Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., a Trump ally who usually avoids criticizing the president in public, told reporters Wednesday that "claiming you've won the election is different from finishing the counting."

The big rat is preparing to jump ship. :smile:

How many Americans do we expect Trump will have killed on election Day by trying to convince people that postal votes might not be counted? A record number of cases recorded both nationwide and in five particular states.

But my wife's sister, whom she is VERY close to, inhales Fox News and believes every word. — Hippyhead

Hah! We have a very similar situation in our family - sister-in-law is Trump supporter. We love her dearly. The crazy making thing (well OK, one of many crazy making things) is that she (and most Trump supporters) is not stupid - AND - she voted for Obama in 2012.

Go figure . . . .

At least on the Republican forums, sure.

Perhaps others will refer to him as ex-president after he leaves office. I'm sure he personally wouldn't like that.

We have a very similar situation in our family — EricH

One of our neighbours a few doors down likes our Boris.

We're selling up and moving.


Trump is the mother of all Trumps. Therefore @Jamalrob's wife is gay.

Hah! We have a very similar situation in our family - sister-in-law is Trump supporter. We love her dearly. The crazy making thing (well OK, one of many crazy making things) is that she (and most Trump supporters) is not stupid - AND - she voted for Obama in 2012. — EricH

All of us are bright in some ways and stupid in others. Some people are just politically stupid.

Voting Republican doesn't equal being stupid. Jeb Bush was governor here in Florida for eight years and nothing bad happened. He's a very intelligent and reasonable person. He's more conservative than I am, but that doesn't freak me out, a diversity of views is healthy.

Trump is something else altogether. Trump isn't really a Republican at all. He has no convictions other than his own personal self interest. Evidence....

Donald Trump donated $175,860 more to Democrats than Republicans from 1989 to 2010, — BallotPedia

https://ballotpedia.org/History_of_Donald_Trump%27s_political_donations

Trump was questioned about his previous political contributions to Democrats while on the campaign trail. During a June 2015 interview, Trump was asked why he donated to the Clinton Foundation and prominent Democrats, including former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid (Nev.), and Obama White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel.

Trump replied, “It’s smart. It’s called being an intelligent person and a great business person. ... But the truth is that, you have to be able to get along with—if you’re gonna be a business person, even in the United States, you wanna get along with all sides because you’re gonna need things from everybody. And you wanna get along with all sides, it’s very important.

Trump is something else altogether. Trump isn't really a Republican at all. He has no convictions other than his own personal self interest. Evidence.... — Hippyhead

That's the thing that gets me. What made conservatives so convinced Trump is one of them? Most of all, what made religious conservatives think that? They espouse having these political and religious conservative principles, unlike their left-leaning foes according to them, but what about Trump is principled, other than his self-interest?

He ran as a Republican because he saw an opportunity at the time given the lack of appeal for all the other Republican candidates as people were growing more disillusioned with establishment politicians. Thus all the rhetoric about "draining the swamp". But it was all doing what Donnie does best, grifting. He's a bullshit artist.

What made conservatives so convinced Trump is one of them? Most of all, what made religious conservatives think that? — Marchesk

I dunno. Perhaps they saw Trump accurately as a purely transactional actor, and concluded that he would deliver on his end of the bargain, which he did with the Supreme Court. They did a deal with the devil?

She's Russian and wants the best for her country. — jamalrob

The best thing for Russia would be for putin to be mussolinied. Or, alternatively, gaddafied:

dunno. Perhaps they saw Trump accurately as a purely transactional actor, and concluded that he would deliver on his end of the bargain, which he did with the Supreme Court. They did a deal with the devil? — Hippyhead

Could be, for some anyway. Depends on what level you're playing the political game at. But I do know some conservatives who deeply believe in him to this day.

Far more better if he would be sentenced to jail for the a) rampant corruption b) the killing innocent Russians to reignite the Chechen war. Yet that's not likely to happen.

But I guess that many Russians are happy that Putin annexed Crimea and South Ossetia to Russia and that he has played with the Americans. And have to say, he is one of the great politicians of our time. Even if I think he is a bit dangerous.

Far more better if he would be sentenced to jail for the a) rampant corruption b) the killing innocent Russians to reignite the Chechen war. Yet that's not likely to happen. — ssu

That's not going to happen. Someone just needs to blow the Cunt up.

But I do know some conservatives who deeply believe in him to this day. — Marchesk

Yea, well, this is a philosophy forum so we tend to think everything is about rational analysis. I think one of Trump's great gifts is that he's a clear minded realist, liberated as he is from any idealism. He's sees that human beings are like an M&M candy, with a thin hard shell of reason on the outside obscuring a much larger soft and squishy middle. You know, this forum too, driven primarily by emotional agendas.

