Yes, humanity has become more compassionate. — Hello Human

:sweat: :sweat: Phew!

But when it comes to individual living non-human beings, there doesn't seem to be any change, even though there are far more non-human living beings than human beings. — Hello Human

You can't have it both ways, you know. Either there's been change (for the better :sweat: :sweat: ) or no such change is discernible. I don't blame you though - it gets really weird sometimes, oh well, most of the time.

They are not cruel, they're just carnivorous. — Hello Human

A distinction without a difference, friend. If killing is cruel, necessarily dolphins are cruel. Again, you can't have it both ways.

So, I don't think intelligence makes living beings more compassionate. — Hello Human

Morality = Reason

Life can't on the one hand be all about perpetuation (saving) and on the other hand be about extermination (killing)! It doesn't make sense.

Perhaps, life is trying to eat the cake and have it too! I'm much relieved!

If killing is cruel, necessarily dolphins are cruel — TheMadFool

Of course killing is wrong, so you could say that dolphins do is wrong.

However, saying they are cruel is different. Cruelty is the act of killing for pleasure. However, dolphins kill for food, not pleasure.

Of course killing is wrong, so you could say that dolphins do is wrong. — Hello Human

However, saying they are cruel is different. Cruelty is the act of killing for pleasure. However, dolphins kill for food, not pleasure. — Hello Human

Why is it wrong but not cruel?

I'll set up a scenario for you. You're the good guy! Yaay!

Imagine yourself walking on the sandy dunes of a desert somewhere, deep in thought, pondering upon this very issue we're discussing.

Suddenly, your foot hits something. You look down and you see a bottle with its neck sticking out. You pick it up and curious you open it. Suddenly, out of the bottle emerges a genie and he says, "what is your wish, master?"

You've been worried to bits about cruelty, wrong, to name a few. This is my chance, you tell yourself. You look the genie in the eye and say, "I want <some things> to end." My best guess is that the list of some things will include, among other things, cruelty for sure but...wait for it...also dolphins killing for food.

My question is, why are these two items - cruelty & dolphins hunting for food - on the same list?

My question is, why are these two items - cruelty & dolphins hunting for food - on the same list? — TheMadFool

Because they're both wrong ?

Because they're both wrong ? — Hello Human

Exactly! You're under the impression that there's a distinction and even if there were one, it didn't matter to your decision - both were on the same list of things you wish you could wish away or make disappear with a wave of a magic wand!

'Cause you're not one of "the
quickest". :joke:

Like anything, figure the resources and labor hours plus the time value of money until completion. I could cost out what it would take to create a forest.

Cause you're not one of "the
quickest". :joke: — 180 Proof

:grin: It sucks to be at the bottom of the food chain!

Since Antiquity, multiple philosophers and religions like Shinto have speculated on the value of nature. Some think that nature only has instrumental value, others think that all of nature has intrinsic value.

So, what do you think the answer is? Does nature have any value, whether it is instrumental or intrinsic? — Hello Human

Everything exists because of and in nature. Everything we use has been derived from nature. Nature can live without us (us, who in our arrogance think we can judge/measure it), not vice versa. That ought to rest the case.

Del

:up:

Well it seemed to have created you, this discussion, and the whole of human history. So the odds aren't looking so great.