Death is the only god.

Def: God - that to which one devotes one's life. — unenlightened

Re: (every) event horizon.

The energy loss is only apparent because the distances between the rishons in our galaxy don't expand along. — Prishon

Yeah this is the line of thinking I was taking but I wasn’t able to articulate it as well as you

Death is the only god.
Def: God - that to which one devotes one's life.
— unenlightened
Re: (every) event horizon. — 180 Proof

:up:

I like that idea even though it's kinda like raining on my parade, well, half-a-parade actually.

They had a name for it - phonophobia - and it was a nightmare. Even the slightest sounds gave me the jitters; loud noises and panic attacks. I decided to build a sound-proof room in my house which would serve as a sanctuary, a place to escape from the cacophony that was the world and so I did. I walked into the room with high expectations, closed the door - the silence was deafening! — Some Guy

That which you hate and run away from (death) is that which you love and run towards (God).

The eternal existence that is, is existence. It is not that God exists as if existence is a property of God. God and existence are the same thing. Existence always is. The question about God is whether existence is intelligent, conscious, sentient. If it is it is what we traditionally refer to as God. What we call energy is existence/God.

Death is the only god.
Def: God - that to which one devotes one's life. — 180 Proof

So one devotes their life to feath?

So one devotes their life to [d]eath? — Prishon

No. One devotes one's death to life. At birth we are old enough to die, delivered from the womb in free-fall towards that event horizon. Each breath, every heartbeat, is irretrievably one less breath and one less heartbeat to come – another grain of sand that falls in the hourglass. How do we seek to spend the time left to us? How do we make the most of today, this here and now? This devotion, I think, matters most.

It’s interesting when one places living on the trophy case, denotes being alive as a state more precious than death.

Why ought we treat the state of being alive with such reverence? It stands to reason that this sort of I guess “favouritism” so to speak, lends itself to an inherent fear of death, a fear of the inevitable “coming in at second best” -being dead.

Many philosophies see an indifference or apathy towards death as a triumph, a liberation, for in the state of total lack of bias one is free from the burden of navigating their distaste surrounding ones obvious mortality.

Death is required, it is natural, it is price of emerging into awareness, and when suffering, death is even welcome, beckoned forth. You don’t suffer in death. It wasn’t painful to not yet exist nor will it be when we return to dust.

In my experience reflecting on death in this way is incredibly helpful. It is one of the most powerful transformations a living thing can undergo - to plummet from the heights of a life long construction of self identity into pure oblivion.

It doesn’t negate the beauty of living but simply frames it truthfully. It takes the pressure off one trying to “maximise” on every moment, to make every moment spent living worthwhile.

Because at the end of the day a lot of living is about doing very little, being insignificant, being unproductive, “wasting” time. But it’s only a waste if there is this compulsion based on the unequal weighting of the importance of life verses death.

I think it’s okay to live a life where you made very little impact. Because ultimately when all is said and done, no one, not even the greatest legends will be remembered. We will all be lost to time. It stops for no man.

Ah! Now its clear what you meant by the event horizon. I had no idea what you meant. Excuse my spelling. On phone. Isnt their a life after the event horizon?

I agree. Besides, wasting time whenever we can is the only adequate reply to time wasting us.

:death: :flower:

The event horizon is the point of no return from beyond which no information can be received; that is, it's only ever approached but never reached alive.

God and existence are the same thing. — EnPassant

I’m inclined to agree. When one steps back from daily life and really dives into the state of simply being and “knowing it”, to just exist as this strange phenomenon that has a sense of being... it’s quite undefinable. Language doesn’t muster to potency required to encapsulate it.

When I think of “god” I cannot conceive of something more powerful, more brilliant and clever, than being a “self”. The fact that the universe is capable of producing such a state just blows my mind. The fact that matter and energy can have its very own personal sense of agency - that to me is the most intelligent thing one can appreciate.

We all hit the jackpot with being manifested as sentient beings. But it only feels as such when one truly acknowledges that they are a system that collapses... and resumes a phase of non-being. The wonder is in the transformation, the contrast between inanimate and animate.