I think we have to acknowledge the man has a great charismatic gift. Yes, he's a horrible human being who often sounds really stupid for sure, but truly gifted nonetheless.

Make him a martyr?

Likely he will then be one of the most respected Russian leaders, even if "the intelligentsia" might have other ideas about him. You seem not to understand Russians at all.

And even if it's very unlikely, the real issue is that Russia can be a democracy and a functioning justice state even if it's not now. Putin indeed can go to jail. As one Russian opposition leader once said, even his watch that he wears is more expensive than his official annual salary could by.

You seem not to understand Russians at all. — ssu

Lack of understanding has never stopped him before.

Gloating over someone's lynching. That's absolutely disgusting.

I agree, but go easy on him. He has a pathological condition in which any mention of Russia sends him into a bloodthirsty frenzy.

ABORTION: It's not unreasonable for people to wish to place limits on the killing of babies. We don't kill senior citizens when they become inconvenient, right? — Hippyhead

Hel-lo-oo! There are limits. And I am under the impression that killing babies in the US is murder. .

Both Dems and Repubs have shown considerable interest in candidates far outside the traditional American political mainstream. It's not just the other fellow who is doing this. — Hippyhead

Three: 1) "traditional" "mainstream" = oxymoron. 2) What do you imagine the mainstream to be?, and 3) What oddballs have the Democrats presented?

If by mainstream you mean the likes of Trump and all of his, then we should not want "mainstream" at all, yes?

He has a pathological condition in which any mention of Russia sends him into a bloodthirsty frenzy. — jamalrob

CCP as well, I have a balanced outlook.

weird that I'm butting heads with you again. Are you a putin supporter (apologist) (Cunt)?

The Democrats are the anti-Russia party — jamalrob

Is that not a new development since the advent of Trump-Russia collusion? I remember in 2017 thinking it strange that it was the Democrats not the Republicans who were making such a big deal about how Russia Is Bad.

CCCP.

Besides, the Russians I've met were very nice and warm people. Judge individuals, not people. And don't relate the people to the problems of their society as if there is something inherently wrong with the people themselves. Not the fault of the present people that earlier generations ended up with Marxism-Leninism.

For example, Mexicans are great, their society isn't so. But of course, if you dismantle the justice system and let criminals run amok, any society would be in the end similar.

Besides, the Russians I've met were very nice and warm people. Judge individuals, not people — ssu

I have nothing against the Russian people, I too have met and socialized with them.

I'm against the murderous, kleptocratic, plastic-surgery-ed Cunt and his cronies.

Also putin's effrontery to think he can rule that nation for so long, I'm agin' it.

It's fun to parade around in our supposed moral and intellectual superiority, but one of the price tags for that is a Supreme Court stuffed with conservatives for the next generation. — Hippyhead

So instead we should just preemptively concede to the conservatives on everything?

The common ground that Trump’s base and the progressive base have is that almost all of them are poor and suffering for the benefit of a handful of wealthy elites. That should be something that everyone can rally around. But no, doing anything about that would be socialism... much better to blame the Jews for letting Mexicans take all our jobs...

So instead we should just preemptively concede to the conservatives on everything? — Pfhorrest

If you'd like to actually read my posts before commenting on them I wouldn't mind at all.

I did, and the gist of it seemed to be that conservatives have good points that we should all be able to agree about, on a list of issues where progressives and conservatives usually disagree.

and the gist of it seemed to be that conservatives have good points that we should all be able to agree about — Pfhorrest

Ok, fair enough, maybe less than perfect writing on my part, which is not improved by my snarkiness.

I didn't mean to say we should automatically agree, but just that there are a number of points they make that are reasonable and merit respectful consideration. We don't have to agree to build the wall for example, but we can look them in the eye and say that their concerns about immigration are worth discussing.

If we want to ever have a solid reliable Democratic majority we have to de-demonize the conversations to the degree possible. The way to do that is to seek out every topic where we can have respectful conversations and focus our attention there.

Nearly half of the voters have seen Trump in all of his splendor—his infantile tirades, his disastrous and lethal policies, his contempt for democracy in all its forms—and they decided that they wanted more of it. His voters can no longer hide behind excuses about the corruption of Hillary Clinton or their willingness to take a chance on an unproven political novice. They cannot feign ignorance about how Trump would rule. They know, and they have embraced him.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/11/large-portion-electorate-chose-sociopath/616994/

If Biden wins....

I cast my vote that we do a find and replace on the forum database and remove all references to...

He Who Shall Not Be Named

Another couple days and it will be time to turn and walk away from this topic.

Agree. I hope when all the dust is settled that American politics becomes dull again.