To summarise, when you present a claim as credible based on an authority, you implicitly make the claim that the authority is credible. — Baden
for medical claims, scientific evidence, should be required, such as the studies or supported statements of reputable scientists or medical professionals. Needless to say, scientists or medical professionals who are known to make pseudoscientific claims cannot be considered to be reputable and it is legitimate to dismiss their claims on this basis. — Baden
Trusting authority is a huge part of research. — Outlander
So on the basis of a long long history of officially sanctioned invented mental illnesses, (hysteria, Drapetomania, homosexuality, etc etc, along with a whole range of frankly sadistic and obviously highly damaging "treatments", no medical professionals can be regarded as deriving any authority at all from their professional qualifications. Do I have that about right? — unenlightened
no medical professionals can be regarded as deriving any authority at all from their professional qualifications. — unenlightened
I've asked my doctor — Baden
So on the basis of a long long history of officially sanctioned invented mental illnesses, (hysteria, Drapetomania, homosexuality, etc etc, along with a whole range of frankly sadistic and obviously highly damaging "treatments", no medical professionals can be regarded as deriving any authority at all from their professional qualifications. Do I have that about right? — unenlightened
Have I missed anything here? — Baden
Someone's authority is contextual/domain specific. — fdrake
If a group of doctors who think HIV doesn't cause AIDS say we should end the shutdown, I say that's an excellent reason to keep it going. — Baden
A bad call on one illness undermined other advice on another illness. — unenlightened
I'm not calling out the hyperbole here, but making a serious point. The state of society is parlous because trust has been too often betrayed. Authority is institutional, and if the institutions are not trustworthy, there is no context in which they become trustworthy.
If a group of doctors who think homosexuality is an illness say chips make you fat, I say that's an excellent reason to eat more chips. Yes, no, maybe? — unenlightened
It didn't work that way with the original example. A bad call on one illness undermined other advice on another illness. — unenlightened
e.g. suppose I claim carbon dating is completely unreliable, and support this claim by linking to articles on the website of the Institute for Creation Research). But suspicion alone is not enough - you would need to dig into the basis for the claims. — Relativist
Yes, I think you missed something.
It is generally appropriate to appeal to authority to support one's position - it's a reasonable starting point. — Relativist
I think "direct methods" are the only hope of settling a disagreement - which means examining the basis of the expert opinion.I think I've more or less dealt with this, justified suspicion is not enough to refute the claim, but it is enough to dismiss the appeal to authority and if that is all the claim is based on, the claim itself as anything other than bare assertion. In other words, you're back to square one, how do we settle the claim? In the absence of direct methods to do this (in the case of scientific claims), more reliable authorities will need to be sought — Baden
We'll cross that bridge if we ever come to it.If a philosophy is "proven" does it not graduate into the field of science? — Outlander
It wouldn't. Dueling authorities results in no one's mind being changed. Not that minds get changed very often.If apealing to authority to support a position (presumably referencing a fact or at least a hypothesis vs. a random opinion) is not rubbish as in is "true", how exactly would doing the same thing to refute or throw into question an opposing idea be "false"?
scientists or medical professionals who are known to make pseudoscientific claims cannot be considered to be reputable and it is legitimate to dismiss their claims on this basis. — Baden
Trusting authority is a huge part of research.
— Outlander
It is the only currency of culture. Trust, or start civilisation again from scratch and alone. — unenlightened
I love these assertions without any kind of examples to back them up.Sometimes attacking the source is warranted.
Sometimes appealing to authority is appropriate. — frank
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