Just out of curiosity: once "they" come up with a Vaccine with maybe a 25% protection, but not really sure of the long term side affects other than defying death, are you going to be at the front of the line?
And, AND those who do not get in line for a year? Are they going to be labeled "anti vaxer"? — ArguingWAristotleTiff
My Indian said tagging people who have had the virus and is 'immune' is really close to dividing our society even further. I asked what makes him think that way and I got an eye roll from him when I had to be reminded of the Jewish tattooing of numbers.
I'm actually grateful that this next generation of leaders have not forgotten the past. :sparkle: — ArguingWAristotleTiff
I don't believe in anyone's right to infect others. — Hanover
However two antibody tests run on my Indian came back negative with a qualifier that it could be inaccurate. — ArguingWAristotleTiff
The treasury department sent $1.4 billion worth of stimulus payments to dead people. The direct payments, which were approved as part of the $2 trillion coronavirus relief bill, were sent to more than 1 million Americans who had already died, the Government Accountability Office said in a new report. - guardian — Benkei
Mutations happen — ArguingWAristotleTiff
Just out of curiosity: once "they" come up with a Vaccine with maybe a 25% protection, but not really sure of the long term side affects other than defying death, are you going to be at the front of the line?
And, AND those who do not get in line for a year? Are they going to be labeled "anti vaxer"? — ArguingWAristotleTiff
These inaccuracies aren't limited to coranavirus, so why take such a hard line on coronavirus specifically. Are you generally opposed to medical science? — Hanover
Anyway, you've not pointed out a danger to the vaccine, but only suggested it might not work. — Hanover
The treasury department sent $1.4 billion worth of stimulus payments to dead people. The direct payments, which were approved as part of the $2 trillion coronavirus relief bill — Benkei
"The danger is not over," Health Minister Lena Hallengren told a press conference, as she announced plans for how Sweden should act quickly in case there is a renewed rise in serious infections later this year.
The government on Monday ordered four government authorities – the Public Health Agency, the National Board of Health and Welfare, the Medical Products Agency and the Civil Contingencies Agency – as well as the country's county administrative boards to start drawing up plans for how to tackle such a second wave.
I'm not.I'm totally surprised though that their economy took the same hit as the other countries in Europe already. — Benkei
That's been dismissed as a hoax. — Benkei
That's been dismissed as a hoax. — Benkei
See article Wuhan lab had three live bat coronaviruses, but none matched COVID-19One of their research teams, led by Professor Shi Zhengli, has been researching bat coronaviruses since 2004 and focused on the “source tracing of SARS,” the strain behind another virus outbreak nearly two decades ago. “We know that the whole genome of SARS-CoV-2 is only 80 percent similar to that of SARS. It’s an obvious difference,” she said. “So, in Professor Shi’s past research, they didn’t pay attention to such viruses which are less similar to the SARS virus.” - In an interview with Scientific American, Shi said the SARS-CoV-2 genome sequence did not match any of the bat coronaviruses her laboratory had previously collected and studied.
The World Health Organization warned Monday that there could be no return to normality any time soon as too many countries were bungling their response to the coronavirus pandemic. WHO chief Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said that if public health guidelines are not followed, the crisis will get "worse and worse and worse."
What has been largely dismissed is various claims of genetic "proof" that the virus was engineered by gene splicing. I believe there was some Indian studies, or just one study, that sparked off these claims.
More famously, there's a French researcher, Luc Montagnier, accredited with discovering HIV causing AIDS, who claims the corona virus is for certain has a genetic splice of HIV, that it can't be natural. In the same interview, he makes the bizarre followup claims, to paraphrase, "that because it's unnatural, it is not in harmony with nature and thus will evolve away and be gone [by about nowish]" as well as an unrelated claim about his current research into the potential for electromagnetic waves to cure viral diseases. The interview is available here; this was right-wing super-juice as it both simultaneously supports the Wuhan lab origin hypothesis, China's attacked the US if you want to spin things that way, and supports the notion that the threat of the virus is completely overblown as it's not "natural" (supporting, as a subpoint, that the hubris of such scientists is ultimately futile against the power of God's maintained natural balance which is also why climate change isn't a threat) and so is already gone by nowish, and it's clams by a Nobel prize winner so "lefty-facty" people are hypocrites for not believing it wholesale. Unfortunately, the liberal media is so science illiterate and simply corrupt that this sort of highly dubious claims from someone already approved by the establishment cannot be dealt with.
