The biggest lie I was taught is more of an attitude than a falsehood.

The lie has the function of convincing someone pulled by the hideous strength of life's currents that thrashing their arms and legs in the roil counts as "swimming" and thus helps them stay afloat. The deeper truth is that the lie must nevertheless be believed on pain of drowning.

I would say that the most ridiculous lie children are taught is the idea of Father Christmas. You might think that I am being ridiculous but I do believe that it is a damaging idea. Personally, my parents only went along with it superficially and I stopped believing it at about 4 years old because I was aware that our family home fireplace was blocked off by a piece of wood and that it was not possible for Father Christmas to be everywhere at once. However, when I started school everyone else in my class believed in the idea and I didn't say anything because they needed to think for themselves and it seems that some children believe in this until about age 7. Children often seem let down when they discover it is a lie.

The reason why I think that the idea is not good is that I think it encourages people to adopt foolish foundations and illusions. It is rather different from religious beliefs because they are held genuinely, whereas Father Christmas is a nonsensical lie and does not have any benefit in helping children's understanding of reality.

The biggest lie would be one that we don't know is a lie. The better the deception, the less likely that it'll be discovered. Ergo, if there's a biggest lie, no one knows of it.

I think I was 5 or 6 when my grandmother passed. One day around that time I was in the front seat of the truck with my mother. I wondered what the "hazard light" button was. She told me that's what you push to "make us fly straight up into the sky so we can go visit grandma" .. or something. Something came up, I think, and I was just left sitting there pondering that for a good few minutes. Why couldn't it? Planes fly, they both have engines and operate in ways that are just as good as magical to the understanding of a 6 year old. I ended up believing that for a solid half-decade before around 10 or so I was with friends and we were stuck in traffic where everyone was complaining. I suggested "why don't we just push the fly button" .. after I explained it to them, the adults smiled at me, and the kids there just started laughing. Man. Come to think of it I turned out alright in comparison.

Fortunately my father always chose to give me alternate perspectives, a healthy dose of reality, I suppose. To the chagrin of my mother, we'd always watch "America's Most Wanted" every Sunday at 9. I'd always be coming up with "what would I do if..." scenarios as a result.

I disagree with the idea of Santa Claus being akin to a "cruel, counterproductive lie" though. Depending on the circumstance, the occasional glimmer of magic and wonder in an otherwise mundane world can make for happy times, at least early on. Besides, depending on where you live, the possibility of a strange old man breaking into your house and attempting to offer you presents in exchange for you to "be a good boy and listen" is very real. Holidays are weird like that. On Halloween, you dress up your kids in shiny outfits and send them off to stranger's homes unsupervised with the implied rule of eating anything they wish to give you. On Easter, if you happen to be in the woods on an Easter Egg hunt, if you ever run into a strange man in a bunny costume you "won" and need to follow him to wherever he may lead you. Etc. Jeez what a world.

I'd probably have to agree with

The lie has the function of convincing someone pulled by the hideous strength of life's currents that thrashing their arms and legs in the roil counts as "swimming" and thus helps them stay afloat. The deeper truth is that the lie must nevertheless be believed on pain of drowning. — fdrake

...as the biggest. So the second biggest

That the things people say actually reflect in one-to-one correspondence some picture of the world as they believe it to be.

Related - that the things people do actually reflect a one-to-one relationship with some picture of wordly mechanism by which those actions have the desired effect.

Flying cars and robot butlers!

I agree that Santa is a truly bizarre lie we tell children. My nieces are toddlers and their grandfather dressed as Santa and came out to see them. They sobbed and screamed for fear and discomfort. Santa is a stranger who breaks into your home, eats your sweets, and leaves you with presents but would dump coal on your floor if you were naughty... I don’t know how damaging it is, but it is a truly bizarre lie, mostly because we gaslight children’s reality. People could easily teach Santa as a fiction, but instead they legitimately convince children that he is real and they need to behave to please him because he is always watching them.. it’s just so strange..

Growing up, it was my family constantly reminding me that the world outside is a 'bad place'. — OneTwoMany

The opposite: I was expected to believe, on pain of physical punishment, that the world is a good place.

Like they say, The greatest trick that the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he doesn't exist.

