Agustino's Feedback

Agustino

Here's your post. Put it in feedback where, as I think you know, it belongs — Baden

With reference to the discussion in this thread

[ Please note this post was originally placed in that thread, and I was asked to remove it and place it in a separate thread ]

Alas even my arguments won't be sufficient to protect me from Baden who apparently thinks that, and I quote from the message he has sent me, "you've racked up more low quality and low class posts than almost any other poster I can think of", and told me to "consider yourself on notice". He emphasised that I should "try searching for how many times you've used the word "fuck" in your posts, or how many times you've personally insulted a poster" - "I don't ever remember moderating you" - strange, I never knew saying "fuck" is equivalent to low post quality. As for insulting, he should look at how Hanover for example (the guy who has the audacity to ask why he's not a moderator; and thank God that he's not a moderator) insults those of different views than him. But alas, I grant Baden even this. If this is so, then he certainly has been giving a very poor example of proper behaviour, despite being the head moderator, and I really think he should be ashamed of himself:

http://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/9310#Post_9310
http://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/9794#Post_9794
http://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/9796#Post_9796
http://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/17205#Post_17205
http://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/23507#Post_23507
http://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/45151#Post_45151

Apparently my contributions are of "low quality" and I'm not a good enough member of this community. So granted that I'm on notice, I may as well state that if I am ever banned, I would kindly ask that all my posts and threads from thephilosophyforum get deleted, along with every single place where I am quoted or mentioned. No reason to keep around low quality posts, not to mention that leaving them around will just lead to someone else picking up my gun, someone who would keep on shooting. So it's better to take the necessary measures to get rid of me completely, otherwise the sexually obsessed will never be at liberty to enforce their dogmas and belittle those of different views, seeing them as sick and disordered.

If Baden thinks that dialogue is to be won by putting people on notice, and other forceful means, then I think that sadly the power of being head moderator has gotten to his head, and it would be better that he focus his efforts towards safeguarding his character, even if it means renouncing the power. Otherwise what will he gain if he loses his character and keeps the power? That will just lead to the destruction of this forum, like it happened to the previous PF. Indeed, it's quite a worrying sign that all the moderators seem to share the same basic conviction with regards to sex - that seems like a sure factor which will stop their side from ever losing. We'll always be divided and conquered through different threats if needed, just like now.

To all those few or many who didn't and don't find my posts to be of "low quality" I would just like to advise you to never ever give up in your convictions when they are backed by sound reason. You will find people who are like you, and who share your devotion to reason, and together with them you can change the world. A few from the cave will react with violence towards the light, but that is inevitable. Never allow yourselves to be divided, because divided you shall fall, but united you shall outlive the threats that stumble your way.

I've had the opportunity to learn a lot from some of you and I'd like to thank you for that, and hope that I will be able to continue to learn a lot from you. I will not publicly name you just because at present this wouldn't be proper of me to do given the circumstances of someone who is "on notice". You have my respect and full gratitude. Personally I hold no grudges against Baden, and would just mention that if I am banned I wouldn't take it personally - after all, failure, like Henry Ford said, is merely the opportunity to begin again, this time more intelligently - and I have no doubt that I'll manage to find myself another home, and if not, even build one, why not. Anyway, I hope that Baden is now satisfied and can feel at ease holding his opinions and prejudice against celibacy!

Baden

Yawn. I'd hate to think what kind of reaction I'd get if I actually did moderate one of your 2,700 posts. And yet you have no problem asking me to moderate others. Remember this conversation from a couple of days ago:

--------------

Hi Baden,

Happy New Year! I was wondering what's the moderating policy on the forums regarding religious evangelism? I see no action taken against all sorts of evangelists like [redacted] or [redacted], and it seems to me they are concerned with promoting some sort of pseudo-philosophy. Thanks!

Best Regards,
Agustino

------------

Happy New Year, Agustino,

As it says in the guidelines, evangelists are not welcome here, but like everything else the moderation decisions will depend on the extent and level of the offense. I'll take a look at these members in a moment to see what should be done. Also, it would be helpful if you could report specific posts using the flag button. They'll then be put in a moderation queue..

All the best,

Baden

-------------

Baden:

Follow up: Having looked at these posters, I see your point regarding evangelism. I've PMed [redacted] and deleted one of [redacted] discussions.

--------------

Agustino:

Okay, thanks! :)

----------------

Shameful of me to persecute you like that. :-|

Agustino

↪Baden

Well clearly a post which says global warming is happening because the Earth is getting closer to the Sun because of the Sun's gravity is bullshit - because it's just scientifically false (the Earth isn't actually getting closer - and even if it was, the degree to which this would happen would be insignificant) - it's not even worth refuting! At PF that post would have been deleted in an instant, or at least moved to pseudo-philosophy, I wouldn't have to report anything. That post and the like of it should be deleted (well better would be to move them to some unmoderated section). But what does that have to do with my posts which you referenced? I never told you to moderate posts for using the word "fuck" afterall... if I had told you that, then I should've started with advising you to moderate your own posts.

