The advances we make for space travel are ultimately useful for more practical purposes on Earth.

The challenges of space travel fast-track these developments--it's a very focused problem-solving environment, with financial incentives behind it, and it can sometimes not be immediately obvious what the practical benefits of the technological advances will be, but there has almost always turned out to be practcal benefits to them.

Something we both agree on haha

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I agree with @Terrapin Station.

I also think the investments we currently put into space travel are but a drop in the bucket compared to the obscene resources spent on one of the worst contributors to climate change: the military industrial complex.

Agreed. Exploration is a valid driver of culture.

but a drop in the bucket compared to the obscene resources spent on one of the worst contributors to climate change: the military industrial complex.

Couldn’t agree with this more! Almost makes you wonder, if the past decades military budgets for even just the USA let alone the Global military budget had been going towards climate science would we even have a problem right now or would it be anywhere near as threatening as it is? Or even 25% of it?

https://time.com/5709100/halt-climate-change-300-billion/

Y’all should read this. To quote a wizard: Hope is kindled!

Thank you for that hope spot.

As to the OP, I agree completely that it's more useful for basically all space technologies besides the rockets to get things there to be applied here on Earth. Surviving the worst possible conditions on Earth is way easier than surviving on any other planet, so before we will be able to survive on other planets, we will have to develop the technology to survive basically anything that could befall Earth, which then largely undermines the point of traveling to other planets.

I've been thinking for a while that it could be a good idea to build prototype Mars habitats on Earth (or rather, build robots that will build such habitats from found materials, as they'll need to do on Mars) as self-contained self-sustaining cities in the desert, and let people live there for free (supported by the robots doing the hydroponic farming etc). Welcome any homeless, starving people, refugees, etc... give us your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to eat free from the robot-tended hydroponic farms. Proof-of-concept for a Mars habitat and immediate humanitarian support on Earth too.

On a longer timescale, the technology needed for us to terraform another planet would also enable us to completely control the climate of our own planet, thus mitigating most disasters that would make those kind of biodomes necessary.

And, yeah, if selling that projects as "woohoo Mars" gets people to actually fund it, good on ya.

@Isaac You may want to weigh in here also, in regards to potential solutions we never thought possible.

I’ll start answering your other questions in relation to the links now in the Optimism Pessimism discussion now that I’ve incubated on them a little.

You may want to weigh in here also, in regards to potential solutions we never thought possible. — Mark Dennis

The trouble is, there's potential solutions and there's actual solutions. The problem of climate change has been caused almost in its entirety by what were called 'solutions' to other problems - how to feed the ever growing population, how to provide white goods to poorer people, how to make whatever bigger, faster, cheaper... These were all 'problems' at the time and the 'solutions' we came up with are the very things which caused the next problem. As a thought experiment (you'll need a bit of anthropology to do this right) try to make a list of technological advances which are not aimed at solving a problem brought about by previous technological advances. The list is quite thin.

Solar cells have their indium problem at the moment, when that's solved (probably with graphene), they'll be a graphene problem that we hadn't thought of. Wind power has it's limits too (what some people don't seem to realise is that the wind is actually doing something, it's not just wasted energy, it's driving the weather)... So it's not a matter of solving any problems, it's a question of rates. Can we solve one problem quicker than the inevitable next problem (caused by our previous solution) arises. I think what we're experiencing now with climate change, mass extinction, pollution buffers filling up etc is not just another problem to solve like we did with the others, its a symptom of our solution-induced problems catching up with us, our rate of finding new solutions is not keeping up with the rate at which problems are caused by them.

The trouble is, there's potential solutions and there's actual solutions. The problem of climate change has been caused almost in its entirety by what were called 'solutions' to other problems - how to feed the ever growing population, how to provide white goods to poorer people, how to make whatever bigger, faster, cheaper... These were all 'problems' at the time and the 'solutions' we came up with are the very things which caused the next problem. As a thought experiment (you'll need a bit of anthropology to do this right) try to make a list of technological advances which are not aimed at solving a problem brought about by previous technological advances. The list is quite thin.

Solar cells have their indium problem at the moment, when that's solved (probably with graphene), they'll be a graphene problem that we hadn't thought of. Wind power has it's limits too (what some people don't seem to realise is that the wind is actually doing something, it's not just wasted energy, it's driving the weather)... So it's not a matter of solving any problems, it's a question of rates. Can we solve one problem quicker than the inevitable next problem (caused by our previous solution) arises. I think what we're experiencing now with climate change, mass extinction, pollution buffers filling up etc is not just another problem to solve like we did with the others, its a symptom of our solution-induced problems catching up with us, our rate of finding new solutions is not keeping up with the rate at which problems are caused by them.

@Isaac (Sorry I wrote this awhile ago but forgot to tag)

So we know that life is always on a slippery slope? That argument could have really been made at any point in both recorded and unrecorded history. It’s never been reason enough not to act though. What you’re really describing is the nature of evolution. Which is random; problem, adapt, fail, adapt, succeed, Problem, adapt. But those failed adaptations are piled up between successes all through the genetic code of all life. The real question is; when does the slippery slope end? Can we see it’s end? When will the house of cards fall? Do any of us know exactly? Could be an asteroid impact within five minutes of me writing this.

Problems and solutions come hand in hand but when has that ever really been a good enough reason to sit around bored waiting for death in rigid states of anxiety? It does you no good, just means you’ll die faster. I know what anxiety is I’ve had it all my life. Anxiety is useful, it’s part of our many defence and survival mechanisms and it motivates us to make the changes we need to be Justifiably comfortable.

I agree with one of the implications in your argument however; that seeking ridiculous amounts of comfort, ease and meaningless entertainment are extremely near impossible to kill problems. They always seem to crop back up.

Imagine this scenario; you are chained to a wall by your ankles and are in a prison cell with an open door. To your right you see a sword and a note.

The note reads;

Over 365 days you will be brought food, water and will be washed. On the first day of next year all these things will cease and you will be left to die. Also, every night a tiger will come into your cell and attempt to eat you. Use the sword to fight it off each night, he’s scared of the sight of his own blood but is immortal and will follow you even after you escape so take the sword with you. The pommel of the sword can be used to wear away the mortar the chain that binds you is imbedded in, within 365 days. If you free yourself before the tiger kills you, no one will stop you leaving.”

What do you do?

Besides, every now and then evolution throws out a thumb.

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