The Human Condition

Lif3r

People singing about liberation and bringing peace to the people but then they just do the most heinous shit. Wtf is wrong with these humans. I'm trying so hard to figure it out that it literally drives me mad. Why is everything so fucked up? Why are we so damn stupid? How do we fix this?

110 billion humans and no one has figured out how to convince people to get along? How to not be a fucking douchebag? I mean that's fucking incredible.

It's a huge clusterfuck extravaganza. These people hate those people for this reason, cause a ruckus, retaliation over and over and over. The first human conversation was probably an argument and it's just gone on from there. We've already done just about all of the fucked up shit you can do on this planet with the technology we have except for total nuclear war, and how we've managed to avoid that is a miracle.

I want to say humans are evolving past this nonsense, but it really often feels like we are merely giving new names to old games a lot of times. I'm not quite sure we're getting anywhere on the board, and I'm afraid that at some point if we don't pick up the pace toward the goal of coexistence, one of us will get fed up and tip the board. Cause I think that's what happens in a lot of cases. People try to do the right thing and they just get screwed over and over until they're bitter enough to submit to unethical practices.

You might say remove the bad person from the scenario and it will be solved, but we often dont know who the bad person even is. It might even be the ones responsible for removing the badness.

You might say add the fortitude to protect the individual from badness, but what fortitude? Where? Can we cover all bases at once when those who will make it their life to manipulate will continue to find ways of doing so regardless of parameters?

I mean these are solutions we seem to be attempting and perhaps they help in some circumstances.

Idk it seems like there are common denominators, humanity's condition of neglect, ignorance, hate, greed.. all of those things that add up to our inability to righteously and peacefully coexist and evolve to our most opportune and educated potential is met with futile resolution.

Anyway I'm alright at pointing out the problems, but the solutions are maddening. We're on repeat. There has to be something we are missing. Maybe it is something new we have never had. Maybe it's an increase in something and a decrease in something else. There has to be a way to balance this equation to solve for this douchebaggery.

Outlander

110 billion humans — Lif3r

Wrong planet? Lol. Happens. :grin:

Lif3r

↪Outlander

Historical population

Wheatley

Maybe it is something new we have never had. Maybe it's an increase in something and a decrease in something else. There has to be a way to balance this equation to solve for this douchebaggery. — Lif3r

A douchebag's number one weapon is their ability to charm. We need to explain to people who are easily charmed that douchebags don't give a fuck about them.

BC

People singing about liberation and bringing peace to the people but then they just do the most heinous shit. — Lif3r

At the heart of the human condition is a contradiction: we have had, do have, and will have both good and bad impulses at work at the same time. That is just the way we are. You don't like it; I don't like it; nobody likes it; BUT that is how we are.

Most of the time, most people try to keep the bad impulses under control. Unfortunately, the environment we live in often makes that difficult. Still, even the best environment for humans will not bring about perfection -- just less douchebaggery. Or would that be douchesacerie, in French?

Outlander

one of us will get fed up and tip the board — Lif3r

If such a thing can be done the person would merely be oppressing an equal or inferior even. I thought that was pointless? Or bad?

3017amen

↪Lif3r

I would consider embracing the douchbaggery.
Both literally and figuratively, there is no escape from either one. Remember that there is a time for all seasons.

Maya

Truth is what we’re missing. Objective truth I believe. Imagine yourself above the Universe looking down. You are in the nothing, looking at existence, and you see everything clearly.

A Seagull

↪Lif3r

People are beautiful, life is wonderful. What is your problem? Presumably it is all in your head.

Theorem

↪Lif3r

You're only looking at one side of the equation. Bitter Crank is right - contradiction is at the heart of things. This implies the existence of good as well as evil, joy as well as suffering, growth as well as decay, cooperation as well as conflict, love as well as hate. For whatever reason (if any), it seems that you can't have one without the other. The best we can do is to choose hope and work for progress despite all of the madness.

What's the alternative?

180 Proof

↪Bitter Crank

:up:

Lif3r

I needed to be reminded that I will likely fail the task of solving the human condition, and I need to accept that while I work on the task and try to separate my emotion from my reasoning.

The curious thing I find when mentioning the human condition to philosophers is their willingness to dismiss it as an impossible problem. I realize utopia is a very far shot, but I don't think we have to reach perfection to find peace with one another, and I do think there can be ways to make larger steps than we currently do toward coexistence and planetary education.

Lif3r

And I do believe that while I may not find the end all suffering answer, I do have the potential to find pieces of that answer, so I will keep trying.

It is nearly an endless task. I have found that it would seem a large portion of suffering can be attributed to fear, not to be confused with respect. Overt greed, fear of powerlessness. Excessive competition, fear of inadequacy. Bigotry, fear of culture which one cannot relate.

Bringing courage and bringing confidence to humanity to alleviate these would be a huge step in my opinion, but how to relieve the pressure of 110billion people worth of pent up trust issues is boggling.

Maybe i need to do more study of governance to see if I can make mental adjustments to social systems, or perhaps create a new one.

I realize very well that I can make my own peace and take my own steps toward attempting to resolve this within my own circle, and I can have peace amongst my own life, but that is merely a side quest in all of this for me.

Theorem

I realize very well that I can make my own peace and take my own steps toward attempting to resolve this within my own circle, and I can have peace amongst my own life, but that is merely a side quest in all of this for me. — Lif3r

In my opinion, that should not be considered a side quest. That is the quest, and far too few people take it seriously. Imagine if literally everyone took seriously the responsibility for making their own little sphere of influence better than it already is. That's where we should all start. And if we succeed there, only then should we consider increasing our radius. I mean, if we can't consistently maintain/improve our own little personal lives, what makes us think that we have the wisdom to reform the whole world? I'm afraid that much evil and injustice has been done in the name of "reforming the world" by those who didn't possess such wisdom. That said, if you've got it, then by all means, take it to the world.

Lif3r

↪Theorem

To me the question of "how do we resolve the human condition?" is just the same as asking any other question, perhaps "why is the sky blue?" but the answer is more complicated.
The answer to why the sky is blue may have at one point seemed impossible to solve aside from mere happenstance, but eventually we met a point in time where we could reconcile it enough to be at least satisfied with a reasonable answer based on evidence of quantitative data and developments across multiple types of experiments validating the same conclusions.

There is no reason for me to believe similar resolution cannot come from experimentation and reasoning around the question of the human condition and ways to resolve it's discrepancy on the survival and prosperity of the human species and biology.

Look I'm also not saying I have all of the moral understanding of the universe. I also realize it's my personal responsibility to work toward maintaining coexistence with myself and with those around me. I can lend positive influence and work to be the best version of myself possible in hopes it will result in positive impact on the world... but that isnt enough to me. This does not satisfy me. I realize what I can do personally to combat the human condition. I want to know what *we can do as a unit to mitigate human suffering. I wish to figure out how to make this happen in a large way that has a high positive impact on everyone.

And I know it's a freakin huge question to step back and to try to look at the whole picture through history and to attempt to point out the places we went wrong and the effects it has on us now and where to go from here. It's not a small question by any means. There's love and hate and money and pleasure and pain and heartache and heirarchy and so much. It's a huge puzzle and maybe one of the most important puzzles we could solve, and I feel like most of us know this, but many of us either give up trying to solve it, ignore it completely, or we go off on some wild tangled tangents of indoctrination.

Anyway.. I have to learn to accept that I am not alone responsible for the suffering of the world. It is very unlikely for me to reach this goal of planetary joy, and I have to remember this as I continue to fail.

bongo fury

The little society, one and all, entered into this laudable design and set themselves to exert their different talents. The little piece of ground yielded them a plentiful crop. Cunegund indeed was very ugly, but she
became an excellent hand at pastrywork: Pacquette embroidered; the old woman had the care of the linen. There was none, down to Brother Giroflee, but did some service; he was a very good carpenter, and became an honest man. Pangloss used now and then to say to Candide:

“There is a concatenation of all events in the best of possible worlds; for, in short, had you not been kicked out of a fine castle for the love of Miss Cunegund; had you not been put into the Inquisition; had you not traveled over America on foot; had you not run the Baron through the body; and had you not lost all your sheep, which you brought from the good country of El Dorado, you would not have been here to eat preserved citrons and pistachio nuts.”

“Excellently observed,” answered Candide; “but let us cultivate our garden.”

–– THE END ––

The Questioning Bookworm

↪Lif3r

Interesting post. I have often had the same rant and train of thought when pondering deeply about The Human Condition and The Human Existence. Why are we all so contradictory?

110 billion humans and no one has figured out how to convince people to get along? How to not be a fucking douchebag? I mean that's fucking incredible. — Lif3r

In response to this quote, I think one must analyze what drives people to not get along. Oftentimes, I think what drives people to disagreement is the means of doing something. The point of disagreement-- from observation of antiquity as well as present time, whether it be in interpersonal interaction, political interaction, wartime interaction, it is often based on one person wanting to do something a certain way that is contentious or in direct opposition to another person's means for doing something a certain way.

