• baker
    5.6k
    How about considering that aggressiveness is simply normal for people?

    If meat eating is supposedly normal for people, then so is aggressiveness. It's already considered normal at least in sports and politics, two major areas of human interactions.
  • Judaka
    1.7k

    Aggression is normal, but this thread is about a specific kind of aggression with a specific kind of motivation.


    I ask myself, are they complaining? Are they judging? Are they setting up straw men with inferences about another's argument that were not made?James Riley

    Complaining makes someone weak and judging makes them unwise? Is that right?

    Your story, it's a very fine example of aggression motivated by inference. A community of men who belittle others as a way of demonstrating their manliness, sure, that's the kind of thing I am talking about. I think it's fine if you call "bitching" weak but probably not to say that being weak is to complain, anyway, I feel I can understand you better with this example.

    Your example shows that we're on the same page about the topic of my OP. The men in your example have a hierarchy in their minds, of at least characteristics and aesthetics, their disdain and disgust towards those they view as being in the lower rungs of their hierarchy cements their occupation of the higher rungs. Thus, comes validation, status and the feeling of superiority, if not within their community then in their experience and perception of the world. This is likely a component of what drives them to act as they do because they enjoy that experience. What's important to this process are the feelings they evoke in each other and themselves, that's what is driving them forward - probably.

    To be honest, I am still confused by the discussion revolving around weak/stupid and strong/wise, I don't understand what you're trying to say or where you're coming from. I also don't understand why leading by example and being silent and humble has been brought up. While your example demonstrates that aggression can be in the form of complaining, once again, I think it is confusing to make it sound like aggression is a form of complaining. I never said that Z was complaining, perhaps that is what you thought I was talking about but I didn't use this term.

    We still agree X = weak/stupid, right? Z = my theoretical aggressor, Y = strong/wise.Judaka

    If Z was my theoretical complainer and I understood you to be saying "Z cannot be strong/wise because complainers are weak, therefore Z=X" then I would have had more clarity as to what you were saying. As it stood, I couldn't understand what aggression had to do with being weak/strong and felt you were being unreasonable.

    I don't understand why you're X if you can't convince a buffoon like Trump, as if Trump hasn't ignored very competent, intelligent and accomplished people at every turn?Judaka

    I still don't understand this part, you're faced with a belligerent, arrogant or strong-willed person or group who refuse to be helped or changed. Why do you:
    1) Feel this proves you are weak/stupid
    2) Feel humbled by this?
    3) Feel you should lead by example, refrain from judgement and be silent

    To me, none of these things sound right, especially the first 2. And for the third, aren't you free to express your feelings and criticisms? What is being achieved by being silent?
  • James Riley
    2.9k
    What is being achieved by being silent?Judaka

    Maybe nothing, but we're about to find out.
  • baker
    5.6k
    Aggression is normal, but this thread is about a specific kind of aggression with a specific kind of motivation.Judaka
    Hold on. Are you also saying there is a kind of aggression that doesn't have a specific motivation?
  • Judaka
    1.7k

    No, but this thread is about specific motivation #15 and it's different from #14 and #16
12Next
bold
italic
underline
strike
code
quote
ulist
image
url
mention
reveal
youtube
tweet
Add a Comment

Welcome to The Philosophy Forum!

Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.