They are both racist because they both subscribe to the racist worldview. My contention is one cannot hate Asians unless he believes such a distinct group exists. — NOS4A2
I've already pointed to the disparity between people that are raised in a two parent home with a more cohesive family and those that aren't. Are you so unwilling to accept that there might be other causes to the problems you are pointing out. Is every problem the result of racism?Even if you grant that everything's been colourblind since then, it isn't doing a damn thing to address poverty rates. Which is strange; why are there persistent racial disparities in poverty in the US if colourblindness assures equality of opportunity? This is granting the polices are colourblind, of course (in this world of Harry's where there's no extant politics of prejudice). — fdrake
Yes, but I already moved past your point and I am now asking what we do about it that doesn't entail doing what created this problem in the first place. Are there no other options to consider, or is the only option to be a hypocrite?The point I was making is that, even if we became color blind over night racial segregation would continue. — Bitter Crank
You also have to think about what this implies and whether what it implies is reasonable. This implies that all police, prosecuting and defending attorneys, judges, and witnesses are racist. I think that is a very weak limb to stand on.Let’s take the claim we focused on above:
Systemic racism still exists in the United States.
The reason given (and we’ll stick to one for simplicities sake) was:
Racial minority groups in the US, such as Blacks and Hispanics, are imprisoned at higher rates than Whites.
The evidence provided showing that the above is true was taken from here:
https://www.issuelab.org/resources/695/695.pdf
That’s all fine; however, the link between the reason and the claim may be questioned. It may be accepted that there is irrefutable evidence that Blacks and Hispanics are imprisoned at higher rates than Whites, but consistently denied that this represents systemic racism.
A warrant can provide the link needed to overcome this objection (and show that the reason is warranted ).
For example:
When it comes to sentencing, Black and Hispanic convicts are treated more harshly for similar crimes than their White counterparts.
If this general principle can be established then the higher rates of imprisonment are contextualized as an instance of the racially discriminatory practice outlined. — Baden
If using race as the reason to provide government benefits is what got us here, then why is the solution that they are suggesting that we keep doing it, but in reverse? — Harry Hindu
I don’t really know what those sentences mean if I’m being completely honest. If you could rephrase (possibly add more detail) from “If ...” onward I may be able to respond better. — I like sushi
Don't think that racism / ethnicity have any true logic to themselves. It's all horse manure that in the end simply justifies xenophobia and is fitted to the present situation whatever it is.That’s right “latino” is not considered a race. It’s an ethnicity, meaning It applies to anyone of any race so long as he is Latino — NOS4A2
Don't think that racism / ethnicity have any true logic to themselves. It's all horse manure that in the end simply justifies xenophobia and is fitted to the present situation whatever it is.
Stop looking just at the racism in the US. The history of European racism and the true race ideology divided the "white" people as happily and eagerly as Americans are dividing their own citizens into races. Serbs, Poles, Russians, Belarusians, Czechs, Slovaks, and Ukrainians, all were there with the Jews subhumans. And Americans would now refer to these people being "white". It doesn't make any sense.
I've already pointed to the disparity between people that are raised in a two parent home with a more cohesive family and those that aren't. Are you so unwilling to accept that there might be other causes to the problems you are pointing out. Is every problem the result of racism? — Harry Hindu
Racism that is accompanied by hatred is often disappointment and frustration that finds racism as an outlet because it's convenient.
Racism without hatred is a genuine belief that it's correct to categorize and heirarchialize by race. — frank
It's not the same. (1) is about people in general regardless of race, while (2) is implying that only blacks do worse in their later lives when not raised in a stable family environment. (2) would be racist and ignore all the non-blacks who do worse as well.(1) "People without a stable family environment in their childhood generally do worse in their later lives (as measured in income)" is exactly the same kind of statement as: (2) "People with black skin from poor neighbourhoods generally do worse in their later lives (as measured in income)" — fdrake
Exactly. Isn't that what I've been saying? So now isn't incumbent upon you to show how certain aspects of our society or system are racist today as opposed to just being the effects of racism in the past that are now present today. Does the effects today that are the result of racism in the past still qualify as racism today? If so, then what do we do about it that doesn't make us go back to doing the same thing that we are saying is wrong? Why is it soooo difficult to answer this question? It needs to be answered, or else all you're doing is complaining without providing any solutions to what you're complaining about - which makes me think that there really isn't a problem, or that you're fine with problem existing.You can be white and come from a shitty family environment. Not everything is racism. I would never argue that all disparities come from racism, that would be silly. — fdrake
So it seems to me that racism is a type of hatred, — Harry Hindu
Sure it is. How is "fondness" a type of harm, or unjust action based on some preconceived notion that isn't based on reason?That's a misconception. Racist people may have fondness for an oppressed group which they see as child-like.
That is not inconsistent with the definitions you provided. — frank
Sure it is. How is "fondness" a type of harm, or unjust action based on some preconceived notion that isn't based on reason — Harry Hindu
What types of cultural/ethnic differences?I went into this kind of topic more vigorously on a predominately ‘scientific’ based forum and nearly every one of them attacked me and claimed there were no ‘races’. Scientifically of course there aren’t. The issue was that in sociology, and the humanities in general, ‘race’ is used quite openly to refer to cultural/ethnic differences (it’s even on most surveys). — I like sushi
Ask the grown Indian man. How would you feel if I referred to you as something that you aren't? How would you feel if I called you a child?If the British treat grown Indian men like children that causes harm. — frank
You know you've adopted your political ideology as a religion when you get to the point where you don't question it and everyone who does is a hater. — Harry Hindu
"The way things are going... they're going to crucify me."
-Poor little Harry — frank
So, you're not going to answer the question? — Harry Hindu
You're making it more complicated than it needs to be. All you need to do is explain how you are using the word, "fondness".If you want someone's perspective, say something like: "Frank, what do you mean that a racist person can be fond of the oppressed and exploited? How can that be?"
Then you'll encourage a response. Don't assume anyone gives a shit about persuading you of anything. — frank
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