If Palestinian children (of "David") are valid targets, then Israeli children (of "Goliath") also must be valid targets. — 180 Proof
Then you've quite clearly not paid attention. — Benkei
If murdering Palestinian children is permitted then obviously the murder of Israeli children works be too or Dutch ones for that matter. — Benkei
In your failure to condemn Israel — Benkei
a) The murder of Palestinian children is not permitted. 180 took one statement out of context. — BitconnectCarlos
b) Even if the intentional murder of palestinian children was condoned by the Israeli government (which would obviously make the Israeli government illegitimate and evil) even then the intentional murder of Israeli children would remain a deep moral crime. — BitconnectCarlos
At no point where 5-year old children of Nazis "valid targets." — BitconnectCarlos
But it quite clearly is. Every time the "right to self defence" is exercised by killing children as "collateral damage". — Benkei
Said the same guy defending killing Palestinian children as collateral damage. — Benkei
Tellingly, you only partially quote me, leaving out my reference to the Torah. Of course, fascists like you violently misappropriate your own heritage as you seek to colonize and steal the heritage of those in your way (i.e. lebensraum = settler occupation of so-called "Greater Israel").Yeah, this was all I needed to hear. — BitconnectCarlos
You speak only for "my oppressor-regime right or wrong" Zion-Nazis – hell yeah, I'm their / your "enemy" – and clearly not for "the Jewish People". Unlike you, jackboot-licker, I'm no more an "enemy" of Jews (or Israel) than Antifascism Zionists such as Martin Buber, Abraham Heschel, Hannah Arendt, Elie Wiesel & Noam Chomsky who've informed and still inspire my opposition to your racist, reactionary, ideology. Get the fuck over your shitty self, BC.As long as you believe this you're an enemy of the Jewish people and I'm not engaging with you.
Unlike you, I've never left. It's (US-backed) Israeli apartheid, ethnic cleasing, oppression which is, in theory & practice, barbarism that has slipped the leash of "civilization".If you feel like re-joiningcivilization or moralityat some point let me know.
Yes, 'civilian killing prohibitions' obtain in "wars" between state-militaries but "the rules of war" have never obtained during insurgencies (i.e. armed liberation struggles on shared / disputed territory) of Occupied peoples against Occupier regimes and their constituents. IDF-Mossad terrorism produces (incentivizes) Hamas (Arab) terrorism; the latter have nothing to lose (but subjugated lives) and the former have everything to gain (from the US Treasury & Pentagon), and so the self-cannibalizing cycle grinds on. Israel's savage, terrorist, oppression justifies resistance of the oppressed Palestinian people "by any means necessary", including terrorism. :fire:Collateral damage is an inevitability of war and not the same thing morally as intentional murder. — BitconnectCarlos
Israel's savage, violent, oppression justifies resistance of the oppressed Palestinian people "by any means necessary", including terrorism. — 180 Proof
If collateral damage has moral equivalence to intentional murder then FDR and Churchill are basically Hitler. Virtually every government that has ever been at war for whatever reason is evil and illegitimate. — BitconnectCarlos
If collateral damage has moral equivalence to intentional murder then FDR and Churchill are basically Hitler. Virtually every government that has ever been at war for whatever reason is evil and illegitimate.— BitconnectCarlos
Collective punishment is an inflamed scar that runs across the entire 53-year-old Israeli occupation of Palestine. Over these years, two million Palestinians in Gaza have endured a comprehensive air, sea and land blockade since 2007, several thousand Palestinian homes have been punitively demolished, extended curfews have paralyzed entire towns and regions, the bodies of dead Palestinians have been withheld from their families, and critical civilian supplies – including food, water and utilities – have been denied at various times. Notwithstanding numerous resolutions, reports and reminders critical of its use, Israel continues to rely upon collective punishment as a prominent instrument in its coercive toolbox of population control.
A fundamental tenet of any legal system – domestic and international – which respects the rule of law is the principle that the innocent cannot be punished for the crimes of others. A corollary of this tenet is that the collective punishment of communities or groups of peoples for offences committed by individuals is absolutely prohibited under modern law. Individual responsibility is the cornerstone of any rights-based legal order, as explained by Hugo Grotius, the 17th century Dutch legal philosopher: “No one who is innocent of wrong may be punished for the wrong done by another.”
Throughout history and in contemporary times, belligerent armies, colonial authorities and occupying powers have commonly employed a spectrum of collective punishment methods against civilian populations hostile to their alien rule. The methods used have included civilian executions, sustained curfews and closures of towns, food confiscation and starvation, punitive property destruction, the capture of hostages, economic closures on civilian populations, cutting off of power and water supplies, withholding of medical supplies, collective fines and mass detentions. These punishments are, in the words of the International Committee of the Red Cross (“ICRC”), “in defiance of the most elementary
principles of humanity.”
The logic of collective punishment has been to project domination in order to subdue a subjugated population through inflicting a steep price for its resistance to alien rule. Punishment has been imposed on civilian populations for practices ranging from having knowledge of fighters and refugees in the vicinity, to offering passive opposition and noncooperation, and to merely being related to, or neighbours of, resistance fighters. Yet, not only are these punitive acts profoundly unjust, they invariably backfire on the military authority, as the 1958 commentary by the ICRC on the Fourth Geneva Convention stated:
Far from achieving the desired effect such practices, by reason of their excessive severity and cruelty, kept alive and strengthened the spirit of resistance. They strike at guilty and innocent alike. They are opposed to all principles based on humanity and justice, and it is for that reason that the prohibition of collective penalties is followed formally by the prohibition of all measures of intimidation or terrorism with regard to protected persons. — UN 15 July 2020 report
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.