What I've noticed (I have no stats or proof for this it's just anecdotal) is that transgender people have these highly rigid notions of gender. — dukkha
I agree with this.No one with a mental condition should be pitied and helped unless either (a) they want help because they don't like the way they are, or (b) they're unable to function/take care of themselves re simple daily tasks--maintaining shelter, acquiring and ingesting food, etc. — Terrapin Station
I disagree with this. If they don't want to eat, etc. then they are suffering psychologically, and require help until they get into more stable waters where they can manage for themselves. We're not going to let people die in the street because they are depressed and no one cares for them. Nobody will be dying in the streets. We will take care of them.AND they (at least seem to) want to be able to achieve those daily tasks. — Terrapin Station
Nobody will be dying in the streets. We will take care of them. — Agustino
Yeah, if these faggots were so good at treating patients, we'd have less mentally ill folk than we do today. As far as I'm concerned, these experts are part of the problem, not the solution. It's in their interest that people are sick and continue to suffer so that they keep coming for their expensive services, and pay them more and more dough.We will take care of the mentally ill, by distrusting psychologists and psychiatrists, therapists and doctors - makes perfect sense to me! Weeee! — Heister Eggcart
Yes that unfortunately is true, even in the civilised world, and it's a big shame, that people are left to die in the streets.Would that we were so kind. We have come close to letting people die in the streets--literally, not figuratively. There are mentally ill homeless people who are (slowly, granted) dying in the streets. It took a long time for the northern city I live in (Minneapolis) to recognize that "public inebriates" need caring alochol-tolerant shelter, especially in the winter. (Most shelters here are rigidly alcohol-intolerant.) We finally have it, and it is a good thing.
In San Francisco there are thousands of homeless living on the streets. I've seen them there years past. They won't freeze, they're mostly not insane (crazy maybe, but that's a different story). They aren't cared for. — Bitter Crank
Forgive me for asking for a little grace Agustino but your vocabulary is greater then to resort to using insulting words.Yeah, if these faggots were so good at treating patients, we'd have less mentally ill folk than we do today. — Agustino
Clearly not. GID/gender dysphoria is a terrible disorder to have, with an awful prognosis. Apparently 41 percent attempt suicide at some point. Being transgender is just the medical treatment for the disease (gender dyshporia, or Gender Identity Disorder). It's a shame this medical illness has been tacked onto LGB issues and causes/politicized. — dukkha
It's in their interest that people are sick and continue to suffer so that they keep coming for their expensive services, and pay them more and more dough. — Agustino
That is quite possibly true, however -We have a saying in the Netherlands: "As the innkeeper is, does he trust his guests". Meaning people who expect the worst from others usually aren't very nice themselves. — Benkei
My beef with them is that they accept to work as psychiatrists in these circumstances - that knowing that they can't do much for their patients, they accept to go to their jobs and do a half-hearted job. — Agustino
You can question the efficacy of the profession but questioning their moral character says more about you than anything else. — Benkei
Over four months, our research team fielded its 70 question survey through direct contacts with more than 800 transgender-led or transgender-serving community-based organizations throughout the United States. We also contacted possible participants through 150 active online community listservs. The vast majority of respondents took the survey on-line, through a URL established at Pennsylvania State University.
Additionally, we distributed 2,000 paper surveys to organizations serving hard-to-reach populations – including rural, homeless, and low-income transgender and gender non-conforming people conducting phone follow-ups over three months. With only $3,000 in dedicated funding for outreach, we paid stipends to workers in homeless shelters, legal aid clinics, mobile health clinics, and other service settings to host “survey parties” to encourage respondents whose economic vulnerability, housing insecurity, or literacy level might pose particular barriers to participation. This effort resulted in the inclusion of 500 paper surveys in the final sample.
While over 7,000 people completed online and paper surveys, the final study sample includes 6,450 valid respondents from all 50 states, the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, Guam, and the U.S. Virgin Islands. Our geographic distribution mirrors that of the general U.S. population.
