"There was a flood
A world of water
The mason’s wife
Swam for her daughter.

One thousand people
Did what they could.
They found the steeple
And tore out the wood.

Five hundred pieces
Means five hundred float.
One thousand people means
Five hundred don’t."

Wow, Nos is really totally insane. Conspiracy theory nonsense, none of those links suggest anything like he thinks they do.

Anyone can read them and see otherwise. What is weird is why anyone would refrain criticizing the WHO, and worse, obfuscating any criticism of them. That’s strange.

For milder cases they'll set up in whatever vacant buildings they can find. There's also going to be a ventilator shortage, though. During the peak they'll have to choose the people most likely to survive to take up vents (we call them "vents').

Yep, crazy times.

Anyone who has to do triage during the peak should get a full paid year off after this, at the very least. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

Yep. It will be doctors. Probably mostly pulmonologists. Or emergency medicine doctors.

The right-wing media will blame the CDC and FDA, treating them as individual institutions uncoupled from the Trump administration. — Echarmion

You were almost right. Our resident shit-for-brains has been sicced onto the WHO instead. We should take bets next time.

You were almost right. Our resident shit-for-brains has been sicced onto the WHO instead. We should take bets next time.

You guys have lost it. While you stretch your imagination to blame “capitalism”, there are verifiable links between the spread of this virus and the Chinese Communist Party’s coverup. Fucking hilarious.

I think the WHO are global patriots who just wanted to save the global economy by knowingly taking measures that spread the virus too much. :roll:

Uh-oh the troll is getting indignant keep it up everyone.

Chinese Communist Party — NOS4A2

The Chinese Communist Party is so perfectly aligned with Marx's vision it's uncanny.

I think he's trying to foment anti-Asian sentiment. There probably will be some of that along with preachers claiming that God has abandoned us.

We'll just have to stand against scapegoating.

One of my favorite albums. Are you familiar with Spencer Krug's work in Frog Eyes?

Yeah not like it's state capitalism or anything lol.

"All fires have to burn alive to live."

Yeah not like it's state capitalism or anything lol. — StreetlightX

There's no such thing. Lol

You guys are really going to let the CCP and WHO slide on this, aren’t you? On January 15th the WHO said there was no evidence of human-to-human infection. Months later you’re huddled in your house avoiding your community. The pangs of dissonance must be extraordinary.

It wasn't human-to-human at first. A mutation appeared that is human-to-human. The mutated form also evades containment measures by means we dont yet understand.

It isn't anybody's fault.

There's no such thing. Lol — ZzzoneiroCosm

The currently existing state of China begs to differ.

That said, technically all capitalism is state capitalism, as Polyani pointed out long ago.

One of my favorite albums. Are you familiar with Spencer Krug's work in Frog Eyes? — ZzzoneiroCosm

I am! Tears of the Valedictorian. One of my big high school albums. Frog Eyes is by far the grimiest (in a good way) of all his projects, though, to be fair, that album's largely Carey Mercer. I saw Krug live, with/as Sunset Rubdown, a few times at the Middle East in Cambridge. i was 18 and 19 and those shows still mean a lot to me. Of all of his stuff, Dragonslayer is still my favorite album, but it goes too close to the nerve if I try to listen now. Too many hard memories bound up with it.

You guys are really going to let the CCP and WHO slide on this, aren’t you? On January 15th the WHO said there was no evidence of human-to-human infection. Months later you’re huddled in your house avoiding your community. The pangs of dissonance must be extraordinary. — NOS4A2

@frank @StreetlightX

I must agree here. Although China finally did what they needed by isolation measures (new cases are being contained it seems), the officials at the local level were the ones suppressing the information and/or only selecting partial information (only those who had direct contact with the animal market were to be considered counted). They also did not want to tell Beijing what was going on at first, often blocking doctors at hospitals from proclaiming an possible emergency (i.e. the information had to be leaked to get to the wider public). Based on an article I have linked below, this could be cultural, as it seems the bearer of bad news is often shunned for giving the bad news I guess. Also, it is function of totalitarian bureaucratic systems to suppress bad news from the public. Chernobyl comes to mind in this regard. It took so long, and so much information for the government to finally do something about it. Now, this doesn't discount the fact that OTHER countries that are non-communist may also deceive and suppress data about catastrophes and war causalities and the like, it is just pointing out this does have a precedent in communist/totalitarian ones.

Two major downfalls that enabled this in Chinese government were 1) the inability to follow their own infectious disease emergency measures (that were supposed to have been put in place and constantly reiterated since in the Sars epidemic), and 2) shutting down all exotic trade market places. No wild bats, exotic animals, or otherwise caught from the wild, put in cages on top of each other, cooked on the spot, etc. It just has to go.

Here are two good articles on it if anyone gives a shit:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/20/opinion/sunday/coronavirus-china-cause.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/29/world/asia/coronavirus-china.html

That said, China has been the most dogged after their initial bungling to contain it within their own country, so other countries should look at what they are doing and have done. Unrelated, but we should also look at what Korea did.

That said, technically all capitalism is state capitalism, as Polyani pointed out long ago. — StreetlightX

Polyani rules, but this sounds like a blurb of a blurb. Polyani was cool, he was in it, he wrote what he experienced. If you've read The Great Transformation and are drawing from that, I apologize. The quote just feels like a skipped rock.

The currently existing state of China begs to differ. — StreetlightX

Yeah I was kidding when I said there's no such thing...

In most minds there's no such thing.

that album's largely Carey Mercer. — csalisbury

Whoops, that's who I meant: Carey Mercer. Insane and a shame the youtube video of Tears of the Valedictorian (full album) has less than 8,000 views. I guess it's because it's so strange.

I have to ask, does this whole thing make you wish you'd never been born? Or does it bring into focus how amazing life is, since you might soon be gone

What does this have to do with the topic at hand? I was trying to engage with you about the topic you were discussing on this thread.

I'm random as hell. I understand if you dont want to answer.

One thing that always stuck with me: I remember my friend telling me about an interview with Mercer he read where Mercer talked about how whenever he hung out with his musician friends, he always had to 'be on' and be funny (iirc, he was talking specifically about camping trips ) because he was poor. They could relax, but he always had to be entertaining to prove his worth. I feel like you can feel that desperation for expression in his music. It's beautiful, but also sad.

I get a sense that he was determined to do exactly what he wanted to do in Frog Eyes, come hell or high water. He's does some seriously crazy shit with his voice: just close enough to ridiculous to be jawdropping-amazing.

Anyway, I'm a huge fan of Frog Eyes.

Mercer made a living as a teacher, if I remember right.

hell yeah. I haven't talked frog eyes in a decade, cheers

Yeah, the CCP obviously fucked its initial response too, to the extent that it was one of the few issues that had - for a time - people seriously upset with the government even though all the filtering, especially after the death of Li Wenliang, the 'whistleblower' doctor. It's hard to imagine why anyone would think China has been 'let off the hook' by anyone. All through February, China was a punching bag for everyone for whom this virus was the lot of exotic foreigners with their bizarre cultural practices. In many cases Chinese people - people I know - where verbally abused on the street, and in some cases physically assaulted.

It was absolutely a skipped rock. Current apocalypse listening: