Everyday experiences are very different from dreams. Consider, for example, that dreams typically disappear when you wake up, whereas experiences of seeing something when you are awake tend to have a continuous flow and clarity which allows you to further investigate the objects that you see.

I'd say dreams are experiences of things that happen to be on one's mind, such as memories and knowledge of things and emotions.

Yep. That's why we have the word "dream".

I've never understood the dream argument... I barely remember my dreams, and they're always incoherent. People that find that interesting must just already be super fab at having vivid dreams.

Usually when I do have slightly vivid dreams I can remember, they sap out of my memory real fast after a short number of minutes I'm awake.

Been listening to Mark Farina?

I believe dreams are probably the most direct way of exploring the nature of life (and death). Dreams do not have the same sense of temporal duration as do the awake state. Neither do these two states share the same sense of space. The holographic view of the universe which we share in the awake state disappears and what emerges in the dream state is wildly different!

How does this occur?! Why does it occur?! What brings us in and out of these states??!! Can this be analogous to the birth-death cycle? It is an interesting line of inquiry, one which I pursue more and then.

I agree, but there has to be some sort of logical explanation as to why we have new experiences after falling into slumber.

Are there any answers that you have to the questions you have presented? I'd love to hear them.

Are there any answers that you have to the questions you have presented? I'd love to hear them. — GreyScorpio

The dreaded question. I am afraid there is no answer though there is cause to continue to meditate and penetrate the question with some hope of prying some deeper understanding of the nature of life and death.

Heraclitus says that when we are awake we see death, but when we are asleep we see dreams.

Heraclitus also suggests that fellow workers - fellow souls - play in sleep and dreams.

Hamlet's famous soliloquy mediates on the nature of sleep.

Bergson briefly discusses the nature of dreaming in regards to memory.

If the universe is holographic and the brain is the reference wave that reveals the hologram, the the reference wave must change to sense something different within the hologram when it is asleep. Why? How? Maybe in time something will come to me - or to you. The answer most probably lies in the nature of persistent Memory, so Bergson is always a good place to start.

There are a variety of questions. However I can never come to a definite conclusion as to finding out the answers to all of these questions. — GreyScorpio

And you probably never will.

I think for the most part we just dream incoherent nonsense because it is at cognitive level necessary, but on the rare occasion there can be clarity and sense, sometimes even a story that are perhaps representations of past experiences, desires and fears, and sometimes of things that occur later - not in any supernatural sense, but some unconscious cause and effect connection that you were not aware of at conscious level. I find that I dream when I have irregular sleeping patters, for instance, sometimes I sleep early and wake up at 2-3am and then go back to sleep at 5-6am; usually, I find myself remembering a dream during that morning sleep.

Perhaps the best place to begin would be Jung, just be careful that you do not end up as Spinoza wrote in Chapter VI 'Of Miracles' - "The masses then style unusual phenomena "miracles" and part from piety, partly for the sake of opposing the students of science, prefer to remain in ignorance of natural causes, and only hear of those things which they know least." It is up to you to be able to connect the puzzle of a dream to your personal circumstances, which requires a clarity of mind and an openness or honesty.

sometimes I sleep early and wake up at 2-3am and then go back to sleep at 5-6am — TimeLine

That only happens to me when I accidentally fall asleep early haha - then I'm like "umm I didn't just fall asleep without even eating dinner did I? :’( "

I find that I dream when I have irregular sleeping patters — TimeLine

For me I have dreams towards the morning if I do. So say around 5-10AM if we include weekends.

Perhaps the best place to begin would be Jung, just be careful that you do not end up as Spinoza wrote in Chapter VI 'Of Miracles' - "The masses then style unusual phenomena "miracles" and part from piety, partly for the sake of opposing the students of science, prefer to remain in ignorance of natural causes, and only hear of those things which they know least." — TimeLine

>:O >:O >:O

That only happens to me when I accidentally fall asleep early haha - then I'm like "umm I didn't just fall asleep without even eating dinner did I? :’( — Agustino

Far out, some days I'm half dead especially after spending the day at the beach. By mid-afternoon, I wish everyone disappeared and I could be left alone with my green grapes and music. :-d

Far out, some days I'm half dead especially after spending the day at the beach. By mid-afternoon, I wish everyone disappeared and I could be left alone with my green grapes and music. :-d — TimeLine

You're lucky like that, you live close to the beach. I haven't gone to the beach for years :P I'm also more of a mountain person haha, but I don't dislike the beach, just that I never get much of a chance to go.