Baden

Well clearly a post which says global warming is happening because the Earth is getting closer to the Sun because of the Sun's gravity is bullshit - because it's just scientifically false. That post and the like of it should be deleted. — Agustino

No, that was another conversation in which I also moderated at your request.

But what does that have to do with my posts which you referenced? — Agustino

You seem to think you've been treated egregiously by me despite the fact that not only have I not moderated any of your posts, I have moderated others on your request. It's pretty simple, this sort of thing:

Well let's see... you go do your casual sex and being socially integrated until your instrument rots and falls off, your wife divorces you because you can't hold your dong in your pants and she's disappointed that you didn't wait for her - you know. That sounds like a great life am I right? That's certainly a brilliant path to take. Or wait - your wife won't divorce you, because you won't even get to marry that kind of woman. You'll marry some slut who fucks left and right, just like you. And when she cheats with your brother - ehhh not a big deal - just some casual sex." — Agustino

is low quality. If anything where I was remiss was not getting rid of it.

Agustino

No, that was another conversation in which I also moderated at your request. — Baden

It was part of the very same conversation actually, check the messages. It was the continuation of it.

You seem to think you've been treated egregiously by me despite the fact that not only have I not moderated any of your posts, I have moderated others on your request. — Baden

At my request? You're talking as if I am your boss and ordering you what to do. Clearly you thought they were worth moderating, or you wouldn't have moderated them in the first place. The real issue is why did you moderate them only after I told you? Did you not know of their existence? If you did, why did you have to wait for my request to moderate them?

If anything where I was remiss was not getting rid of it. — Baden

Yeah you should've gotten rid of it if you really thought that. The fact you didn't proves that that's not what you thought.

As for the post, that's not the whole post. You have to quote everything. Why are you quoting half the post?? Here:

And since you quoted my post discussing celibacy vs casual sex. Well let's see... you go do your casual sex and being socially integrated until your instrument rots and falls off, your wife divorces you because you can't hold your dong in your pants and she's disappointed that you didn't wait for her - you know. That sounds like a great life am I right? That's certainly a brilliant path to take. Or wait - your wife won't divorce you, because you won't even get to marry that kind of woman. You'll marry some slut who fucks left and right, just like you. And when she cheats with your brother - ehhh not a big deal - just some casual sex. Such a person will end like Bertrand Russell - having their wife openly cheating on them and not divorcing "for the kids" - >:O shameful - Russell should have been ashamed of himself. That big head wasn't enough to guide him, clearly.

The priest on the other hand lives a life being compassionate towards others, focusing on helping them develop spiritually, being unconcerned with sex or making a family because he doesn't want to be devoted just to a small set of people, but rather to everyone who needs his help. Going to Church, counselling people on their problems, being an agent of change in their lives... Let's see, which would I rather choose? The humiliated but socially integrated Russell or the tranquil but family-less priest? — Agustino

What's low quality about this post? I'm offering an example of how a celibate life can be better than a non-celibate life, yes using some harsh language to illustrate vividly one possibility, to someone who thinks that a celibate life is stupid. So I offer an example of a possible celibate life, and a possible non-celibate life and showing how the celibate life COULD BE better - to someone who doesn't think this is possible. I haven't insulted anyone in that post, if you actually bother to read it, you see things like "such a person" - indicating that the "you" in the first paragraph doesn't refer to Hanover, but to someone who would adopt such principles that celibacy is always wrong, and casual sex has no associated problems.

And in either case, you've accused me to have more low quality posts than any other poster you can think of. Clearly it's not just that post. I imagine you must be referencing hundreds of posts.

Baden

The point is Agustino that it's not my moderation that's the problem, it's that someone should even think of moderating your posts that you object to and that provokes this hysterical reaction. But it won't change anything, attempts to play the martyr notwithstanding, you'll get treated the same as everyone else.

Agustino

The point is Agustino that it's not my moderation that's the problem, it's that someone should even think of moderating your posts that you object to and that provokes this hysterical reaction — Baden

My posts have actually been moderated before as far as I remember, and I have no problems with it mostly (in fact I don't remember ever complaining because my posts were moderated - I may have PMed a mod for explanations though in the past, can't remember). It's one thing to moderate posts (which as per your admission you haven't done), and it's a different thing to threaten someone and tell them that they've "racked up more low quality and low class posts than any other poster I can think of", and that they are "on notice".