Picking apart the claims is a pretty simple task.
Luc Montagnier supports the HIV engineered hypothesis based on the mathematical permutations required to create the same gene. Even assuming the gene is the same as HIV and a the mathematical permutations requires astronomical (i.e. even if the premises are correct, which I'm not sure about but don't need to bother to even check) the conclusions doesn't follow since viruses do not all evolve independently but share genetic information between them all the time. Someone infected with HIV, or an animal with a related virus, then infected with the coronavirus could pass the HIV gene to coronavius. Indeed, if the gene in question is what makes coronavirus so effective (the motivation for engineering into the virus in the first place) then it also has an advantage in transferring around in natural hosts as it provides the new virus with an immense advantage.
In other words, this "Nobel Prize" winner doesn't understand the basics of his own domain of expertise.
The even more bizarre claim that the virus is "non-harmonious" and therefore will just go away, doesn't even have a plausible mechanism, as the viral replication lines (chains of replication from one cell to another, one host to another) are happening all over the globe and at very different rates or replication, and there is simply no mechanism available to coordinate all these viral lineages to somehow peter-out.
His current research on radiation curing viral diseases is far fetched enough that a credible person realizes some basic proof of concept is required to entertain the idea; such as breaking apart suspended virus particles with EM frequencies (at energy levels well below what would just ionize or then cook the whole body). I.e. a credible person would preamble with such research, or then focus on these steps of proof of concept that could eventually lead to therapeutic application down the road. Presented as he does, it simply sounds completely delusional, and that he is engaged in some macabre program of trial and error of microwaving lot's of mice (and to the small mind of the bureaucrat, if a Nobel Prize winner wants to microwave some mice, it's not like anyone's proved otherwise; if we can broadcast television, why not health?). — boethius
However, as ↪schopenhauer1, points out, there's no way to rule out a lab origin, either by accident or on purpose, and any credible analysis must admit that if the premises are true, the conclusion still maybe true; and even if the conclusion isn't true, it doesn't rule out other bio-engineering techniques; therefore, it's better to ignore the issue altogether, and fuel claims of a conspiracy to suppress these sorts of claims (which, to be clear, there is a conspiracy between corporate media owners and executives to shape public discourse, and spinning a lack of evidence of one claim as positive proof of the opposing claim, that also lacks evidence, is a manifestation of this conspiracy to shape public discourse; there is only, ironically, a much stronger conspiracy in right wing media to shape right-wing discourse to be so far removed from reality, for instance repeating the idea that they are the real intellectuals and the more liberal media the real conspiracy funded by Soros and run by cultural Marxists et. al., that public discourse more generally is not even possible). — boethius
See article Wuhan lab had three live bat coronaviruses, but none matched COVID-19 — ssu
Yes all this stuff you mention sounds like bullshit, and I was not referring to this, or any similar-dubious claim, so this is kind of a non-sequitor to my claim, though interesting to learn the nutty theories out there. — schopenhauer1
However, as ↪schopenhauer1, points out, there's no way to rule out a lab origin, either by accident or on purpose — boethius
I agree. And since no government in the World would be indifferent about the possibility that it really did get out of a laboratory by accident and just reply "Sorry about that!", it will be genuinely hard to prove this (or disprove). We may never know.Also, as I stated, it may have been a virus that evolved at the lab (not intentional), and got out. Though that might be harder to prove. — schopenhauer1
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