Anyone else have sleep paralysis?? :-O

Anyone else have sleep paralysis?? :-O — Noble Dust

I sometimes have it, it's a very interesting experience to be honest. Mine happens just when I fall asleep when it does. The feeling is of a great surrounding darkness, and being in the possession of a very large and heavy body that I cannot move despite desiring to move it. It's a feeling of being stuck. Sometimes there also is a sensation of hearing a very sharp noise and not being able to stop it. At first it made me panic quite a bit until I woke up, but then I gained a sort of mastery over it, such that I remain calm throughout when it happens and just watch it out.

Interesting. I get it when waking up. Usually I just become aware that I'm (sort of?) awake, but can't move. I've developed this thing where I mentally "push" outwards until I eventually gain control again and can move. It's strange. I've also had the occasional hallucination or feeling of dread, but it's not as common for me. The worst few experiences have left me with a palpable feeling of fear even after waking, as an adult.

I used to have experiences like that, but not for more than thirty years, I would say. I remember it is as like being dragged down into a dark pit and I used to hear a rumbling or grinding sound. It used to feel as though if I gave into it I would cease to exist, and I would always manage to struggle back up into the light of wakefulness. I sometimes used to fall into that state instead of falling asleep. These days I sometimes fall into a transitional state which is like an obsessive compulsiveness where I keep going over and over something i cannot quite grasp,. I can remember many subliminal images associated with those states even as I type this now; but those images are indistinct and I cannot bring them into anything like sharp focus.

I actually have very vivid memories of many dreams I have had. They always involve bizarre landscapes; outlandish people, situations and places that are nothing like anything I have known in waking life. I have some dreams, usually involving being in crystal clear water in what I can only describe as magical landscapes; deep rivers, beautiful oceans, and the feeling there is of unsurpassed joy, complete and comfortable immersion in beauty and being. These memories are far more vivid that most of my memories of waking life, particularly when it comes to the feelings associated with them.

Interesting. I get it when waking up. Usually I just become aware that I'm (sort of?) awake, but can't move. I've developed this thing where I mentally "push" outwards until I eventually gain control again and can move. It's strange.

Same for me, almost exactly. I've never heard anyone else talk about the 'push' thing, but that's a good way to put it.

Interesting, yeah, I've talked with one other friend in real life who has had the same experience; and for her, it was the same reaction: "you do the "push" thing too???" So strange.

A man once said that when you have a dream you believe it is real up until the moment you awake from it, and this is when your are able understand that it was just a dream. Yet could you not look in the same way of believing this current reality is indeed real, but come the day that you pass on you will then discover that it was also just a dream.

It used to feel as though if I gave into it I would cease to exist, and I would always manage to struggle back up into the light of wakefulness. — John

Interesting - did you ever try to give in to it?

I actually have very vivid memories of many dreams I have had. They always involve bizarre landscapes; outlandish people, situations and places that are nothing like anything I have known in waking life. I have some dreams, usually involving being in crystal clear water in what I can only describe as magical landscapes; deep rivers, beautiful oceans, and the feeling there is of unsurpassed joy, complete and comfortable immersion in beauty and being. These memories are far more vivid that most of my memories of waking life, particularly when it comes to the feelings associated with them. — John

This is again interesting, although personally I've never experienced anything like this. When I do dream (which is very very rare - probably less than once a month) it's always nightmares lol >:O

Interesting - did you ever try to give in to it? — Agustino

No I was always too afraid, because in that irrational half-dream state I always felt it would mean the end of me. I was between the ages of 17 to maybe 21, if I remember right, that this sometimes occurred and I guess it only occurred a total of maybe ten times. Also, I was taking a lot of hallucinogens between 17-19. After that I never experienced it, but have continued to experience the 'obsessive compulsive' half sleep state, and I also sometimes dream restlessly through the night in a kind of obsessive compulsive way, turning over something I can never quite grasp.

It's interesting you say you have nightmares; I rarely do, but apparently , according to my companion I sometimes cry out or 'scream' as she puts it, during sleep. I sometimes wake in what seems to be a panic state with rapid pulse and cold sweat, but not that often and less and less these days. It seems I only remember the good 'magical' dreams; which is probably for the best, I guess.