I should get treated the same as everyone, but clearly I don't get treated the same as Baden, who gets to say "fuck" as much as he wants to. As I told you, I have no problem with that - if you don't want me to say "fuck" I won't say it, it's quite simple. I don't mind posting under your constraints, whatever you set them to be, but then you should also uphold them, instead of hypocritically demand that only others uphold them.

Baden

↪Agustino

This is the problem, responding to you just provokes more silliness. Anyhow, here's the PM you find so offensive.

Accusing me of bias may make yourself feel better but don't expect me to take it seriously. You've racked up more low quality and low class posts than almost any other poster I can think of (try searching for how many times you've used the word "fuck" in your posts or how many times you've personally insulted another poster) and I don't ever remember moderating you. — Baden

Using the word "fuck" is not against the rules. Using it as much as you have been recently though to refer to the sexual act along with "sluts"/"pussy"/"dong" etc in what is supposed to be a serious discussion is low class and does detract from the quality of your posts. To most people that would be obvious. Anything else?

(Oh, and you were "on notice" of being moderated. So what?)

Baden

Anyway, fwiw, I don't think most of your posts are low quality; you do contribute good posts too, but more often than most posters I know, you have a tendency to get carried away with yourself.

Emptyheady

try searching for how many times you've used the word "fuck" in your posts, or how many times you've personally insulted a poster" — Agustino

I am guilty as well. I will try to behave. :-x

Streetlight

Using the word "fuck" is not against the rules. Using it as much as you have been recently though to refer to the sexual act along with "sluts"/"pussy"/"dong" etc in what is supposed to be a serious discussion is low class and does detract from the quality of your posts. — Baden

This. For all your 'conservatism' your rhetoric tends to be shot through and through with sheer vulgarity ("You'll marry some slut who fucks left and right, just like you", etc), especially when characterizing the positions you do not like. It is unproductive, off-putting, and makes the forum a worse place for discussion. That, and not your politics is the reason you are 'on notice'.

Agustino

sheer vulgarity — StreetlightX

It is unproductive, off-putting, and makes the forum a worse place for discussion — StreetlightX

But what if their position implies vulgarity? It sounds vulgar to me, and so I'm merely illustrating that. Why is illustrating the vulgarity inherent in their positions unproductive? I recognise it is off putting because people don't want to deal with all these associated problems and pretend they don't exist.

Streetlight

You can call our vulgarity without yourself being vulgar. Watch this: Augstino, I find your rhetoric vulgar. Ta da.

Agustino

↪StreetlightX

Fine, I don't mind doing that. The only issue is that the point remains quite abstract, whereas being vulgar not only points to it but shows it.

The Great Whatever

"Vulgarity?" Isn't that a little petit-bourgeois? Xa xa xa...

Streetlight

That's the price we pay for civility around here.

Agustino

↪The Great Whatever

>:O

Agustino

↪StreetlightX

Fine, if those are the rules, they are the rules.

Terrapin Station

The only moderation I'm in favor of is the prohibition of flooding. <shrugs>

Agustino

↪Terrapin Station

Flooding? What's that?

Terrapin Station

↪Agustino

Starting a shitload of more or less substance-free threads, one right after another, or to a lesser extent, posting a shitload of more or less substance-free posts, one right after another, especially for the latter when it's bumping a bunch of old, otherwise dead threads.

Agustino

↪Terrapin Station

>:O I've never seen that occur here, though it sometimes happened at PF. The only possibility for that, to be honest, would be spam-bots. No person would do that, why would they bother.

Terrapin Station

↪Agustino

Yeah, I've not seen it here. it happens on some other boards I post on, though. In those cases it's trolls who are trying to disrupt the boards.

Agustino

↪Terrapin Station

I saw you around at Philosophy Now, you're quite a star there :P - I haven't even made an appearance there, though I do have an account, but can't be bothered to post there. I prefer the format of the boards we have here. They have so many ~~topics~~ categories and subcategories that it's hard to keep track of.

Terrapin Station

↪Agustino

I was referring to some other boards I post on, and especially a film board I post on.

I've basically given up on the Philosophy Now board. Its too difficult to have a serious discussion there, and it's otherwise way too slow to be entertaining. There are also a number of people there who have kind of an anti-intellectual bent, where they're hostile towards the idea of studying academic philosophy or communicating in that vein . . . which is kind of weird for a philosophy board.

Agustino

I've basically given up on the Philosophy Now board. Its too difficult to have a serious discussion there, and it's otherwise way too slow to be entertaining. There are also a number of people there who have kind of an anti-intellectual bent, where they're hostile towards the idea of studying academic philosophy or communicating in that vein . . . which is kind of weird for a philosophy board. — Terrapin Station

I noted the lack of interesting discussion on their boards. Philosophers seem to be rarely, if ever mentioned there, which I did find very strange. You won't find a "who's your favorite philosopher" poll there :P

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