and it shows what we should be thinking and doing for each other.

"First they came for the Jews, but I did nothing because I'm not a Jew. Then they came for the socialists, but I did nothing because I'm not a socialist. Then they came for the Catholics, but I did nothing because I'm not a Catholic. Finally, they came for me, but by then there was no one left to help me." – Pastor Father Niemoller (1946)”
— 3017amen

Free yourself, become a Christian Existentialist like me! (In layman's terms: Spirituality.) — 3017amen

I have passed that stage thanks to my apotheosis. Spirituality is a two sided sword and mine swings both ways while yours only seems to have on cutting side.

Regards
DL

Dude, with all due respect, get over it man.

I understand the danger's of Fundamentalism/literal interpretations of the Bible and have your ear.
But why not take this same anger-energy and make glass-half-full changes, instead of glass-half-empty?

Are you an activist in your community? Have you ever thought of it? How about starting a Church?

God Bless you man, I'm just trying to help... .

Dude, with all due respect, get over it man. — 3017amen

I will get over it when the mainstream religions are no longer homophobic and misogynous and stop denying half of the worlds population equality.

You go ahead and ignore that much evil if you like. I will not.

[deleted]

Regards
DL

Are you a Christian? LOL

Are you a Christian? LOL — 3017amen

No. Hell no.

Please do not insult me. [deleted]

Regards
DL

This means that God is not a prick, nor is he genocidal because we can't take the claims of what he did literally. It is the story you must read, at least according to you, without regard to the literal translation. For that reason, if the Bible claims he killed all sorts of people, he literally did not, so you must decipher the meaning of the allegory. — Hanover

It is slightly more complicated than "all of the Bible is allegory".

One can observe very striking differences between scripture that is attributed to Saint Paul and those scriptures that have been identified as being older; those of Matthew and Luke. Matthew and Luke, containing the teachings of Jesus, bear far more resemblance to wisdom literature than religious scripture. They contain no miracles, no post-resurrection, etc.

The fact that Paul's writings differ so much from earlier writings means that it needs to be looked at most suspiciously, including all that it influenced. Ironically, most of what modern Christianity teaches is Pauline in nature.

So what this could mean, possibly, is that if one wants to understand the actual teachings of Jesus, most of the New Testament can be tossed in the garbage.

Furthermore, it is no secret that parts of Christianity have sought links with Judaism, especially Rome. This could explain the resemblance of the Christian God to the Judaic God. However, if the above may be true, these links are non-existent, and these resemblances are forgeries, later additions made with a different agenda than staying true to Christian teachings.

While I have read much on the topic, I realize I am no expert on this topic. So if you are interested I can provide some links to persons who do a much better job at explaining all of this.

Oh I think I'm understanding now. Are you an angry Atheist?

Oh I think I'm understanding now. Are you an angry Atheist? — 3017amen

You show a poor understanding.

The Gnostic Christian ideology is superior to atheism, although they are doing better now that they have started opening atheist churches.

It took atheists long enough to start understanding why religions form in the first place and they have finally started thinking of their children above themselves.

Now if we would all do that in terms of the eco system we are passing down to them. All we are doing is insuring that our children will go extinct or face greater challenges than we have.

Regards
DL

You certainly don't come across that way. My understanding of the Gnostics is that they endorsed Love and Spirituality....

You certainly don't come across that way. My understanding of the Gnostics is that they endorsed Love and Spirituality.... — 3017amen

Absolutely.

I try hard to show Christians how to love and express their spirituality by showing them why they should not be homophobic and misogynous not believe that a genocidal god is good.

I hope you have the moral sense to do the same. It is the Christian thing to do even if they have forgotten Jesus' teachings.

Proverbs 3:12 For whom the Lord loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth.

I love a lot and that brings out my hate against the misguided causes of Christian hate.

Regards
DL

I love a lot and that brings out my hate against the misguided causes of Christian hate. — Gnostic Christian Bishop

I don't remember seeing any love in any of your posts, just bitter hatred against not just religion and religious institutions, but religious people. I've tried to make it clear how repellent I think that is.

Scripture is the interpretation of mans interaction with said "GOD" but GOD is neither good nor bad. God is unfathomable. God is All.

Is the Loch Ness Monster really aquatic? Is the monster a scary monster?

Scripture is the interpretation of mans interaction with said "GOD" but GOD is neither good nor bad. God is unfathomable. God is All. — Shelley Robinson

Most religions and lying preachers star from that point, I agree. Unknowable, unfathomable and works in mysterious ways is what I hear.

Then the same lying preachers start rhyming off what they know of the unknowable, fathom of the unfathomable and can somehow take the mystery out of god.

Obviously all the preachers for the supernatural gods are lying preachers.

Right?

Regards
DL

If you think Christianity deserves respect, you are not a moral person nor good. — Gnostic Christian Bishop

You wrote that you "love a lot." I just commented that I have not seen evidence of that in your time here on the forum.

I think that the quoted statement is a sign of hatred and intolerance of a class of people based on your personal prejudice. Most legal and moral classifications of discriminatory behavior include specific reference to discrimination of people on the basis of religion. I think the fact that the forum does not include that in its guidelines is a sign of the prejudice against religion and religious people that many people here feel. I also think it is wrong.