The "rituals of bottle washing"? And the liturgy of the lecture hall and the Eucharist examination? Heh, heh....I don't think so. If so, then everything is religion. Washing my dog. Ah, the soapy....baptism? — Constance
What I haven’t figured out yet is whether that strikes you as a negative thing about the concept or just an observation to be shared with others. — Ennui Elucidator
Seems to me that there is a failure here to acknowledge the piety of the scientist, their subservience to a greater being. Take care not to be indulging in special pleading. — Banno
What?
The knight of faith does not doubt his understanding of god. He "standing before the world with the presumption of certainty." — Banno
Not that I agree that you have to be religious to understand religion, but I do think that explication devoid of purpose makes it harder to get at what I think you believe underpins “defintions”: how you use the word. Knowledge that vs. knowledge how, perhaps. The people in the article were using religion to an end and they found the use useful (as, perhaps, did other members of their language community).It's interesting that the struggle to explicate the concept leads to so many places. — Banno
. Then I would ask what you mean by great, for in this lies something beyond the science as science, just as there is more to the hymnals, solemn music, symbols, etc., of practiced religion. — Constance
...the faith of Abraham... — Constance
Faith is "standing before the world with the presumption of knowing."
— Banno
That is not Kierkegaardian faith, of course.
as if the rejection of scientism leads folk to the rejection of science as a profound human enterprise. — Banno
When that is transposed to the domain of philosophy it is not only ‘scientism’ that results. That is what I think that TLP passage is driving at. — Wayfarer
It's pretty clear he is talking about treating the laws of nature as logical necessities in that section.
So I am not sure that the context supports your interpretation. — Banno
It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists.
The experience that we need in order to understand logic is not that something or other is the state of things, but that something is: that, however, is not experience.
To say 'I wonder at such and such being the case' has only sense if I can imagine it not to be the case. In this sense one can wonder at the existence of, say, a house when one sees it and has not visited it for a long time and has imagined that it had been pulled down in the meantime. But it is nonsense to say that I wonder at the existence of the world, because I cannot imagine it not existing. I could of course wonder at the world round me being as it is. If for instance I had this experience while looking into the blue sky, I could wonder at the sky being blue as opposed to the case when it's clouded. But that's not what I mean. I am wondering at the sky being whatever it is. One might be tempted to say that what I am wondering at is a tautology, namely at the sky being blue or not blue. But then it's just nonsense to say that one is wondering at a tautology.
...
At the basis of the whole modern view of the world lies the illusion that the so-called laws of nature are the explanations of natural phenomena. So people stop short at natural laws as at something unassailable, as did the ancients at God and Fate. And they both are right and wrong.
Implying that the religious situation is no more than a realization of one's lack of cunning? But then, the term "supernatural" just gives religion a bad name, which it usually deserves. But the reality of religion lies outside of the cunning and the supernatural. It is something else. — Constance
Positivism — Wayfarer
The question which for me is central to the thread is now why science does not count as a religion, given these anchors. — Banno
Oh, sure. So what is the more...?
Can you tell me? If not, don't ask me to tell you wheat the "greater" is in science. Let's just agree to a revert silence. — Banno
But that is exactly what Kierkegaard says Abraham did. Despite all else telling him not to sacrifice Isaac, he follows through on his certainty - "standing before the world with the presumption of knowing".
Faith is believing despite the evidence. — Banno
Faith is believing despite the evidence — Banno
Why would you think that "it is something else"? Have you read/seen the Mahabharata? I recommend it, with subtitles of course. Opens up a new window on god(s). — Agent Smith
So the candidates for an anchor that seem most promising are ritual, transcendent hierarchies and longing.
The question which for me is central to the thread is now why science does not count as a religion, given these anchors. — Banno
àn ultimate scientific explanation. — Haglund
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.