The research showed that 96% of the time, my decisions were awesome.

Therefore it's rational? — Rufoid

96% positive results should put it beyond the region of mere coincidence but something else behaves similarly - bias.

96% positive results should put it beyond the region of mere coincidence but something else behaves similarly - bias. — TheMadFool

If I was unconsciously biased in favor of my method, how does that bear on the rationality of my beliefs?

Is it rational to believe you won't fall into a fiery pit?

[...]

I was trying to evoke a superstitious belief. There is such a thing as using birds as omens. — Rufoid

Yes, and I was trying to make life difficult for you. One tends to attach the labels rational and irrational rather freely, and of course a 'superstitious' belief is by definition...

belief that is not based on human reason or scientific knowledge, but is connected with old ideas about magic, etc.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/superstition
So when you seek to evoke as superstitious belief and then describe it as...

and that I believe this due to my own unpublished scientific research. — Rufoid

... you are creating a contradiction and setting up a fruitless debate about the meanings of words.

I think irrationality is a statement about the coherency of logic but within a context. So it's irrational to bet your life savings on a 1/10000 chance of winning but not if you're going to die tomorrow and you don't have anything better to do with it. It's irrational to use bird omens to make decisions that have nothing to do with birds unless you're doing it for some other reason than trying to make good decisions. It becomes irrational by the standards that have been created through the reason for believing.

Belief in God is slightly more tricky because we're talking about whether or not something exists rather than a choice. Whether belief in God is irrational or not is just one possible framing on that matter. Just as with the bird omen, on the surface, it appears that a belief in God is irrational but we don't know why the belief in God exists. In just one example, one may choose to believe in God because they feel a world without God would lack meaning and that would cause them to be miserable. I would be fine calling that a rational justification for belief in God. It is not sufficient to just know the what, we must know the why.

What's the difference? — Rufoid

As I said, it's more important that you be willing to stand behind the decisions you make than it is how you make up your mind. It's your job to figure out how much justification you need for your decisions. In order to do that, you have to have a good understanding of the potential consequences of your actions.

How many decisions do you make every day where it makes a big difference which way you go?

you are creating a contradiction and setting up a fruitless debate about the meanings of words. — unenlightened

Wouldnt want to get too fruitful. I think it is a question about the meaning of words, though. If you call a behavior irrational, what do you mean?

Is it a fancy way to say, "I dont like that." ?

Belief in God is slightly more tricky because we're talking about whether or not something exists rather than a choice. — Judaka

I think Krause probably asked a philosophical friend for an argument and was told to back down from saying science refutes god and go with "belief in god is irrational." Or maybe not.

just one example, one may choose to believe in God because they feel a world without God would lack meaning and that would cause them to be miserable — Judaka

See, I wouldn't call that rational. That's belief akin to a drowning person's thrashing. There's no choice, that's all brain stem saying "Live!"

It is rational in that it is rational to do what is in your best interests.

"One pro-speaker, Lawrence Krause (sp?) said that belief in god is irrational.

I don't think that ends up being a refutation, but since then, I've been pondering the idea of a proposition that's necessarily held irrationally. Is there such a thing?"

If I may ask, what was the/his description of God, did he say what that was?

There are actually things in life that are seemingly 'irrational' (probably not the best word) or beyond pure logic, but I will wait for your answer before I share those.

In other words, did he refer to the Christian God?

Is this meant for @Rufoid?

Sorry, yes it was.

... it is rational to do what is in your best interests. — Judaka

Is it? Give us the rationale, pray ...

On the surface, it appears as though there is nothing rational about your choice. — Judaka

Most decisions are made by such non-rational, not irrational methods. — T Clark

I make a lot of decisions as part of my work, so I've thought about the decision making process. — T Clark

The choice is immaterial. The OP's question is "can a belief be irrational." Everything else does not matter when we actually read a post and reply to what was asked.

Suppose I believe in making decisions based on which kind of bird I see first thing in the morning, and that I believe this due to my own unpublished scientific research.

Is this an irrational belief?

I don’t think we could know whether it is rational or not without understanding your reasons for doing so. What is the scientific research?