Perhaps. But there are many cases in medicine for example, when there's not much that a doctor can do. In that case their knowledge and expertise is limited and that's that. They're not really at fault for that. But I actually think that a large majority of mental illness sufferers could be helped and even cured, and they are not. And that is the fault of the therapists - it doesn't help that they have no skin in the game either.But isn't this true of many areas of professional work -- including several areas of medicine? — Bitter Crank
Yes but they wouldn't have to. It's sufficient for them to prepare a diet for their patient, discuss whether the patient has any particular objections/desires, and then ask them to keep to it, maybe get them to keep a journal and see how it goes. It's the patient's responsibility to follow the advice in that case. But the same cannot be said about mental illness - the thing with mental illness is precisely that the patient struggles to follow the advice or to apply it to particular situations. I don't know if you've ever gone through something similar yourself, but for example, hypochondria of which I suffered, the thought you're ill or will become ill and die can manifest in hundreds and millions of ways. Literarily every kind of symptom I can make myself actually feel. And the question always is how do you distinguish? Say I get a strong chest pain... Is that a heart attack? If you ask a doctor they tell you "if you have persistent chest pains, with other symptoms like shortness of breath, etc. you have to go to the hospital IMMEDIATELY" If you tell the psychiatrist you get chest pains, etc. they'll be like "ahh that's just your anxiety, you have to do something different, it's not real" but the whole question is how do you distinguish real from unreal, not in theory, but in practice?After all, physicians treating problems related to obesity can't follow their patients around and intervene in their dietary choices (they might, but then they could treat only 1 patient at a time) — Bitter Crank
Really if you ask me, the priest is actually better than the psychiatrist for mental illness. So are great philosophers. — Agustino
what should we do to help them? — VagabondSpectre
Transsexuals can in fact successfully transition, with or without an actual operation, and so I remain thoroughly convinced that your suggestion that their dangerous ailment should never be indulged is not at all universally sound medical advice. — VagabondSpectre
By not indulging in their disorder. Like anorexic -- which someone else exampled here -- do not indulge them by telling them: "you are right, you are fat, stop eating". No, she is starving and needs to eat healthily. The dangers of her conditions should be clear, she in danger of dying. — Emptyheady
Strawman. Nice of you to squeeze the words "all universally sound medical advice," which I never claimed. Given that we are dealing with someone who is obviously suffering from some kind of mental disorder, we can't indulge that person. For the same reason you do not indulge a suicidal person. But instead save them. The person in the video says: "I just want to die." According to you, you should indulge him. — Emptyheady
How your Leftists mind can twist this is impressive. I will leave that to Haidt to explain. It may be just the tendencies of the Left to virtue signalling. — Emptyheady
And I am not making things up, it is officially recognised as a mental disorder:
"The terms transsexualism, dual-role transvestism, gender identity disorder in adolescents or adults and gender identity disorder not otherwise specified are listed as such in the International Statistical Classification of Diseases (ICD) or the American Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) under codes F64.0, F64.1, 302.85 and 302.6 respectively." — Emptyheady
Heister Feister perhaps you ought to actually contribute something to the discussion apart from actual insults. You like to sit on the side and throw snarky remarks at those who fight the good fight. With an attitude like yours I don't know what you'd do at a monastery - perhaps just eat the bread and consume the resources of the monks.Y'know, Agustino, you are the precise sort of person that keeps me from throwing my computer out the window and going to a monastery, because I fear if I meet someone like you outside my cell, and had the displeasure of having a conversation, I'd as quickly throw myself out the window in a final retreat. — Heister Eggcart
Anything that involves hallucinations is something that these doctors, or pretty much anyone else, can do little about. I'm not talking about those conditions, many of which are biological (OR THE RESULT OF THERAPY ITSELF). OCD though isn't among them. I was at one time officially diagnosed with OCD. By the big brain of these psychiatrists I should still have it today. I have absolutely zero symptoms of it today. I was given antipsychotics (those that are for things like schizophrenia), antidepressants, and benzodiazepines. It wasn't until I got off them - BY MYSELF (please note that, because if it was after the big brain of psychiatrists I wouldn't have gotten off the pills) - that my symptoms started to disappear.Some psychiatric practices deal with major mental illness involving psychoses, schizophrenia, bi-polar disease, OCD, criminal sexual behavior, and the like. I have quite a bit of respect for these doctors. — Bitter Crank
It's not just my experience. It's a fact. It's only the lying books which say otherwise. They don't want you to know the truth. Experience speaks clearly for all those who have it. One of my friends was destroyed by psychiatry - they have actually made him sick. These folks are corrupt to the bone, and they will stop at nothing to destroy all signs of greatness and superiority. Their normal person is mediocrity personified. Bowing the head everywhere. That's "normal" for them. That's the "goal". Can you imagine... Alexander the Great going to a psychiatrist... "My goal in life is to conquer Persia and be the greatest conqueror that history will ever know!" My days, the psychiatrist would likely not even allow him to leave - straight to the special ward with him! How dare he have such a goal?? How dare he think of himself as GREAT and superior to others?? A person should have goals like - get a job as an accountant, have lots of sex, etc. Anything else is not permitted, and is a sign of disease. The psychiatrists are just as Nietzsche predicted, the weak, who because they are good for nothing and cannot do anything themselves, want to stop everyone else from doing. They want everyone else to be mediocre and sit down - not dance - because they themselves cannot dance.Perhaps your experience with psychiatrists has been unusually bad. — Bitter Crank
Yes if you don't do social things, you're sick, you're deformed, there's something wrong with you, according to these bastards. Psychotherapy is a lie.I lacked self-esteem, and needed to do more social things. — Wosret
No. It's morality inverted. Morality has some sense for greatness. Psychiatry has none.Even that aside psychology is like an attempted formalization of morality, or religion. — Wosret
Yes - the mechanism to keep man in check.It's how we continue to see demons, and never stopped. — Wosret
You're comparing death by starvation to "behaving as the opposite gender". Obviously nutritional health is more cut and dried than psychological health; your comparison is poor. — VagabondSpectre
Who are we dealing with? — VagabondSpectre
We should never indulge anyone with a mental disorder, and transgenderism is a disorder, therefore never indulge any transgender people? — VagabondSpectre
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