Another reason why I think humans can't get along and will not get along for our entire life is that it is boring. Whether one accepts this fact about The Human Condition or not, humans hate boredom. Time and time again, we see individuals breaking boredom even if it is wrecking the peace, contentious toward another, or even violent behavior. The human mind does not succumb to boredom. There will always be internal or external strife with peace and boredom. For instance, taking a gander at some modern-day dating habits in the U.S. is sufficient to see this kind of breaking with boredom or peace. Some people argue for fun or poke fun at their partners. Some people are abusive to others. Some people cheat on others. Some people lead multiple women. Some people lead multiple men at the same time. Plus, we have all heard the story of the 'nice guy' or 'nice girl' being cheating on, ghosted, or dumped for no clear reason. And in many of these scenarios, there is often no clear reason for this behavior other than the fact that these people are bored or have mental issues. Whether or not one causes the other is aside from the point, and due for another discussion. But this is just one area where I find it clear that humans hate boredom, and it even affects their own dating lives.

You might say remove the bad person from the scenario and it will be solved, but we often don't know who the bad person even is. It might even be the ones responsible for removing the badness. — Lif3r

In response to this quote, I have the view that every human being is capable of being 'bad' in the moral sense. I believe everyone has some qualities of both 'good' and 'evil,' yet our actions are always wavering on a scale between the two opposites sides of morality. We are never fully 'good' or fully 'evil.' And the same goes for our actions. So removing bad people will never fix the problem. All humans, as we've seen, can be 'bad,' and create problems within society amongst each other.

You might say add the fortitude to protect the individual from badness, but what fortitude? Where? Can we cover all bases at once when those who will make it their life to manipulate will continue to find ways of doing so regardless of parameters? — Lif3r

I believe humans can try their best to protect or build walls to prevent others from acting 'bad.' However, we can only try and prevent so much.

Anyhow, thanks for the post. The Human Condition is one of my favorite topics to discuss because it is so captivating to talk about with others. Cheers!

The Questioning Bookworm

↪Maya

Truth is what we’re missing. Objective truth I believe. Imagine yourself above the Universe looking down. You are in nothing, looking at existence, and you see everything clearly. — Maya

I don't know if this is the case, but my gut thinks this probably will not work either. Human beings are contradictory due to 'good' and 'bad' impulses. Although objective truth may provide some clarity and block certain disagreements and entanglements among peoples, I don't believe it will have much effect in throwing further disagreements, entanglements, conflicts amongst nations, dissent, unrest, etc. Also, even if there was objective truth, we have seen that many people don't want to accept it because their illusions--that they happen to love and live in--would be destroyed (referencing an insight here for Friedrich Nietzsche). For instance, someone may be raised far from any interaction or knowledge of gun violence. Their parents may console them and censor them from this kind of behavior in the world. If we suppose this hypothetical child is blocked off from the news and friends, when the child grows up and eventually moves out, she may learn of gun violence, police brutality, and school shootings. Now this person has to destroy the illusion that her parents help create within her and go against her own prior knowledge and experience of the world. She may react with acceptance, denial, or a little bit of both. Yet the objective truth of these atrocities being real still remains...Therefore, as we can see, it is possible for objective truths to exist and people having the choice to believe them or reject them based on their own impulse, emotion, experience, and thoughts.

The Questioning Bookworm

↪Theorem

In my opinion, that should not be considered a side quest. That is the quest, and far too few people take it seriously. Imagine if literally, everyone took seriously the responsibility for making their own little sphere of influence better than it already is. That's where we should all start. — Theorem

This is a wonderful reply. I believe in this same view of The Human Condition. Humans have their own spheres, their own lives. What can they do? They can choose to make it worse, make it better, or remain to stagnate. There is also the notion of perception and interpretation of one's life. You may not be in control of circumstances in your life or things happening to you, but you do have some control over your interpretation, perception, and degree of acceptance of these things. Unfortunately, some humans do not view life through this lens, think everyone is out to get them, and/or have irrational illusions about their own lives that they don't want to break. But this is also a part of The Human Condition...

The Questioning Bookworm

↪Lif3r

What this post reminds me of is The Myth of Sisyphus by Albert Camus and his general view on how absurd human existence really is. Correct me if I am wrong, I am paraphrasing here, but if I remember correctly, Camus illustrates that the relationship between The Human and The Universe in life is absurd. Contrary to what politicians spout on stage, we cannot actually control anything. We can't even completely control our own lives. So, what shall we do? The Universe is pitted against us sometimes, yet it is also favorable to us sometimes. The world is favorable to us sometimes, yet it is also pitted against humanity at some points. There is nothing we can do about these facts. And yet at the same time, The Human is constantly striving for clarity, explanation, and control in one's life. In my opinion, this is what people need to think about and accept. Once people accept this, I believe it can temporarily calm down or even slightly decrease certain disputes or entanglements over certain things. But this view is definitely not a panacea for The Human Condition...Sometimes it makes it even worse for some.

The Human Condition

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