We all hit the jackpot with being manifested as sentient beings . — Benj96

Good luck convincing antinatalists of that. :smirk:

Haha. Well diversity is the spice of life. I can understand their sentiments. But for me life is brief and death is long standing if you consider the ratio of living to dead matter in the universe. And if I know death is waiting for me, why not play around and have fun while one can hold the notion of these endeavours.
I’m not saying I prefer life per se, but “when in rome...” *shrug*

The event horizon is point of no return from beyond which no information can be received; that is, only ever approached but never reached alive. — 180 Proof

It depends on the hole. If its big enough you can easily fall in. You end up in a region where time stands still only according to distant observers. If you managed to get out (which is only possible by evaporation...) you would be young while the universe is old. Someone falling in 123567656 years from now you could actually meet.

But for me life is brief and death is long standing if you consider the ratio of living to dead matter in the universe — Benj96

When you reincarnate in a following big bang death takes 0 time.

God and existence are the same thing — EnPassant

Of course not. God created existence.

true. Assuming reincarnation (which I imagine is harmonious with the laws of physics - when energy and matter on a habitable planet is limited and therefore must be recycled) it stands to reason that death being a state of “no record, no accountancy” means that death and birth are instantaneous... that the time elapsed between them for something sentient is for all purposes null

Of course not. God created existence. — Prishon

That depends on how you define existence. I am using to word to signify that which is; the eternal positive that is just there. In the beginning there is existence which is God. Existence becomes being, life.

Existence cannot be a property of something, even God. Assume X has the property 'existence'. Now ask; does X, as a distinct entity, exist? There are two answers-

1. X exists. If it does existence as a property of X is superfluous because X exists anyhow, whence X is existence.

2. X does not exist. It is incoherent to say a non existent X has properties, least of all the property of existence.

Therefore existence is not a property. Therefore existence is God. But existence has properties; star, planet, chair, tree...

So existence includes God?

So existence includes God? — Prishon

Existence is God. If God and existence are separate things then God is not existence so how can God exist? If God exists God and existence are one thing. Existence becomes. It evolves into life and being which is more than existence. A rock exists, a bird has life and being.

If existence is not a property of God then how can they be the same?

A rock exists, a bird has life and being. — EnPassant

A rock has life and being potentially in it. God merely created the stuff from which stones and birds are made. He was outside the world of being and existence. Not a part of it. They created the world in their image. Not their essence. If he did then we would be the same as God. But we are not the same as them. We are no gods.

A rock has life and being potentially in it. God merely created the stuff from which stones and birds are made. He was outside the world of being and existence. Not a part of it. They created the world in their image. Not their essence. If he did then we would be the same as God. But we are not the same as them. We are no gods. — Prishon

We are new creations because we are properties of existence/God. Our essence is God, our being is created. This is what is meant by 'In Him we live and move and have our being'. We inherit our existence from God. God's existence and ours is the same thing. Everything that is shares God's existence. We become created beings. Suppose bronze is existence. Bronze can be formed in the shape of a bird. The bird is created, the bronze is.

We are new creations because we are properties of existence/God. Our essence is God, our being is created. This is what is meant by 'In Him we live and move and have our being'. We inherit our existence from God. God's existence and ours is the same thing. Everything that is shares God's existence. We become created beings. Suppose bronze is existence. Bronze can be formed in the shape of a bird. The bird is created, the bronze is. — EnPassant

We are no properties of existence. We are the stuff we are made of. And they created it.

Bronze is the stuff. It can be in the form of a bird but its non-living stuff. A real bird is made of the same stuff as the bird. But a bird experiences all the (magical, unexplainable) content of matter. The essence. Only god can explain the essence. We merely experience it.