No I was always too afraid, because in that irrational half-dream state I always felt it would mean the end of me. — John

I sometimes feel similar in mine, but at some point I was just like - "What's the point of opposing?" and there was some opposition left, but I felt detached from it. As in I still opposed, but I didn't want to oppose, and it felt more peaceful that way. Sort of the state where you don't want to die, but yet you know that it isn't in your control anymore, so there is a sort of underlying peace, even while you take note of the opposition which you simply cannot stop.

Also, I was taking a lot of hallucinogens between 17-19. — John

Lol mine started happening after taking anti-psychotics + anti-depressives for a year, and even after I stopped them I still had the episodes, though not as frequent. I still have them nowadays, but they're more rare.

After that I never experienced it, but have continued to experience the 'obsessive compulsive' half sleep state, and I also sometimes dream restlessly through the night in a kind of obsessive compulsive way, turning over something I can never quite grasp. — John

I have another one which may be similar which happens to me whenever I don't sleep for a night, and then go to sleep. I half-wake from sleep still largely unconscious, trying to solve a problem which I cannot solve because it is irrational - it has no solution - a problem which is often related to my activities the day before and is somehow tied to my life. But the problem is very trivial and yet is made irrational by my mind. For example, I used to work in engineering, so when it happened after returning from visiting some friends late at night on a weekend, and going to sleep in the morning, I woke up in that half-awake state after about 1 hour of sleep, got up sweating in absolute fear, while I thought "the beam doesn't fit" - thinking and feeling as if the beam was my body :-O And I was trying to figure out how to make the beam fit lol, as if I was being suffocated by it.

So in a little while my mind clarified a bit more, and I realised that my mind was simply functioning by itself - I had no meta-cognitive sense, and no real awareness of who I was at all - no sense of self, and the mind was desperately trying to grasp after it. I had a vague sense of self I mean - objects weren't very clearly not myself anymore though. So I gave in to it, and waited, doing nothing. I remember in those moments as if I were begging from something to be given, something that could only be given from the outside - I was powerless. And slowly, as if something had been granted to me from outside, the sense of self came back, and things started to clarify - and I felt grateful. I could never identify the cause of the extreme fear and anxiety that I felt, as it was irrational - it had no cause. So my mind couldn't figure out why it felt so anxious, even though it was trying desperately trying to do it. And despite knowing that the fear was irrational - for my mind knew that - it still kept compulsively searching for a cause.

I have another one which may be similar which happens to me whenever I don't sleep for a night, and then go to sleep. I half-wake from sleep still largely unconscious, trying to solve a problem which I cannot solve because it is irrational - it has no solution - a problem which is often related to my activities the day before and is somehow tied to my life. But the problem is very trivial and yet is made irrational by my mind. For example, I used to work in engineering, so when it happened after returning from visiting some friends late at night on a weekend, and going to sleep in the morning, I woke up in that half-awake state after about 1 hour of sleep, got up sweating in absolute fear, while I thought "the beam doesn't fit" - thinking and feeling as if the beam was my body :-O And I was trying to figure out how to make the beam fit lol, as if I was being suffocated by it.

So in a little while my mind clarified a bit more, and I realised that my mind was simply functioning by itself - I had no meta-cognitive sense, and no real awareness of who I was at all - no sense of self, and the mind was desperately trying to grasp after it. I had a vague sense of self I mean - objects weren't very clearly not myself anymore though. So I gave in to it, and waited, doing nothing. I remember in those moments as if I were begging from something to be given, something that could only be given from the outside - I was powerless. And slowly, as if something had been granted to me from outside, the sense of self came back, and things started to clarify - and I felt grateful. I could never identify the cause of the extreme fear and anxiety that I felt, as it was irrational - it had no cause. So my mind couldn't figure out why it felt so anxious, even though it was trying desperately trying to do it. And despite knowing that the fear was irrational - for my mind knew that - it still kept compulsively searching for a cause. — Agustino

I have no idea what you two are talking about, but I just imagined you were talking about your penis, here.

LOL Why my penis?! :-O

YOU CAN GO BY YOUR SENSES

You will know that you are awake when you know your senses are sensing the physical world. You will have to test it, but hopefully not against something in the real world that may annihilate you during the test (like standing in the path of an oncoming high-speed train). Try walking into a wall, that should suffice as a 'sense test' (you 'see' the wall, but is it 'really there'? Then you test it.).