The Chinese govt does that with political prisoners. After they claimed they'd stopped, watchdog groups say the number of transplants taking place indicates theyre still doing it. I don't think it reflects communism, though. Does it? — frank
The practice of harvesting organs from sometimes living prisoners is just a reflection of the genocidal, sociopathic nature of the Chinese leadership today. As much as I hate communism, I don't specifically blame communism for the organ harvesting happening today in China. I don't blame capitalism either. I blame the leadership. — BitconnectCarlos
These resentments find root in the fallacious belief that all of economics is 'zero-sum'; that those who have accumulated wealth have necessarily obtained it by confiscation. — geospiza
One does not have to believe that all of economics is zero-sum in order to believe that theft is possible, nor that other forms of illegitimate transfers of wealth (if those somehow don't count as theft) are possible. — Pfhorrest
The 1% is an organizing principle for political agitation — geospiza
and a scapegoat for those who lament poverty, or who resent wealth for a variety of reasons. These resentments find root in the fallacious belief that all of economics is 'zero-sum'; — geospiza
that those who have accumulated wealth have necessarily obtained it by confiscation. — geospiza
My point is that just because a small group of people attain extreme wealth does not imply that it was ill-gotten. — geospiza
"ill-gotten"? That depends on what you mean. Stop talking in the clouds and be specific. Is it right or wrong for companies to use tax havens and code loopholes to avoid paying taxes? It depends. You might argue it's perfectly legal and within the rules of the game. Is it right to automate jobs or outsource them to make more money? You could argue that's perfectly "natural," given that maximizing profit and market share is a core feature of our economic system.
So yes, assuming the game we're playing is legitiamte, the 1% perhaps haven't attained their extreme wealth in an "ill-gotten" way -- no murder, no rape, no (legal) theft, etc. But that's quite an assumption, which most people (including you) fail to even question. If the game itself is a sick one, and furthermore tilted in many ways... — Xtrix
Take away the profit incentive and you get stagnation. — geospiza
By maintaining modest corporate and personal tax rates there is less incentive to lower production or to export earnings. Stop the obsession with tax rates, and focus instead on overall tax revenues. Realize that there is a point at which higher marginal tax rates for the wealthiest income earners will negatively correlate with total tax revenue.
The top 1% did not make the rest of us poor. Poverty is the default condition. — geospiza
Take away the profit incentive and you get stagnation. — geospiza
Says every capitalist apologist in history. No evidence whatsoever, historical or otherwise, but nice to see you can repeat slogans.
— Xtrix
No evidence? :rofl: — geospiza
Yes: no evidence, historical or otherwise. — Xtrix
Yes: no evidence, historical or otherwise.
Just a childish assertion, as if "profit" is essential in human behavior. In fact it ignores the the core thrust of philosophy, the sciences, and the arts. Not to mention family, friendship, and community. I suppose in your eyes, all this operates on the basis of the "profit incentive."
What a pathological, nihilistic view of the w — Xtrix
The 1% is an organizing principle for political agitation, and a scapegoat for those who lament poverty, or who resent wealth for a variety of reasons. These resentments find root in the fallacious belief that all of economics is 'zero-sum'; that those who have accumulated wealth have necessarily obtained it by confiscation. The whole social movement draws on a wider set of Marxist propositions that have been remarkably persistent over time. — geospiza
In most cases the best explanation is that some people have simply outproduced others. — geospiza
It is a fact that there are wide disparities in outcomes of wealth/income. It doesn't follow from this that some groups have been victimized by others. — geospiza
Don't be a fool. There's evidence all around you of people being motivated to production by profit. Your inability to admit it is an obvious sign of a deeper ideological agenda. — geospiza
In most cases the best explanation is that some people have simply outproduced others.
— geospiza
Yeah I'm sure Elon Musk just works a few million percent harder and smarter than the average American. — Pfhorrest
It is a fact that there are wide disparities in outcomes of wealth/income. It doesn't follow from this that some groups have been victimized by others. In most cases the best explanation is that some people have simply outproduced others. There is nothing morally superior about those who accumulate wealth, just as there is nothing morally superior about those who don't. — geospiza
Without profit on investment you are effectively losing money, even if you break even. I make this point frequently and leftists never quite seem to understand it. — BitconnectCarlos
And what a profound point it is. Too bad those "leftists" can't understand your very stable genius. — Xtrix
Why don't the two of you go have fun arguing against your straw men. When you're ready to join the real world, we'll be waiting. — Xtrix
What straw man are you talking about? — BitconnectCarlos
My point is that just because a small group of people attain extreme wealth does not imply that it was ill-gotten.
— geospiza
"ill-gotten"? That depends on what you mean. Stop talking in the clouds and be specific. Is it right or wrong for companies to use tax havens and code loopholes to avoid paying taxes? It depends. You might argue it's perfectly legal and within the rules of the game. Is it right to automate jobs or outsource them to make more money? You could argue that's perfectly "natural," given that maximizing profit and market share is a core feature of our economic system.
So yes, assuming the game we're playing is legitiamte, the 1% perhaps haven't attained their extreme wealth in an "ill-gotten" way -- no murder, no rape, no (legal) theft, etc. But that's quite an assumption, which most people (including you) fail to even question. If the game itself is a sick one, and furthermore tilted in many ways... — Xtrix
Take away the profit incentive and you get stagnation. — geospiza
The top 1% did not make the rest of us poor. — geospiza
Your inability to admit it is an obvious sign of a deeper ideological agenda. — geospiza
It doesn't follow from this that some groups have been victimized by others. — geospiza
There is nothing morally superior about those who accumulate wealth — geospiza
Despite what some of the other commentators are saying, saving and particularly investment are absolutely essential to civilization. — BitconnectCarlos
Everything you're seeing isn't intended to be an argument. We're just making our position clear. Us expressing our position isn't a "straw man." If you agree that's great, if you don't we can talk about it. — BitconnectCarlos
You make references to "the game" or "the system" but you're not too clear about it exactly. — BitconnectCarlos
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