OK, so the first thing you'd need is some evidence of this. — Isaac
So what exactly are you wanting to discuss here? Are you just going to repeat your theory until someone says "yes, you're right". If you're just going to dismiss any contrary theory on the grounds that you don't 'reckon' it's right then what's the point in writing what you think on a public forum? — Isaac
Where exactly is modern society's morality documented? — alcontali
One reason why such society does not want to document it, is because they want to keep changing it as it suits them. The lack of of documentation points to its fundamentally deceptive and manipulative nature. — alcontali
If you’re happy with the state of politics, the quality of life for people, then of course you won’t accept any of my evidence to the contrary. — Brett
Power is the subject. You were the one that focused on consensus because you disagreed with me. — Brett
I was asking for evidence that watered-down policies make no 'progress'. If what you actually mean is that watered-down policies are one which you don't like, then just say so. What you're trying to argue is that watered down policies are actually stalling 'progress'. that's a different claim to them just not being your preferred policy. — Isaac
You can’t handle exploration of uncomfortable ideas. — Brett
If you’re really open minded you might consider the idea that though traditional tribal societies were collectives and socialist they still had a chief who called the shots. Try and balance that in your over heated mind. — Brett
Hopefully I’ll never see any grumbling or dissatisfaction from you about the state of things in the world because you’re happy with the results and decisions made by governments, the progress. — Brett
Just out of interest, where does Fidel Castro fit into your position? — Brett
How do you expect it to be documented? What form would you imagine it taking? Why would it be documented? — Brett
Principles of Islamic jurisprudence, also known as uṣūl al-fiqh (Arabic: أصول الفقه, lit. roots of fiqh), are traditional methodological principles used in Islamic jurisprudence (fiqh) for deriving the rulings of Islamic law (sharia). — The epistemology of Islamic jurisprudence
What evidence do you have to support that conclusion? Could you cite some enthongraphies which detail the extent to which chiefs in nomadic hunter-gatherer communities ignored consensus to dictate what would happen. Or is 'evidence' just another one of those things which gets in the way of 'progress'? — Isaac
Is power a thing based on what is right or wrong?Do those who take power have the right to take it and wield it? — Brett
another boring right-wing moan. You guys are always trying to dress up your basic unexamined conservatism in some higher sounding philosophical rhetoric - — Isaac
This is not about Trump but about power and whether we should look at how it works more closely and overcome our fear of it, about whether power can be wielded morally or whether there are benefits in the idea of power.
Where exactly is modern society's morality documented?
— alcontali
Why would it be documented?
One reason why such society does not want to document it, is because they want to keep changing it as it suits them. The lack of of documentation points to its fundamentally deceptive and manipulative nature.
— alcontali — Brett
What’s the point of the strength and autonomy of the individual if power isn’t going to be part of it. If individuals can’t rise up through the masses, to aspire to all sorts of unknown potential, then what’s the point of believing in the individual.
But there is always an enormous risk inherent in that. What happens after the threat is gone? — BitconnectCarlos
A very clear example of this would be when Hitler declared a state of emergency upon being elected and suspended the Constitution because there was some supposed existential threat facing the state — BitconnectCarlos
However if they reject the system of government, in this case representative democracy, then you could regard them as dissidents. In that case they would be hoping for another form of government. However, the government is still imposing itself on the dissidents on behalf of the people that elected them. So the imposing is still legitimate. — Brett
What else could it be, unless you reject representative democracy, and then you’re imposing your view on others. And I assume you’d feel justified. — Brett
Imposing one's will upon another is, in my opinion, illegitimate, whether one does it on behalf of other people or not.
My point is that governments have no right to rule over people who do not want to be ruled by it. — Tzeentch
What else could it be, unless you reject representative democracy, and then you’re imposing your view on others. And I assume you’d feel justified.
— Brett
Rejecting something does not equal imposing it on others. — Tzeentch
“If you’re really open minded you might consider the idea that though traditional tribal societies were collectives and socialist they still had a chief who called the shots. Try and balance that in your over heated mind”. — Brett
So what form of government would you prefer instead? — Brett
If you reject one form of government than you must presumably have another preference in mind. You can’t just rid yourself of a government you don’t like and exist in a vacuum. — Brett
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