Energy has to be the most enigmatic phenomenon in the universe. — Benj96

I just can’t think of any property that trumps energy when it comes to defining an all encompassing entity of existence. — Benj96

I agree. That's why I developed the philosophical notion of EnFormAction, to encompass the enigmatic properties of Energy, and the all-encompassing ubiquity of Information. But, when I reluctantly refer to the implicit Omnipotent Enformer behind EFA by name, I spell it G*D, to indicate that I'm not talking about any traditional religious notion of a humanoid deity. Instead, it's more like the "Prime Mover" of Aristotle, or the "Universal Substance" of Spinoza. :cool:

EnFormAction :
Ententional Causation. A proposed metaphysical law of the universe that causes random interactions between forces and particles to produce novel & stable arrangements of matter & energy. It’s the creative force (aka : Divine Will) of the axiomatic eternal deity that, for unknown reasons, programmed a Singularity to suddenly burst into our reality from an infinite source of possibility. AKA : The creative power of Evolution; the power to enform; Logos; Change.
http://blog-glossary.enformationism.info/page8.html

EnFormAction :
* Metaphorically, it's the Will-power of G*D, which is the First Cause of everything in creation. Aquinas called the Omnipotence of God the "Primary Cause", so EFA is the general cause of everything in the world. Energy, Matter, Gravity, Life, Mind are secondary creative causes, each with limited application.
* All are also forms of Information, the "difference that makes a difference". It works by directing causation from negative to positive, cold to hot, ignorance to knowledge. That's the basis of mathematical ratios (Greek "Logos", Latin "Ratio" = reason). A : B :: C : D. By interpreting those ratios we get meaning and reasons.
* The concept of a river of causation running through the world in various streams has been interpreted in materialistic terms as Momentum, Impetus, Force, Energy, etc, and in spiritualistic idioms as Will, Love, Conatus, and so forth. EnFormAction is all of those.
http://blog-glossary.enformationism.info/page8.html


Enformationism :
* As a scientific paradigm, the thesis of Enformationism is intended to be an update to the obsolete 19th century paradigm of Materialism. Since the recent advent of Quantum Physics, the materiality of reality has been watered down. Now we know that matter is a form of energy, and that energy is a form of Information.
* As a religious philosophy, the creative power of Enformationism is envisioned as a more realistic version of the antiquated religious notions of Spiritualism. Since our world had a beginning, it's hard to deny the concept of creation. So, an infinite deity is proposed to serve as both the energetic Enformer and the malleable substance of the enformed world.
http://blog-glossary.enformationism.info/page8.html

In a pantheistic sense, yes - looks suspiciously like the prime mover. In a theistic sense, no - energy isn't sentient, it doesn't think nor does it feel.

energy isn't sentient, it doesn't think nor does it feel. — TheMadFool

It doesnt indeed. But what's the Nature of mass/energy? You can view mass/energy as point-lke (or a Planck sized 4d sphere, like a circle on a tiny curved cilinder), but what is it. What,s that particle carrying besides charges?

. A proposed metaphysical law of the universe that causes random interactions between forces and particles to produce novel & stable arrangements of matter & energy. It’s the creative force (aka : Divine Will) of the axiomatic eternal deity that, for unknown reasons, programmed a Singularity to suddenly burst into our reality from an infinite source of possibility — Gnomon

Very interesting proposition. I too have considered a similar thread of thought in the past. The way I see it is with 2 assumptions:

Assumption one: energy must cause change. It is a fundamental property of energy.
Assumption 2: the “singularity” is a uniform/ homogenous origin state.

Logically then, the only possibility for a singularity is therefore to become “un-single” ie. internally “divide” into two or more properties. Because change cannot occur in a single state. What would it change into if it remains the same all the time? Change requires an A and a B.

How the singularity first changed is a bit difficult to determine for me. It’s a bit of a which came first: energy, time, space or matter?

Assuming that the singularity is some form of “proto- energy” or “potential to act” then one would imagine time and energy must begin simultaneously as one of the first “divisions” of this “prime mover/ universal substance”.

Logically then, the only possibility for a singularity is therefore to become “un-single” ie. internally “divide” into two or more properties. Because change cannot occur in a single state. What would it change into if it remains the same all the time? Change requires an A and a B. — Benj96

Very true. There wasn't a point-like singularity in the beginning though. There was a Planck-sized accumulation of quantum fields fluctuating (virtual particles, to make it popular scientific visible). This tiny ball (of which the accompanying real particles are 4dimensional spatial spheres wrapped up on a rolled up 5dimensional space) expands on a 4dimensional infinite space. The virtual particles (the field fluctuations) get real after expanding on this fixed space (which, in 2d, has the form of a cut-open torus with a Planck-sized mouth). The fluctuations accelerate away from each other, around the Planck-sized mouth) from each other to become real particles, or better, to become field excitations interacting by gauge field fluctuations.