In other words, did he refer to the Christian God? — 3017amen

I don't think he specified. I could probably link to the debate if you want to see it, but that was just what spurred my question about irrational beliefs. It's not what I was asking.

don’t think we could know whether it is rational or not without understanding your reasons for doing so. What is the scientific research? — NOS4A2

It's a hypothetical. If I think I have a good reason for following bird omens, aren't my actions rational?

So, do you think there is a meaning of rationality outside the narrow procedural sense? Or would you use a more general term like "reason"? — Echarmion

Yes, of course, I was only engaging 'rationality' in the stripped-down sense in which @Rufoid seemed to be using the word, as nothing more than rule-following. But rationality, as we usually understand the word, is more than just following some arbitrary rules; the rules have to be the right rules. Colloquially, rationality and reason are more-or-less interchangeable. Both have a normative component, in addition to structure and generality.

If we take the scientific method as an example, would you say the method itself is rational, or merely that we can rationally apply the method? And if the method is not itself "rational", then how do we describe it's justification? — Echarmion

The scientific method is a distillation of our "rational" (in the usual sense) epistemology, so of course, as with our less formal epistemic practices, the scientific method has a normative justification. It cannot be bootstrapped out of nothing.

Okay gotcha. Just a little taste that would help you to understand that essentially since our existence has not been figured out, there exists irrational beliefs. And that they are ok in many walks of life. We, ourselves, by are very nature are irrational.

If someone says that your belief in the Christian God is irrational then the first thing to do is ask them why. If they say it has anything to do with Jesus, then here's one way to handle that:

1. Jesus was known to be half man and half God.
2. Half truths exist in the world as transcending logic.
3. Consciousness transends logic.
4. Jesus was known to have a human conscious.
5. Therefore it is reasonable to infer the Christian God transcends logic and thus is an irrational human belief.

In the interest of time feel free to ask me to define any of those propsitional statements.

I don't use the word "god" to pick out anything in the universe. I agree we don't have the universe figured out.

Sure my point is you can tell him that he himself is an irrational being, and therefore he has no argument for your ( or anyone's ) belief in God.

God's nature is supposed to be beyond pure reason. That's part of the concept of a God....

Sure my point is you can tell him that he himself is an irrational being, and therefore he has no argument for your ( or anyone's ) belief in God. — 3017amen

Science has an irrational foundation. Is that what you mean? We're all irrational at base?

Yes broadly speaking or existentially speaking better said, you would be correct.

A cosmological example I gave earlier suggests something other than pure reason that generates this sense of wonder: all events must have a cause (?).

That's also a Kantian synthetic a priori belief system of sorts. But they ( those similar kinds of statements) are necessary for science to test and carry hypothesis forward...

How then does it make sense to choose one path of belief over another?

Depends on the context and what you're referring to...for example ethics or science or...?

What are you thinking?

Why do you embrace Christianity?

Well first of all thank you for asking me that. I don't think I could answer it in a few paragraphs because it would involve too much philosophy, psychology, phenomenology and existentialism, as it were.

First of all I love a lot of different religious philosophies including Taoism. But the bottom line appealing thing for me is that the Christian God showed himself has a relatable being. And from history, he (the man known as Jesus) overwhelming represented a virtuous concept of Love.

On a pragmatic level, I benefit from revelatory knowledge which helps me in my quality of life.

Partly aesthetic and partly directly personal?

Sure, good intuition there !

Is the wording [irrational - SC] just used to express condemnation? — Rufoid

Yes, but not just any condemnation. One can, for example, condemn a decision on moral grounds without judging it irrational. Rationality is an epistemic standard. It's not easy to define what that standard amounts to, except by the method used by dictionary-makers, i.e. by observing how the word is being used "in the wild" and extracting a general pattern (or several) that fits most such usages.

If I think I have a good reason for following bird omens, aren't my actions rational? — Rufoid

Yes, acting on good reasons is close in meaning to acting rationally, though I think 'reason' is a somewhat broader category than 'rationality.'

If I was unconsciously biased in favor of my method, how does that bear on the rationality of my beliefs? — Rufoid

Rationality is a broad term encompassing a whole range of ideas from the laws of thought themselves to the methodology of science.

The cardinal rule is to check if the evidence is adequate or not. Cognitive biases are like faulty instruments on a plane. Either you'll crash or land at the wrong airport. Therefore, cognitive biases are major impediments to rationality.