I attribute some of my worst experiences to family and I'm still working on myself to erase the negative impressions created during my growing years. — OneTwoMany

Eventually everybody grows-up and gets over it.

your mature response doesn't answer the question I put forth. To quote you, I hope everyone does grow up.

We live in a country of adult children, so it's not looking too good in that regard.

Parents are what they are, but at some point you have to take responsibility for your own behavior.

we also live in a country where people can't read. Where am I blaming my behavior on anyone? Take your flaming somewhere else. If you're bitter, see a therapist.

That the things people say actually reflect in one-to-one correspondence some picture of the world as they believe it to be. — Isaac

:up:

Another one for the pile: the immediacy of revelation/self evidence/unmediated cognition. The it "just seems this way to me" brigade vs the wealth of evidence for the self as the internal documents of a vast bodily bureaucracy.

Eventually everybody grows-up and gets over it. — synthesis

"Grows up and gets over it." A fine therapeutic outcome. I think what you mean is "survive." Not to be confused with recovery in any sense.

"Grows up and gets over it." A fine therapeutic outcome. I think what you mean is "survive." Not to be confused with recovery in any sense. — tim wood

Recovery from what?

Where am I blaming my behavior on anyone? — OneTwoMany

I attribute some of my worst experiences to family and I'm still working on myself to erase the negative impressions created during my growing years. — OneTwoMany

Negative impressions? Life is tough, my friend. Who promised you a picnic?

If attention is what he craves, that's exactly what we deny him. Poor sucker.

The greatest lies those of omission. Often enough the complete absence of whatever should be, so that a person simply has no idea what is missing, or even that anything is missing. And thus a bad example sometimes better than no example. The world has many heroes - usually unappreciated - who have by mainly their own strength alone established truth and good in their own lives, knowing it from the evil and the bad in their own. And often these men and women: men who work to parent children who turn out to be good people, and women, even as single mothers, who wring triumph out of abuse and adversity, again usually for their children. But the omission endures through generations such that even the good children of heroic parents still themselves partial victims, and that cured slowly over generations.

Trump an example of someone who apparently was taught all wrong things, but without any good at all, so that he did not and does not know what is missing. Not exculpatory of Trump, but to some degree explanatory. That is, his father and mother apparently in each their own way monstrous, producing a monster.

edit: to change a word.

If attention is what he craves, that's exactly what we deny him. Poor sucker. — OneTwoMany

We? You put this out there. Answer the questions.

couldn't agree more. I've seen documentaries of him and family. His older brother left the business as he was apparently opposed to their ways. Ended up taking his life. Meditation helps. So does good company.

that's 'tradition alright. Children are excited over fairytales, dragons, wizards and talking animals, in books or in cartoons. Tbh, some of the cartoons out there now can be terrifying :D

Negative impressions? Life is tough, my friend. Who promised you a picnic? — synthesis

Young, ignorant, stupid - even all three! Nothing in this thread abut promises or picnics; yours then a projection. And if two-cent analysis is worth anything, then yours a massive compensation reaction.

Stop pissing on each other for pissing on each other.

Your are a nothing if you alone. But that's not true;)

I agree. There is a saying 'If you don't enjoy spending time by yourself, you're probably in bad company'.

"What's the biggest lie you were conditioned with"

Intelligence is set.

the immediacy of revelation/self evidence/unmediated cognition. The it "just seems this way to me" brigade vs the wealth of evidence for the self as the internal documents of a vast bodily bureaucracy. — fdrake

Yes.

In fact I'd add 'the self' itself. As in 'true to yourself, 'not being yourself'... As if there were some sacred fixed point from which certain feelings rebelliously deviate.

It is hard to distinguish between lies and misconceptions. I was taught how Mary gave birth to Jesus, as in the virgin birth, and I somehow thought that was how all children were conceived. When children at school told me the facts of life, I refused to believe, until they showed me it in writing, in a book.

The biggest lie? Candidates ...

• caste (i.e. social/class hierarchy)
• gender (i.e. sex roles/hierarchy)
• race (i.e. color/ethnic hierarchy)
• romantic love :yawn:
• non-technological progress (i.e. utopias)
• The Truth (e.g. "the media", "the absolute", "the one")
• moral / just deserts
• ghosts (i.e. souls, disembodied subjects, "afterlife")
• "prayer works" ...
• magic (i.e. magical thinking e.g. "Santa Claus" (for adults aka "God")) ... hope, providence, destiny