Assuming that the singularity is some form of “proto- energy” or “potential to act” then one would imagine time and energy must begin simultaneously as one of the first “divisions” of this “prime mover/ universal substance”. — Benj96

In my metaphorical model of "The Singularity", which is basically a mathematical ellipsis . . . . meaning whatever happens beyond this point in incalculable and unknowable, it's the point-source of all that follows the Big Bang, including Space & Time.

However, in my Information-based thesis, I imagine the Singularity as a computer program, that occupies no space or time, but is only Potential, until someone hits Enter. Instead of a magnetic tape or disk, the Singularity is recorded on a "mathematical point". From that point forward, the program begins to calculate Actuality from Potentiality. And that potential may be your "proto-energy", which I label EnFormAction in my thesis.. "En-" stands for Energy (power) ; "-Form-" is mental & physical objects that are meaningful to a mind ; and "-Action" is Causation or Creation. So, EnFormAction is the power to create both physical (material objects) and metaphysical (mental or mathematical objects) Forms, things we can sense & think about. The bottom line is that the Big Bang created our on-going evolving world literally from Scratch. So, it is literally the First Cause. But where did the Information encoded in the Singularity come from? Who was the Programmer? That's where we begin to do some serious speculation about what's out there beyond Space & Time . . . . the Ellipsis. :smile:


Point :
In classical Euclidean geometry, a point is a primitive notion that models an exact location in the space, and has no length, width, or thickness
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Point_(geometry)

from scratch :
from the very beginning, especially without utilizing or relying on any previous work for assistance.
____Oxford

Ellipsis :
an intentional or unavoidable gap in information

Assumption one: energy must cause change. It is a fundamental property of energy.
Assumption 2: the “singularity” is a uniform/ homogenous origin state.
Logically then, the only possibility for a singularity is therefore to become “un-single” ie. internally “divide” into two or more properties. — Benj96

Yes. Metaphorically, I think of the Singularity as an atom of Uranium undergoing fission. Unlike an atomic bomb though (the Big Bang), this ongoing division & distinction and aggregation & integration is not destructive, but constructive : building a world. It releases Energy, but in a prolonged self-controlled and self-organizing process. Hence, like a fertilized egg, it begins to divide from one into two, and thence into a multi-cellular organism. So, the key to such positive change is the act of Fertilization, which I liken to an input of teleological Information, as in programming a cybernetic system. That fertilizing "sperm" is what I call EnFormAction, the power to cause transformation and complexification. :nerd:


EnFormAction :
the creative power to enform; to cause transformations from one form to another.
1. As the generic power of creation (Big Bang, Singularity), it turns eternal Potential into temporal Actual, it transforms Platonic Forms into physical Things.
2. As physical energy (Causation), it is the power to cause changes in material structure.
3. As condensed energy (Matter), it is light speed vibrations slowed down to more stable states.
4. As animating energy (elan vital, Chi), it is the power to cause complex matter to self-move.
5. As mental energy (Consciousness; knowing), it is the power to store & process incoming information as meaning relative to self.
6. As self-awareness (Self-consciousness; Will-Power), it is the power to make intentional changes to self and environment.
7. As the holistic expression of the human Self (Soul), it is the essence or pattern that defines you as a person (Chi, Spirit).
http://bothandblog2.enformationism.info/page29.html

Cybernetics is a transdisciplinary and "antidisciplinary" approach concerned with regulatory and purposive systems—their structures, constraints, ...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cybernetics

The term cybernetic system has a clear quantitative definition. It is a system that dynamically matches acquired information to selected actions relative to a computational issue that defines the essential purpose of the system or machine. This notion requires that information and control be further quantified.
https://aip.scitation.org/doi/abs/10.1063/1.1477068?journalCode=apc