Buber’s had a lasting effect on me. And Heschel…. Never heard of him. Any books of his that you recommend? As far as Catholic ethics go I really think the church has gone away from the eudaemonistic model (i.e. virtue ethics). I mean just look at the problems amongst the clergy. There is no virtue.



I think you make a healthy criticism. I really like that line; “A teaching for dying in the monastery but not for living amongst strangers.”

And Heschel…. Never heard of him. Any books of his that you recommend? — Dermot Griffin

Man is Not Alone
God in Search of Man
Who is Man

A solution which has yet to really work. Thomas Merton never gets taught during lessons on the civil rights era because he never actively participated in it like an MLK or Malcolm X did. Merton’s solution, the Benedictine conversio morum, I think is very applicable today. Maybe it wouldn’t have worked back then because there was a time where racist policies and such were institutionalized here in America but I think we’ve come a long way from that. There are still issues, of course, but a change in the individual person I wholeheartedly think is necessary before we even get to dialogue between the political left and the political right. Just my thoughts!

I dunno, maybe we are on a somewhat different wavelength, I wasn't really referring to any kind of monasticism at all. The point or problem, as I see it, is precisely not found in any kind of individual solution or orientation, but rather a lack of direction that is shared or communal if you will. This doesn't even have to be transcendental, religious or even political, just that people apparently have a need to feel part of some greater whole, on whatever scale that may be.

Capitalism and liberalism seem to have pushed individuation to the extreme so that there doesn't seem to be anything shared left at all. I think we are social cultural beings, are evolved to function that way, and are incomplete without some social, cultural sphere wherein we are raised and can thrive.

“Instead of hating the people you think are war-makers, hate the appetites and disorder in your own soul, which are the causes of war. If you love peace, then hate injustice, hate tyranny, hate greed - but hate these things in yourself, not in another.” — Dermot Griffin

:grin:

It’s what the man said. I hear so many people say “Love peace and hate injustice, hate tyranny, hate greed” but they don’t actually do any kind of self-reflection on how to realize these things in themselves and change them.



I totally agree with you. We do lack direction as a society and there are so many different solutions to the problem. Capitalism and liberalism when taken to the utmost extreme almost create an egoism of “Mine, mine, mine.” We forget that there are other people out there. When Marx wrote his 1844 Manuscripts he was criticizing a kind of nasty capitalism where a lot of corporate businessmen were cutthroat people. But times have changed. Capitalism may not be perfect but it is the only way to run a free society. We just need to watch out for the cutthroats!

Capitalism may not be perfect but it is the only way to run a free society. — Dermot Griffin

Why do you think that? Sure, maybe you could say there were some failed non-capitalist experiments, but 'only way' seems a bit definitive.

Also, is freedom then the only, or the highest value, to which a societal organisation should be evaluated?